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Akai MPCs

HAI Guis!
Haven't ever really thought about getting one of these before (thought it was just for hip hop mainly ), but I saw a friend using it for minimal the other night and realised it may have some potential.
Does anyone here use one? What sort of stuff can you do with it? Is it good for mangling samples or really just playing drums on the pads? How would it integrate into a live setup etc... and what is the best one to get for this purpose?
Lots of questions but really just wondering what people's thoughts are...
I'd be up for doing glitchy techno, maybe some stuff a bit like Lamb, just generally trying to add a live element to my sets

i've used one and i think they are very overrated. cutting up loops is tedious, to say the least. i don't know how people can bare staring at those tiny LCDs for so long. in my oppinion, guru or ableton are far better and more flexible. i think it's only worth getting an MPC if you want to do live stuff and are afraid of your computer crashing. otherwise, an MPD + guru wins, hands down.

Yep, unfortunately I was in the computer crashing situation the other day, and its worried me a bit. Ableton just starting crackling something awful...

Another, better alternative would be the roland mv-8800 LINK it is pretty much the same thing as the mpc but you can connect it to a computer monitor. I also think you can connect a computer mouse too.

To add some live element to your sets you could assign some loops in Ableton to Akai's MPD24 http://www.dv247.com/invt/36346/

And use the faders / encoders to reverse, filter and generally mangle

quote:

Originally posted by echosystm it's only worth getting an MPC if you want to do live stuff and are afraid of your computer crashing. otherwise, an MPD + guru wins, hands down.

+1. MPCs also get dated and they're expensive. Both the screen and programming them is tedious. Guru is like an MPC and Electribe hybrid with load of other features, and a never ending sample library (your own).

Unless, you hate computers I don't understand why anybody who just wants to program percussion would use an MPC now. You can buy the MPD, to give you the feel and Guru gives you the possibilities.

Bear in mind you dont have to trigger just percussion samples, you can trigger long loops or whole instruments of your tracks plus some variations.

But for production work a MPD24 does what you need IMO.

If you do decide to get a midi pad controller, i suggest you look at the Korg Nano Pad.

Actually I'm already looking at a monome for control, I'm just generally trying to find some ways of working not involving a computer screen at all. Or at least new ways to control stuff.

The MPCs are a bit expensive (probably about a grand for the 1000) but they don't date too badly, they're still doing OSs for the 1000 which was released 5 or so years ago AFAIK.

Thanks for the comments though, info is much appreciated.

I've been trying to get a monome but they are hard to get hold of.

quote:

Originally posted by kitphillips Actually I'm already looking at a monome for control, I'm just generally trying to find some ways of working not involving a computer screen at all. Or at least new ways to control stuff. The MPCs are a bit expensive (probably about a grand for the 1000) but they don't date too badly, they're still doing OSs for the 1000 which was released 5 or so years ago AFAIK. Thanks for the comments though, info is much appreciated.

If you want to go hardware, have a look at the electribes. The older models are a bit dated (limited) but the X range is well worth looking at, they're easy to get and second hand are quite cheap too. Check some of the vids on youtube....

Thats a good idea, I had a play with the electribes once, I'll look into them again.
How are they for creating loops and triggering them on the fly? I know the step sequencer is awesome.

quote:

Originally posted by kitphillips Thats a good idea, I had a play with the electribes once, I'll look into them again. How are they for creating loops and triggering them on the fly? I know the step sequencer is awesome.

For doing that sort of thing I personally reckon there is nothing that can touch them - not even close.

I have an old ES-1 which I still use because it's the fastest thing to make my own loops on. Then I jusr record the midi and or the audio into cubase.

I love mine but the newer ESX or EMX are waaaaay better. Much more parameters and functionality.

I also know a few guy that gig with them and they are rock solid.

There's a vid on youtube called something like "beats in six minutes" - the guy starts from scratch and makes a pretty decent tune in 6 mins.

I thoroughly recommend them and think they are seriously underrated.

i've only used/owned 2 mpc's... the 2k classic, and now the mpc4000.

i only enjoy making music w/my mpc. it's what i learned on, so i'm super comfortable with it. i love the hands on feel of the whole process when i'm using the 4k. the sampler is insane, it's exactly what i needed.

for me the mpc has more than enough features and power to allow me to create the music i want to make w/out the bullshit of dealing w/a computer.

nothing beats just turning on just two machines (mpc4000 and mc-909 in my case), and just enjoy making music w/out any headaches.

i use komplete 5, kore 2, emulator x2, and sonar. i love my softsynths, i really do... but the computer/daw experience has really been a bittersweet experience... if i could go back and do it all over again... i would probably pass on buying a computer, and stick w/hardware and feel not feel to bad about it.



___________

to the original poster: you can make what ever style of music you want w/an mpc. the mpc really excels w/pattern based music, like hip hop, house, trance (electronic music in general) because you make patterns, and string them into a song. you can work in a linear fashion if you want... but some of us (like myself) have pattern based brains, so we appreciate being able to build are tracks in chunks that be arranged how ever we want instantly by changing the order of the sequences as the song plays.

if you want to mangle samples, get an mpc4k. that one, and only that one has the z-sampler built in.

the mpc2k classic, like the other mpc's before it are just meant to sample drums, and do NOT have a full featured sampler... just a basic one for working w/simple drum samples... can't really do serious velocity layering w/these things either. but the mpc 4k can. i don't think the mpc's that came out after the 4k, like the 2500, the 1000, or even the new 5000 can mangle samples like the 4000... as far as i understand, none of those actually have a full featured sampler like the 4000.

working live w/the mpc is great. i've had the mcp4k for about 2 years, and it's only locked up on me once when it was in 96khz mode at home when i fist got it. i was never able to reproduce that crash ever again...

it has 960ppq, and it's rock solid. don't have to deal w/latency either if you are all hardware. the sequencer can record and playback all your automation w/out a hitch. a lot of my tracks are pretty heavy w/CC data, and mpc has never bogged down, or clonked out.

also mpc's are great for jamming, and improvising. both the mpc2k, and mpc4k have track mute screens where you can mute/un-mute tracks just by touching the coresponding pad. since you have probably have 10 fingers like most us, you can mute and un-mute 10 tracks at once.

you can have a pattern you created looping endlessly while you just cut elements in and out on the fly when ever you want. great for coming up alternate arrangements, or remixing.

as for cutting loops, i'm not gonna lie... using a computer is easier, and faster. but it's still easy to extract elements out of loops, and assign them to the pads. if you have a perfect loop, it's still easy to chop it up on the 4k. the newer mpc's have chop shop which is supposed to be better at editing loops than the 4k, but i have never tried it.


i'm used to working w/the screen... but i do like monitor i bit more.
but i disagree w/dj rann that the programing is tedious. maybe it has to do w/the level of experience... or that the mpc is my cup of tea, but not his... like a lot of people rave the ableton live is easy to use, but i was never able to make heads or tails out of it, so i dumped it.

i agree w/rann that you should look at a groovebox type thing, like the electribe. i use the mc-909, but either one will do the trick for sketching out basic ideas.

to me, the mpc is just an awsome machine. i love mine to death.

quote:

Originally posted by sr126 i'm used to working w/the screen... but i do like monitor i bit more. but i disagree w/dj rann that the programing is tedious. maybe it has to do w/the level of experience...or that the mpc is my cup of tea, but not his... like a lot of people rave the ableton live is easy to use, but i was never able to make heads or tails out of it, so i dumped it.

quote:

Originally posted by sr126 Absolutely right on both counts. Coming from an electribe ES-1 (no screen, just a 3 digit display) or a computer DAW, I just couldn't seem to get my head into the MPC's programming methodology, and gave up before I really gave them a chance. having said that, I know people who would fight me to the death for insulting their MPC and I know they are very powerful, just not for me, and my brain also works to some degree on patterns because of the 'Tribe. [QUOTE]Originally posted by sr126 i agree w/rann that you should look at a groovebox type thing, like the electribe. i use the mc-909, but either one will do the trick for sketching out basic ideas. to me, the mpc is just an awsome machine. i love mine to death.

+1, The 909 is wicked too. Can you really make full sounding tracks from start to finish on an MPC? (not hiphop or minimal house, I mean like full layered flowing trance/prog?).

You can with the some of the electribes because they actually have synth engines but I always felt that the sample only nature of the MPCs limited it to getting sketches of your tracks down and then doing the rest in a computer (as I have to do with my Electribe ES-1).

quote:

Originally posted by Simon_N I've been trying to get a monome but they are hard to get hold of.

Ask Deadmau5!

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN +1, The 909 is wicked too. Can you really make full sounding tracks from start to finish on an MPC? (not hiphop or minimal house, I mean like full layered flowing trance/prog?). You can with the some of the electribes because they actually have synth engines but I always felt that the sample only nature of the MPCs limited it to getting sketches of your tracks down and then doing the rest in a computer (as I have to do with my Electribe ES-1).

what you do w/the electribe and computer is what i do w/the mc-909, and mpc. i start the idea on the mc-909, and build it up in the mpc. i usualy just sample the drums or load a kit in the mpc because it'a a lot easier for me to work the drums in the mpc than it is in the mc-909. i record all my automation like filter sweeps, rhytmic gates, etc on the mpc... and the mc-909 plays it all back perfectly. i love not having to deal w/the latency.

if you add a good external FX processor... (the FX board that comes w/the 4k is barely passable if you have nothing else to work with)
i would say that you can make full sounding tracks on the mpc 4000. the mpc4000 has the z sampling engine built in, so it's light years ahead of all the other mpc's in terms of sampling capabilites, and sound design capabilities.

w/my old mpc2k i pretty much had to have my idea ready to go before i started sampling everything in, because you counldn't do much w/the mpc sampler. w/the 4k, you can just load up raw wave forms and mold them, bend them, tweak them untill you get something that satisfies you. 512mb of ram... can't beat that.

so if you make a patch on the mc-909, or electribe... disable the lfo's, filters, and other things like. sample the raw sound in the mpc4000. you can re-create the same patch in the mpc.

my mpc is outfitted w/the adat board, so i can send 8 audio tracks into sonar w/just one cable. so it's pretty easy to mix, eq, and add FX.

quote:

Originally posted by sr126 what you do w/the electribe and computer is what i do w/the mc-909, and mpc. i start the idea on the mc-909, and build it up in the mpc. i usualy just sample the drums or load a kit in the mpc because it'a a lot easier for me to work the drums in the mpc than it is in the mc-909. i record all my automation like filter sweeps, rhytmic gates, etc on the mpc... and the mc-909 plays it all back perfectly. i love not having to deal w/the latency.

I see - it's the same thing as I do. But does that mean you have to load all the individual samples from the 909 on to each pad of the 4k to make is work?

I know what you mean about the benefits of machine only linking and latency - there's a strange issue, and it's been discussed to death with no solution on the electribe groups and forums.

If I record the midi in to the computer, and use cubase to trigger the electribe so I can record the audio back in to cubase, the rhythm is (just slightly) not as tight - it loses something of the groove. But if you just record in cubase what you have programmed in the electribe, the audio recorded has the same groove. It's like the midi when sent from the PC (even though it's exactly the same pattern) doesn't trigger as tightly.

quote:

Originally posted by sr126 if you add a good external FX processor... (the FX board that comes w/the 4k is barely passable if you have nothing else to work with) i would say that you can make full sounding tracks on the mpc 4000. the mpc4000 has the z sampling engine built in, so it's light years ahead of all the other mpc's in terms of sampling capabilites, and sound design capabilities.

Yeah I remember hen the 4k came out - it was the daddy of the range, and arguably the most advanced sampling workstation that been made.

quote:

Originally posted by sr126 w/my old mpc2k i pretty much had to have my idea ready to go before i started sampling everything in, because you counldn't do much w/the mpc sampler. w/the 4k, you can just load up raw wave forms and mold them, bend them, tweak them untill you get something that satisfies you. 512mb of ram... can't beat that. so if you make a patch on the mc-909, or electribe... disable the lfo's, filters, and other things like. sample the raw sound in the mpc4000. you can re-create the same patch in the mpc.

So basically the 2k is too limited to make a full sounding track on but is good for programming grooves (which in fairness is what it's meant for).

quote:

Originally posted by sr126 my mpc is outfitted w/the adat board, so i can send 8 audio tracks into sonar w/just one cable. so it's pretty easy to mix, eq, and add FX.

That's a great way of working, very sensible and gives you DAW capabilities for the mixdown - my tribe only has L/R out so it's pattern by pattern, but having said that it is probably 10 years old now ans I haven't come across anything that lets you program grooves/loops as fast, so it makes up for it somewhat I'm happy with it (especially as I only paid 50 quid for it )

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN I see - it's the same thing as I do. But does that mean you have to load all the individual samples from the 909 on to each pad of the 4k to make is work? I know what you mean about the benefits of machine only linking and latency - there's a strange issue, and it's been discussed to death with no solution on the electribe groups and forums. If I record the midi in to the computer, and use cubase to trigger the electribe so I can record the audio back in to cubase, the rhythm is (just slightly) not as tight - it loses something of the groove. But if you just record in cubase what you have programmed in the electribe, the audio recorded has the same groove. It's like the midi when sent from the PC (even though it's exactly the same pattern) doesn't trigger as tightly.

before i bought the mpc, i was using my mc-909 drive kore1 and komplete 3. i was having all kinds of random timing issues... like the track slowing down for 1/2 a beat, or missing drum hits, and stuff like that... it was just random... but i never had that problem w/the mpc. kore slaves to mpc just fine. weird... but the latency still throws me off... i'm usually at 10ms, and it drives me crazy.

quote:

So basically the 2k is too limited to make a full sounding track on but is good for programming grooves (which in fairness is what it's meant for).

yeah, you're not going to get much out of the older mpc's in terms of sound scaping... but an mpc2k will certainly drive racks synths or other gear w/out any problems.

quote:

That's a great way of working, very sensible and gives you DAW capabilities for the mixdown - my tribe only has L/R out so it's pattern by pattern, but having said that it is probably 10 years old now ans I haven't come across anything that lets you program grooves/loops as fast, so it makes up for it somewhat I'm happy with it (especially as I only paid 50 quid for it )

that's what matters most. having something that satisfies you, and gives you what you want w/the least amount of BS possible.

quote:

Originally posted by djillicit Ask Deadmau5!

why?

Thanks again guys for how informative this has been. I'll probably have to go and check out both the MPC and the electribe, but at least now I know what I'm looking for

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