TranceAddict Forums (www.tranceaddict.com/forums)
- Chill Out Room
-- Irony (reference)
Pages (2): [1] 2 »

Irony (reference)

Most Beffiting, as I have seen many people use the term irony quite casually. Not trying to come off as arrogant, just wanted to throw this in so people would use this as a reference or tool.

quote:

Irony is not about reciprocity. If person A does thing X, and somehow it comes back and bites them in the ass, that is not ironic. If something happens to someone which would have been preventable had they not done some awful thing they did, that's not ironic. There is no irony in catching someone doing what they told others not to do, nor is there irony in something happening after someone suggested it wouldn't/couldn't. There is no irony in someone aspiring to better someone else by improving one facet and ending up with an even lesser result. There is no irony in trying to prevent something and thereby accelerating or worsening it. There is no irony in a situation being supported solely by the belief in a preconception about said situation. These things are coincidental, karmic, synchronous, biting, chiding, bittersweet, concurrent, foreshadowed, predictable, correspondant, cruel, telescoped and even occasionally educational. They are not ironic.

http://sc.tri-bit.com/Irony

wait, is that Guy Fawkes?

i googled guy fucks by accident

quote:

Originally posted by elFreak i googled guy fucks by accident

good to see you haven't lost your touch.

Re: Irony (reference)

quote:

Originally posted by diggerz If person A does thing X, and somehow it comes back and bites them in the ass, that is not ironic.

But wouldn't that be covered under...

5. an outcome of events contrary to what was, or might have been, expected.

(5th dictionary entry for irony.)

quote:

Quoted from Article Irony is the use of words in a way to conceal true intention with literal intention. More clearly, irony is when you say one thing but mean another.

GCSE MACBETH COURSEWORK ANALYSIS ON IRONY
http://www.123helpme.com/view.asp?id=7175

quote:

One type of irony used in Macbeth is verbal irony. This is when a character says one thing and means the opposite. Examples of this are when Macbeth says to Banquo, �Tonight we hold a solemn supper, sir, And I�ll request your presence (III, i, 13-14)� or when he says �Fail not our feast (III, i, 28).� Verbal irony makes the play more tragic because, if the reader understands the irony of what a character is saying, then the reader can see the true nature and intentions of the character

Traditionally, irony is either:

(a) A discrepancy in awareness between two groups of people, as in dramatic or tragic irony in plays or movies -- usually when the audience has information unavailable to the characters.

(b) A discrepancy between surface-level meaning and intended meaning, as when people use "verbal irony" to communicate something different from or opposite to the literal meaning of what they're saying.

Today lots of people use it for two other kinds of discrepancies:

(c) A discrepancy between what people expect to happen and what actually does happen.

(d) A discrepancy between the intended purpose of an action or object and the actual effects resulting from the action or object.

excellent. all i'm trying to do is raise awareness so people will think twice before using the term irony .

Granted, times have changed and the english language has undergone some painful transformations over the years. It's always important to go back to the roots in order to understand the real meaning of a word. (imo)

...dontcha think.

quote:

Originally posted by jpisani ...dontcha think.

quote:

Originally posted by elFreak

I loled

quote:

Originally posted by diggerz excellent. all i'm trying to do is raise awareness so people will think twice before using the term irony . Granted, times have changed and the english language has undergone some painful transformations over the years. It's always important to go back to the roots in order to understand the real meaning of a word. (imo)

And when you fail at irony, we shall laugh, for it will be ironic.

quote:

Originally posted by ReclusNdangrmnt And when you fail at irony, we shall laugh, for it will be ironic.

no, that's not ironic brutus. pay attention or shoot yourself in the head.

quote:

Originally posted by diggerz excellent. all i'm trying to do is raise awareness so people will think twice before using the term irony . Granted, times have changed and the english language has undergone some painful transformations over the years. It's always important to go back to the roots in order to understand the real meaning of a word. (imo)

you're right, but i think the meaning indeed has changed much in the same way "nice" once meant something close to "naughty"


languages are spoken, and i feel that it's unnatural and maybe regressive to try to use literature as a basis for spoken language, which is the only true language. writing is another set of signs entirely

see but that's when the problems begin to arise in my opinion. Once people start using a term casually like irony, the meaning changes, the word becomes something of lesser importance, when it shouldn't.

You are right, sir. Languages are spoken, but when writing one should always consider the history. I don't know, it's probably the way I was taught to approach the english language.

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec languages are spoken, and i feel that it's unnatural and maybe regressive to try to use literature as a basis for spoken language

that is also a paradox in it's own way as Shakespeare himself wrote plays (spoken language as you said).

haha i'm coming from a diachronic linguistics point of view that looks at language as the product of change over time.

i mean if we were all so conservative we'd still be speaking indo european


so many english words are bastardizations of other languages

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec so many english words are bastardizations of other languages

yes, mostly german

quote:

Originally posted by diggerz it's probably the way I was taught to approach the english language.

But isn't the english language based on broken rules and adapted colloquialisms?

[/just being difficult]
But seriously, SO many words have lost/changed their meanings over the years in this crazy language.

yes, one of the reasons I love the English language as a whole. You basically have the ability to play along and adapt new and old terms aswell.

I guess the conversation would diverge into a lingua-franca discussion. not relevant though, the point is irony does not mean what many people think it means. Even I have used the term casually, so there's alot of space for debate as it is a never-ending colloquy.

quote:

Originally posted by elFreak

That song would be ironic if you expected Alanis to know what the definition of irony was!

Re: Irony (reference)

quote:

Originally posted by diggerz Most Beffiting, as I have seen many people use the term irony quite casually. Not trying to come off as arrogant, just wanted to throw this in so people would use this as a reference or tool.

If enough people use the word for a different meaning, then that meaning changes to fit what the majority think it means. Words aren't absolute facts of science that are meant to stay rigid. People made them up, and people commonly change the meaning words all the time.

Truth is irony has different meanings, and dictionaries today reflect that. To suggest that the "true" or "original" definition of the word irony should be used is like convincing everyone that horse carriages are the best means of transportation.

Re: Re: Irony (reference)

quote:

Originally posted by Jake Benson If enough people use the word for a different meaning, then that meaning changes to fit what the majority think it means. Words aren't absolute facts of science that are meant to stay rigid. People made them up, and people commonly change the meaning words all the time. Truth is irony has different meanings, and dictionaries today reflect that. To suggest that the "true" or "original" definition of the word irony should be used is like convincing everyone that horse carriages are the best means of transportation.

You make some pretty good points but if we go on thinking like this, how many words will loose their essence ? irony should not be approached as a volatile term, in my opinion, people should study and practice the appropiate use.

If we go on thinking every word means something else to different people, then most words will loose significance. In the literary world (the world of letters and writing) this is terrible, because some words are worlds of their own and have a meaning (a pre-established meaning).

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright © 2000-2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.