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But somewhat thought provoking. Bring the flames, bring the funk.

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Thoughtful point of view The Democrat Party has become the Lawyers' Party. Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton are lawyers. Bill Clinton and Michelle Obama are lawyers. John Edwards, the other former Democrat candidate for president, is a lawyer, and so is his wife, Elizabeth. Every Democrat nominee since 1984 went to law school (although Gore did not graduate). Every Democrat vice presidential nominee since 1976, except for Lloyd Bentsen, went to law school. Look at the Democrat Party in Congress: the Majority Leader in each house is a lawyer. The Republican Party is different. President Bush and Vice President Cheney were not lawyers, but businessmen. The leaders of the Republican Revolution were not lawyers. Newt Gingrich was a history professor; Tom Delay was an exterminator; and, Dick Armey was an economist. House Minority Leader Boehner was a plastic manufacturer, not a lawyer. The former Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist is a heart surgeon. Who was the last Republican president who was a lawyer? Gerald Ford, who left office 31 years ago and who barely won the Republican nomination as a sitting president, running against Ronald Reagan in 1976. The Republican Party is made up of real people doing real work. The Democrat Party is made up of lawyers. Democrats mock and scorn men who create wealth, like Bush and Cheney, or who heal the sick, like Frist, or who immerse themselves in history, like Gingrich. The Lawyers' Party sees these sorts of people, who provide goods and services that people want, as the enemies of America. And, so we have seen the procession of official enemies, in the eyes of the Lawyers' Party, grow. Against whom do Hillary and Obama rail? Pharmaceutical companies, oil companies, hospitals, manufacturers, fast food restaurant chains, large retail businesses, bankers, and anyone producing anything of value in our nation. This is the natural consequence of viewing everything through the eyes of lawyers. Lawyers solve problems by successfully representing their clients, in this case the American people. Lawyers seek to have new laws passed, they seek to win lawsuits, they press appellate courts to overturn precedent, and lawyers always parse language to favor their side. Confined to the narrow practice of law, that is fine. But it is an awful way to govern a great nation. When politicians as lawyers begin to view some Americans as clients and other Americans as opposing parties, then the role of the legal system in our life becomes all-consuming. Some Americans beco me 'adverse parties' of our very government. We are not all litigants in some vast social class-action suit. We are citizens of a republic that promises us a great deal of freedom from laws, from courts, and from lawyers. Today, we are drowning in laws; we are contorted by judicial decisions; we are driven to distraction by omnipresent lawyers in all parts of our once private lives. America has a place for laws and lawyers, but that place is modest and reasonable, not vast and unchecked. When the most important decision for our next president is whom he will appoint to the Supreme Court, the role of lawyers and the law in America is too big. When lawyers use criminal prosecution as a continuation of politics by other means, as happened in the lynching of Scooter Libby and Tom Delay, then the power of lawyers in America is too great. When House Democrats sue America in order to hamstring our efforts to learn what our enemies are planning to do to us, then the role of litigation in America has become crushing. We cannot expect the Lawyers' Party to provide real change, real reform, or real hope in America. Most Americans know that a republic in which every major government action must be blessed by nine unelected judges is not what Washington intended in 1789. Most Americans grasp that we cannot fight a war when ACLU lawsuits snap at the heels of our defenders. Most Americans intuit that more lawyers and judges will not restore declining moral values or spark the spirit of enterprise in our economy. Perhaps Americans will understand that change cannot be brought to our nation by those lawyers who already largely dictate American society and business. Perhaps Americans will see that hope does not come from the mouths of lawyers but from personal dreams nourished by hard work. Perhaps Americans will embrace the truth that more lawyers with more power will only make our problems worse.

For anyone wondering, this ridiculous tripe came from the American Thinker blog, often used as material on the Rush Limbaugh Show. For more on Rush Limbaugh see this and this.

Here is a nice clip of Al Franken explaining some other places Limbaugh gets his facts. (Franken's best selling book, Lies And the Lying Liars Who Tell Them, available now.)

The article, was written by Bruce Walker. So was this:

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No crimes of Judeo-Christians remotely approaches the holocausts of Aztecs, Japanese, Nazis, atheist Russia or atheist Japan. Why? Because all religions are not the same. Some religions are good and some religions are bad. Almost every single movement or belief which we now consider good originated in Christianity or Judaism. http://www.americanthinker.com/2007...s_delusion.html

He also wrote this, arguing, as far as I can tell, against equality of women, and suggesting that women are mentally inferior.

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If sexual roles define how other species live, then why is Homo sapiens any different? If human societies which have had no contact with each other all are constructed around sexual differentiation of roles, then how can that be the product of anything except natural forces? Yet sociologists, psychologists, and a whole host of other �scientists� have solemnly told us that a �Vast Patriarchal Conspiracy� (not unlike Hillary�s Vast Right Wing Conspiracy) have warped every singled major human civilization. Never mind that standardized test scores have consistently shown that boys and girls have different cerebral capabilities. Never mind that, left alone, boys and girls behave differently. The �science� of these sociologists compels that federal judges order that boys and girls be treat the same, and the �science� of educational experts reinforces that. No intelligence, indeed, no common sense allowed. http://www.conservativetruth.org/article.php?id=477

This is kinda fun. Lets play a game, see what crazy Bruce Walker quote you can find! Theres so many of them I just don't know which to choose.
http://www.google.com/search?source...G=Google+Search

Oh yes, very thought provoking indeed. Please continue to regale us with your political propaganda spam, Shakka, it gives me something to do at work.

I'm one economist not in line with the Republican Party...

perhaps if there were more lawyers in the republican party they wouldn't have broken the law so many times in the last 8 years?

what a terrible article shakka. i expect better from you.

All lawyers should be put on trial for corruption...

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Originally posted by josh4 For anyone wondering, this ridiculous tripe came from the American Thinker blog, often used as material on the Rush Limbaugh Show. For more on Rush Limbaugh see this and this. Here is a nice clip of Al Franken explaining some other places Limbaugh gets his facts. (Franken's best selling book, Lies And the Lying Liars Who Tell Them, available now.) The article, was written by Bruce Walker. So was this: He also wrote this, arguing, as far as I can tell, against equality of women, and suggesting that women are mentally inferior. This is kinda fun. Lets play a game, see what crazy Bruce Walker quote you can find! Theres so many of them I just don't know which to choose. http://www.google.com/search?source...G=Google+Search Oh yes, very thought provoking indeed. Please continue to regale us with your political propaganda spam, Shakka, it gives me something to do at work.

deflect, obfuscate, deflect!!!!!!!

odd, thats what a lawyer do.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN perhaps if there were more lawyers in the republican party they wouldn't have broken the law so many times in the last 8 years? what a terrible article shakka. i expect better from you.

all politicians are capable of breaking the law. including the pure-as-the-driven-snow Democrats.

as individuals, they act individually. as for the ideals and core values that constitute either and all political parties as a whole, you can't begin to prove that conservative ideals lead to the breaking of laws.


the argument that attorneys can bring substantial,or more importantly, beneficially substantial change to a Constitutional Republic is almost an oxymoron.

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Originally posted by Krypton I'm one economist not in line with the Republican Party...

ur so frikken confused politically, i wouldn't be shocked if you just came out on this board one day.

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Originally posted by Q5echo all politicians are capable of breaking the law. including the pure-as-the-driven-snow Democrats. as individuals, they act individually. as for the ideals and core values that constitute either and all political parties as a whole, you can't begin to prove that conservative ideals lead to the breaking of laws. the argument that attorneys can bring substantial,or more importantly, beneficially substantial change to a Constitutional Republic is almost an oxymoron.

well duh.

doesn't change the fact that the current leaders of the republican party exude dishonesty and are the worst government that the US, UK or australia have had during my lifetime.

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Originally posted by Q5echo ur so frikken confused politically, i wouldn't be shocked if you just came out on this board one day.

How am I confused? Like most Americans, I supported the conservative agenda, until the conservative agenda went haywire the past 7 years. Don't blame me for changing parties, blame the president. The losses of staunchly conservative precincts in Mississippi and other states detail at how the Republican Party is in decline. With that decline goes myself to the other side. Yes, I hate taxes. But when the only low-tax party is so staunchly for the wrong foreign policy and continues blundering our country into destruction, I have no choice but to vote for the other party. I'm libertarian socialist, and I'm not confused about that...

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Originally posted by Krypton I'm libertarian socialist,

yeah, youre really not.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN what a terrible article shakka. i expect better from you.

Nah. Look at the title of the thread. There is at least a fair point made on demographics, which nobody has yet attempted to debate, which is simply the basic premise of the document. To each his own as to the conclusions they draw. I have plenty of lawyer friends. Probably too many.

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Originally posted by Krypton I'm libertarian socialist, and I'm not confused about that...

The fuck is that? Those two concepts can't coexist under the same mind. You might be schizophrenic!

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Originally posted by Krypton How am I confused? Like most Americans, I supported the conservative agenda, until the conservative agenda went haywire the past 7 years. Don't blame me for changing parties, blame the president. The losses of staunchly conservative precincts in Mississippi and other states detail at how the Republican Party is in decline. With that decline goes myself to the other side. Yes, I hate taxes. But when the only low-tax party is so staunchly for the wrong foreign policy and continues blundering our country into destruction, I have no choice but to vote for the other party.

you vote Democrat, you've been suckered as a "conservative" IMO, but to each his own. never before since Reagan have the ideals of freedom and democracy been so implemented and encouraged.

you have a problem with spending? fine. so do most conservatives, doesn't mean that we can't ever find our way again. this is not your war? i don't have anything much more i can say to you that hasn't been said already.

what it basically comes down for you, i guess, is youre just upset and the other party is telling you everything you want to hear to make it all better. good luck.

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I'm libertarian socialist, and I'm not confused about that...

the defense rests, your honor.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN well duh. doesn't change the fact that the current leaders of the republican party exude dishonesty and are the worst government that the US, UK or australia have had during my lifetime.

still waiting on the "frog marches". hell, a simple Grand Jury indictment would suffice.

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Originally posted by Shakka The fuck is that? Those two concepts can't coexist under the same mind. You might be schizophrenic!

Yea, libertarian socialist. I'm all for free markets, but when it comes down to things such as education, health care, and defense, I'm a socialist. Look at how privatized the Iraq occupation is. These companies profit from war. That is wrong, and so I would nationalize things such as logistics for the military.

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you vote Democrat, you've been suckered as a "conservative" IMO, but to each his own. never before since Reagan have the ideals of freedom and democracy been so implemented and encouraged. you have a problem with spending? fine. so do most conservatives, doesn't mean that we can't ever find our way again. this is not your war? i don't have anything much more i can say to you that hasn't been said already. what it basically comes down for you, i guess, is youre just upset and the other party is telling you everything you want to hear to make it all better. good luck.

I've never voted Democrat... until this year...

Most conservatives don't want to pull out of Iraq. What is that...like over $600 billion? My ass the likes of John McCain wants to cut spending...The other party pledges to withdraw from Iraq. The Republicans want to continue the endless destruction of the Iraqi people. Who do you think I'm going to vote for? The party of imperialism? No, I don't vote because some party tells me what I want to hear, I vote because the other party happens to advocate the right thing...

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Originally posted by Krypton Yea, libertarian socialist. I'm all for free markets, but when it comes down to things such as education, health care, and defense, I'm a socialist. Look at how privatized the Iraq occupation is. These companies profit from war. That is wrong, and so I would nationalize things such as logistics for the military.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but libertarians are some of the biggest champions of individualism whereas socialism is generally all about the collective and the "common good". I'm thinking you might be struggling with a deeper philosophical dilemma--how to pursue wealth selfishly while still appearing like you give a shit about your fellow man. You can certainly do that, but you don't need to rationalize it under the veil of socialism...or any ism for that matter. Perhaps the label you seek is "liberaltarian?"

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"Isms in my opinion are not good. A person should not believe in an ism - he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon: "I don't believe in Beatles - I just believe in me". A good point there. Of course, he was the Walrus. I could be the Walrus - I'd still have to bum rides off of people."

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Originally posted by Shakka Correct me if I'm wrong here, but libertarians are some of the biggest champions of individualism whereas socialism is generally all about the collective and the "common good". I'm thinking you might be struggling with a deeper philosophical dilemma--how to pursue wealth selfishly while still appearing like you give a shit about your fellow man. You can certainly do that, but you don't need to rationalize it under the veil of socialism...or any ism for that matter. Perhaps the label you seek is "liberaltarian?"

You probably best understand. Libertarian socialism is a real ideology...



I don't think pure laissez-faire capitalism or pure communist socialism is good for anybody. A mixed system seems to me to be the best method of government. In my vision of a well run country, markets are free to the extent at which public health and safety are at risk. So I would strictly control the health sector. At the same time, I would find a way to completely eliminate all taxes except for a national sales tax.

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Originally posted by Q5echo all politicians are capable of breaking the law. including the pure-as-the-driven-snow Democrats. as individuals, they act individually. as for the ideals and core values that constitute either and all political parties as a whole, you can't begin to prove that conservative ideals lead to the breaking of laws. the argument that attorneys can bring substantial,or more importantly, beneficially substantial change to a Constitutional Republic is almost an oxymoron.

The effects of a more closeminded, absolute fanaticism about the way one leads one life, lending itself to the generic Catholic valuation of purity through self masochism?

You're seeing it in action; seen it in action for years now.

Conduct life more wisely than those before you.

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Originally posted by Q5echo ur so frikken confused politically, i wouldn't be shocked if you just came out on this board one day.

Yeah. What's up with people intellectually exploring the facets of the world they inhabit in order to make more informed decisions?

They should just blindly believe the bullshit of one side or the other, then insult others who attempt to input anything into our crystal meth hardened heads.

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Originally posted by DJ Shibby The effects of a more closeminded, absolute fanaticism about the way one leads one life, lending itself to the generic Catholic valuation of purity through self masochism?

if thats how you see it...

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Conduct life more wisely than those before you.

do you really, honestly...seriously believe you are in ANY position to tell me, or anybody for that matter, how to conduct my life?

the fact you typed that with a straight face says volumes about you.

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Originally posted by DJ Shibby Yeah. What's up with people intellectually exploring the facets of the world they inhabit in order to make more informed decisions? They should just blindly believe the bullshit of one side or the other, then insult others who attempt to input anything into our crystal meth hardened heads.

this is Krypton we're talking about.

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Originally posted by Q5echo this is Krypton we're talking about.

At least I have the intellectual honestly to realize when I'm wrong and to change my views accordingly. Ideologues never change their views, no matter how cracked up they may be...

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Originally posted by Krypton At least I have the intellectual honestly to realize when I'm wrong and to change my views accordingly. Ideologues never change their views, no matter how cracked up they may be...

alright. i'm sorry.

i'll try and conduct myself in this thread accordingly.

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Originally posted by Krypton At least I have the intellectual honestly to realize when I'm wrong and to change my views accordingly. Ideologues never change their views, no matter how cracked up they may be...

burn.

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