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Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

http://www.thestar.com/News/World/article/479511

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Texas school district to let teachers carry guns Aug 15, 2008 04:11 PM Reuters HOUSTON � A Texas school district will let teachers bring guns to class this fall, the district's superintendent said today, in what experts said appeared to be a first in the United States. The board of the small rural Harrold Independent School District unanimously approved the plan and parents have not objected, said the district's superintendent, David Thweatt. School experts backed Thweatt's claim that Harrold, a system of about 110 students 150 miles northwest of Fort Worth, may be the first to let teachers bring guns to the classroom. Thweatt said it is a matter of safety. "We have a lock-down situation, we have cameras, but the question we had to answer is, 'What if somebody gets in? What are we going to do?" he said. "It's just common sense." Teachers who wish to bring guns will have to be certified to carry a concealed handgun in Texas and get crisis training and permission from school officials, he said. Recent school shootings in the United States have prompted some calls for school officials to allow students and teachers to carry legally concealed weapons into classrooms. The U.S. Congress once barred guns at schools nationwide, but the U.S. Supreme Court struck the law down, although state and local communities could adopt their own laws. Texas bars guns at schools without the school's permission.

the best part is the superintendent saying, "It's just common sense".

yes, *clearly* the next logical step towards protecting students is ARMING TEACHERS. lol

LOL!

Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by MarkT yes, *clearly* the next logical step towards protecting students is ARMING TEACHERS. lol

How likely do you think it is for some runt to pull a gun in school - either on a teacher or another student - knowing that the teachers are armed?

I'm not sure why you mock it with sarcasm - it is quite logical.

Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut How likely do you think it is for some runt to pull a gun in school - either on a teacher or another student - knowing that the teachers are armed? I'm not sure why you mock it with sarcasm - it is quite logical.

LOL just as likely. Except he'll be more inclined to pull the trigger a lot faster. What if the teacher pulls the gun on someone and accidentally shoots the wrong person? And of course there's no chance of teachers abusing their power, right?

Yes...it's very logical

Re: Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by infinity HiGH LOL just as likely. Except he'll be more inclined to pull the trigger a lot faster.

What on earth are you basing that assumption on? It's completely illogical and runs counter to every available statistic and all historical evidence. These kids with guns don't want to get killed - the only reason they have the balls to pull them in the first place is that they're secure in the knowledge that nobody else will have one.

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Or what if the teacher pulls the gun on someone and accidentally shoots the wrong person?

The point is to be a deterrent. But I would assume that they'd be properly trained anyway.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut The point is to be a deterrent. But I would assume that they'd be properly trained anyway.

Yes...quite the message to send...peace through supperior arms.

If we all just became vampires, we wouldn't be worrying about all this gun nonsense.

Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut How likely do you think it is for some runt to pull a gun in school - either on a teacher or another student - knowing that the teachers are armed? I'm not sure why you mock it with sarcasm - it is quite logical.

seeing as most in school shootings seem to done by kids that take their own lives in the end... I don't think it would make much of a difference. In fact, if the kids have any common sense... they'd pop the teacher first

i bet they are all members of the NRA.

not cool ...

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by zokissima Yes...quite the message to send...peace through supperior arms.

Yes, peace through superior fucking arms. What did you think was going to work? Peace through rainbows and holding hands and song and dance and ecstasy pills and fucking trance and opera music? Peace through everlasting bullshit dialogue and appeasement and financial aid?

We need another goddamn war. This generation of people doesn't understand anything about the dynamics of violence and coercion. The only thing stopping the truly violent and depraved from committing truly violent and depraved acts is the fear (or reality) of getting caught - or killed - in the act. Not after the act - in the act.

When was the last time you heard of someone shooting up an NRA convention or a hunting club? Have none of you noticed that these mass murders all seem to happen where weapons are strictly banned, like airplanes and school premises and office buildings?

What do you think would have happened on that god-awful Greyhound bus if one of the other passengers had been carrying a handgun?

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Originally posted by activate most in school shootings seem to done by kids that take their own lives in the end

[Citation Needed]

...

Even if this was the intent and the kid did pop the teacher first, some other teacher would probably hear the gunshot and try to intervene.

It might not be enough to prevent another school massacre. On the other hand, it might.

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut Peace through rainbows

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut We need another goddamn war.

i really hope you're not fuckin serious.

Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut How likely do you think it is for some runt to pull a gun in school - either on a teacher or another student - knowing that the teachers are armed? I'm not sure why you mock it with sarcasm - it is quite logical.

come on...you actually support this?

well, let's just arm EVERYONE. if everyone can have a gun, no one will shoot anyone else, right? 100% deterrence!!!

come on...

when someone is about to shoot someone else, or even just threaten them with a gun, they generally don't stand up on a chair and shout "get ready, you have 5 seconds before I pull out mah gun!"

don't they pull out a gun and point it in the heat of the moment or they plan out an attack in advance? what 'prevention' can happen here if some teachers are armed?

deterence? maybe. that's really the only *remotely* credible motive here, IMHO, and I'm not convinced that's really going to be the case.

there *may* be a deterrent effect on those who aren't truly fucking nuts. you and I, rational human beings, probably would think again about pulling out a gun knowing someone else might have one too. the problem is that rational human beings tend not to be the ones threatening other students with guns or shooting up schools.

if anything, doesn't this mean that teacher is going to be the first one to eat a bullet when something *does* happen? doesn't this increase the possibility of an accident? what line is being drawn here? Will a teacher who fears for student or personal safety due to a fist fight be able to point a gun to break it up?


I really would like to see the study that provides a shred of credibility for this type of policy. If there is merit in it, why does no other school district in the U.S. apparently permit/condone this? So the adminstration of the "Harrold Independent School District", that serves a whopping 110 students, has achieved some level of enlightenment that has baffled experts in gun violence for all this time?

sorry...I don't buy it.


btw...what would have happened differently on that Greyhound bus if someone had a gun? NOT MUCH. The victim was suddenly and repeatedly stabbed with a hunting knife, by a nutjob sitting right beside him, without any warning whatsoever. If someone had a gun, I suppose the victim wouldn't have been DACAPITATED though...he would just be dead. fantastic.


I'm not saying "do nothing" and just accept gun violence in schools as 100% beyond control...and I see your point that becoming complacent and "solving everything with discussion" can be naive...but is arming teachers *really* a good solution here?

by that logic, wherever there is gun violence (i.e. pretty much anywhere), someone should be armed?

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut [COLOR=#99CCEE][Citation Needed]

here's a sample of some school shootings. quite a few end with the shooter killing themselves, and several are just the shooter killing themselves with no one else being injured.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,266371,00.html


and not a single shooting mention happened in the 110 student Harrold Independent School District, or in the nearest city which is Fort Worth... only 2 in the last decade happened in Texas, and one was just a suicide.

I can't believe you guys are even debating this.

fawkin right arm the teachers and fawkin hell yeah for arming the students as well to protect themselves.

But get them proper training.

When was the last time you heard a cop shooting a cop? That�s right; never. Why? Because everyone has a freaking hand gun with them.

We live in a society that is past the stages of ' hey let�s talk this over' and doing peace rallies. It hasn't worked in past 50 years so what makes you think it will work in the next 50?

In Pakistan carrying a weapon is perfectly legal. As long as you have proper license and certified training to handle the weapon. Fighting here is of different sort ... tribal issues along with land or something equally stupid. But, we never ever had a 16 yr old twat go to his school and shoot up 10 people even though he has access to weapons at home. Simply because they know the people they are shooting at might have biggers guns than theirs

I myself have a automatic weapon that i carry in my car. It�s not the guns i am scared of its the fawking bombs going off. I wonder if they would allow us to at least carry hand grenades soon

LOL@ Digi supporting this shit!!! nobody should be surprised by this he is fuckin warmonger and a half.

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Originally posted by TranceGrooves ...

good luck pulling out your automatic weapon when someone suddenly points a gun in your face at a stoplight or even holds a knife to your throat.

btw...why the fuck would a cop shoot another cop in the first place? that's not really relevant to this topic.

great, there's no school shootings in Pakistan...just political assassinations and religious fanatics blowing themselves up to commit mass murder and terror.

great example of a country that has violence under control

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer LOL@ Digi supporting this shit!!! nobody should be surprised by this he is fuckin warmonger and a half.

i agree with him so does that make 2 warmongers?

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Originally posted by MarkT good luck pulling out your automatic weapon when someone suddenly points a gun in your face at a stoplight or even holds a knife to your throat.

Well then according to your analogy no one should have a weapon of any sort to protect themselves against violence. I mean then why would a cop or a soldier carry a weapon. Good luck to them as well when they are sitting having a drink and out comes a bullet. Let's all be sitting ducks for the people who actually had the balls to carry weapons

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Originally posted by MarkT btw...why the fuck would a cop shoot another cop in the first place? that's not really relevant to this topic.

It is absolutly relevant to this topic. But for that you would have to read the posts carefully and understand what is being said and by whom. Dont just make posts to shoot down other persons opinion.
My point in the cop example relates to Digis point that when people are carrying weapons the chance of stupid violence is less. Among cops i am sure there are disagreements. I am sure there are situations in which one cop would love to take the head off another but why it doesnt happen? Well i already gave you that answer.

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Originally posted by MarkT great, there's no school shootings in Pakistan...just political assassinations and religious fanatics blowing themselves up to commit mass murder and terror. great example of a country that has violence under control

I never said violence is under control Again you must read the posts carefully and not reply to look cool my friend. I already stated as well that fighting here is of different sort. I am not comparing US or Canada to Pakistan because even if we try our damn best for next 100 years we would still probably not come close to even Mississippi. The reason i stated Pakistan was because the percentage of robbery or car jacking is less because those robbers know that the other person is probably well armed as well.

what "violence" is there from which we need to protect ourselves with weapons? the odd nutjob who would strike whether or not we were all armed?

proponents of arming the population simply fail to accept that no matter what you do, there will be *some* element of violence in society. some of it will even be random and/or unavoidable.

arming the population is not going to change that fact and it's not going to "protect" anyone.

so it takes "balls" to carry a gun? that's *exactly* what's wrong wtih arming the population. mentalities like that...that carrying a weapon makes you a man or something...wow.

do you truly believe that cops don't fight with each other because they are armed? I don't know what to say, that is *so* absurd. how then do you explain the lack of violence in virtually every other employment setting? your point makes *no* sense at all. the gun is not the mitigating factor there, lol.

you have some intersting theories on human psychology, I'll give you that...

back to the topic at hand though. ask yourself why no other school district has adopted this policy. ask yourself what insight the people in this tiny place have that resulted in the conclusion that they will arm teachers. as pointed out, this area hasn't even experienced violence.

my guess is that the adminstrators are delusional.

Now thats a good post to reply to

First of all i cant beleive you even wrote that 1st line. lolz What vilolence is there? hahaha if there is no violence my friend then leave your car un locked everywhere. Do not lock the home doors at night. And tell the neighbourhood watch in your area (if there is one) to piss off lolz oh and while you are at it, write a letter to Mayor telling him there is no need to spend any more money on protecting the streets. There is no violence.

Being 'somewhat' prepared against that random act of violence is better than wondering what to do after you have been a victim.

I am sure you would agree with me that in past 50 years, violence has not gone down. It only has gone up. Also in the same 50 years we have done all sorts of things to help reduce violence but in vain. I mean we increased the police force, we installed cameras, we made drastic improvements in our security sector, and many other similar things.

None of it has worked.

Now you tell me, what is the next logical step here? Make a task force where there is a cop standing in front of every house and office 24/7? I think not. So why not take civilian, give him a weapon and train him to be "almost" like a cop. This civilian will not only protect his house but if time came will probably protect his neighbors too

Relating to this specific topic about the school, the administrators are not delusional in my opinion, they are realistic. They see that other cities have failed in protecting the children despite of all actions taken. They realize that majority of those cities are way bigger than theirs hence more resources are available to them. So why not protect our self before it's too late.

It is always a good idea to be prepared for the worse rather than think what should have or could have been done. This school is preparing for that. Notice 1 thing, there is opposition from parents. So obviously something is right here

Carrying a weapon does not make you man, you are right, but my friend not everyone can pull a trigger either, even if you were just shooting a Pepsi can lolz

And yes i do believe that i have never heard a cop blow the head of another cop because the other cop has a gun and cops around them also have guns. Part of it also has to do with their training. When you know the other person is armed you tend to back off a bit. This might not be the case 100% of times but it is so in majority. Education and mentality level plays a big part too. That�s why I am saying that they should not just arm them. They should also give them proper training. That�s important.

In the end i will say that we should let this school test the theory and seeing them hopefully other schools will adapt to it. If this activity helps reduce violence in schools by even 10%. It worked

while the idea of armed teachers is a little too "police state" for me i have to agree it would make for safer schools, as long as they are trained and the gun is kept safely (not hanging on the wall next to the metre stick or something)

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Originally posted by DaRoZa while the idea of armed teachers is a little too "police state" for me i have to agree it would make for safer schools, as long as they are trained and the gun is kept safely (not hanging on the wall next to the metre stick or something)

What is the point of having a teacher carry a gun if he/she cannot reach it at moment's notice?

Not like you'll have 5 mins to fumblefuck with keys while the rampage goes on.

As for no gun advocates, since knives can be used as weapon, ban those too? How many of you actually fired a gun or taken a course on gun safety?

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Texas school district to let teachers carry guns

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Originally posted by DigiNut What on earth are you basing that assumption on? It's completely illogical and runs counter to every available statistic and all historical evidence. These kids with guns don't want to get killed - the only reason they have the balls to pull them in the first place is that they're secure in the knowledge that nobody else will have one.

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Originally posted by DigiNut [Citation Needed]

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