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Handing out unofficial productions/remixes

I'm currently enjoying my free time by remixing 'Lowlife' by Sasha and Adam Parker.

Can I hand out my own remix to anybody without getting busted for it?

I don't think that's the case but I know for sure that the Mongoose Remix contest rules said that posting remixes on Myspace pages was clearly not allowed.

What can I do with other people's work? What are the actuals limits?

just take out the key samples you used for the remix ie the samples you used/given to you for the comp.
and replace them with your own.

i think you just can't promote it in a public space: so, can't put it anywhere in the public market area (as myspace is a highly promotional area, that bumps that)--

Think of it as just the original song (i.e: as if you'd not done anything to it)- therefore, obviously it's piracy to go around giving it to people etc...

it's not like they can really stop you sending it around to people though...

quote:

Originally posted by airwalker1 just take out the key samples you used for the remix ie the samples you used/given to you for the comp. and replace them with your own.

I have no samples, it's not a comp. I'm sort of remaking the track.

I heard stuff like if you keep the sample loop UNDER 8 measures, your remix cannot be considered as an infringement to copyright holders.

Since Lowlife is like a two bar loop all the way I should be cleared right?

quote:

Originally posted by ponsshin I have no samples, it's not a comp. I'm sort of remaking the track. I heard stuff like if you keep the sample loop UNDER 8 measures, your remix cannot be considered as an infringement to copyright holders. Since Lowlife is like a two bar loop all the way I should be cleared right?

I dont think it works like that. You could remix a song and use no samples whatsoever but if its a remix and you are labelling it as such then the rules apply, regardless of what you used to make it.

I think you'll be fine though to hand it out to people. Its not like you're profiting from it and if it ever gained popularity and the label noticed, they would just take the track from you and release it for themselves as you have no rights to it.

quote:

Originally posted by G-Con if it ever gained popularity and the label noticed, they would just take the track from you and release it for themselves as you have no rights to it.

hmm are you sure gcon?
im sure i read somewhere pryds sampled Steve Winwood's song "Valerie" for his track call on me, which was never cleared until it became a club hit, then the record label teamed eric with Steve Winwood to re-record the vocals and officially release the track (as a Eric Prydz track).

I guess this could be a one off though.

quote:

Originally posted by Kid_presentable hmm are you sure gcon? im sure i read somewhere pryds sampled Steve Winwood's song "Valerie" for his track call on me, which was never cleared until it became a club hit, then the record label teamed eric with Steve Winwood to re-record the vocals and officially release the track (as a Eric Prydz track). I guess this could be a one off though.

Well yeah, I suppose if the label feels its in their interest to do something like that then they well - and teaming up with Eric Prydz is certainly beneficial. I guess the point I was making was the label aint gonna take you to court for remixing one of their tunes and handing it out to a few people. In the end, they will own all rights to it so any potential profit to make from it will be theirs.

quote:

Originally posted by ponsshin I have no samples, it's not a comp. I'm sort of remaking the track. I heard stuff like if you keep the sample loop UNDER 8 measures, your remix cannot be considered as an infringement to copyright holders. Since Lowlife is like a two bar loop all the way I should be cleared right?

There is no magical time/length limit on these things - it's all about whether the sample is recognizable or not.

I seriously doubt a dance label will give you troubles with it. Mainstream labels might.
You DO own rights to your remix, but your remix should never have been created (creating derivative works is illegal) so they could sue you. But if it was successful enough to bother to sue, they'd more likely just take your profits OR if it was not commercially released, might release it and give you some of the profits.

quote:

Originally posted by kitphillips I seriously doubt a dance label will give you troubles with it. Mainstream labels might. You DO own rights to your remix, but your remix should never have been created (creating derivative works is illegal) so they could sue you.

So you're saying you do have rights but not the rights to create te remix, thus have no rights?

I know different rules apply per country when talking about intellectual property. Strictly speaking there are a couple of rights you have when doing a remix, but those only apply when the rights owner grants you the right to do a remix. The remix will always be property of the owner of the master rights (mostly artist and/or record label).

quote:

Originally posted by kitphillips You DO own rights to your remix,

I think every label contract out there will specify that the label owns all and every remix/reproduction of the original work, regardless who its done by or what they used.

Of course like Storyteller says, if the label grant permission beforehand to do a remix then its entirely dependent on the conditions set in that situation

So as long as I'm not putting it to commercial use it's ok?
Well thanks.

Yea most of the times it is just like that. Some managements/labels can be dicks though so be careful.

quote:

Originally posted by ponsshin So as long as I'm not putting it to commercial use it's ok? Well thanks.

as i said tho, putting it in a publicly accesible place is similar to advertising it, so if a C*** label saw it on a site of yours or something i think you could get in trouble...

likelihood of this happening is a million to one though

but yeah, just imagine it the same as if it was the original track, not a remix... same places u can legally put the original you can put the remix... i.e: in ur home only pretty much

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller So you're saying you do have rights but not the rights to create te remix, thus have no rights? I know different rules apply per country when talking about intellectual property. Strictly speaking there are a couple of rights you have when doing a remix, but those only apply when the rights owner grants you the right to do a remix. The remix will always be property of the owner of the master rights (mostly artist and/or record label).

Theres two separate issues.
When you create a remix, you have intellectual property rights over that mix, unless you sign them away. But if its an unofficial mix, then it should never have existed. So they can sue you for creating the mix, but AFAIK CANNOT simply take the mix and put it to commercial use themselves. They might also try to cut a deal saying, we won't sue if you give us all rights to the mix. But you'd still have to sign that deal.
When its an official remix, you sign your righs over to the label as part of gaining permission to do the mix in the first place.

As far as I know there's only one set of rights you do have when remixing. And that's that you get a fee for it being played publicly/in public spaces (radio/tv/etc). That is an intellectual right. However the intellectual property over the track and the remix always belongs to the original writer of the track.

Your work on the track constitutes some intellectual right over your work on the track. That's why you get some money. Maybe its different where you are, but that's how I understand it works in Australia and I think UK and US.

Makes sense .

quote:

Originally posted by kitphillips Your work on the track constitutes some intellectual right over your work on the track. That's why you get some money. Maybe its different where you are, but that's how I understand it works in Australia and I think UK and US.

From the little experience I have with contracts, when a label signs a track (original I'm talking about) they will state that any remix, reproduction of any kind will belong to them and they will have full rights. Therefore, if someone else does a remix, the label will automatically be able to claim full ownership of said remix. UNLESS, of course, it was an official remix and the label has already come to an agreement with the remixer.

But I'm pretty certain that any unofficial remix (which is what we're talkin about here) will always belong to the label and maybe the original artist as well depending how the contract was worded.

You can't claim any rights of ownership over a remix of a track that belongs to someone else.

That was exactly the kind of answer I was looking for. Thank you.

quote:

Originally posted by G-Con From the little experience I have with contracts, when a label signs a track (original I'm talking about) they will state that any remix, reproduction of any kind will belong to them and they will have full rights. Therefore, if someone else does a remix, the label will automatically be able to claim full ownership of said remix. UNLESS, of course, it was an official remix and the label has already come to an agreement with the remixer. But I'm pretty certain that any unofficial remix (which is what we're talkin about here) will always belong to the label and maybe the original artist as well depending how the contract was worded. You can't claim any rights of ownership over a remix of a track that belongs to someone else.

Exactly my point and I fully agree. There is one problem though, because Kitphillips is right as well. Doing a remix does give you certain rights. In Holland it's called 'naburige rechten', I can't properly translate it unfortunately. It just means the remixer is entitled to a part of the royalties received from airplay (in public areas, offices, on tv, on radio, etc).

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller It just means the remixer is entitled to a part of the royalties received from airplay (in public areas, offices, on tv, on radio, etc).

even if it is an unofficial remix?

I'm not sure. Grey area as they say.

I guess the point is: I don't think a dance music label will sue you, and I don't think they can just release the music without your permission (even if you had no permission to remix it in the first place).
So probably best to keep it low profile, but its also probably OK to hand it out to friends and DJs. Don't send it to radio stations neccesarily.

quote:

Originally posted by kitphillips Don't send it to radio stations neccesarily.

Can someone clear up with me axactly what the term "white label" means?
week after week Radio One's tracklist will have countless white label tracks, which I understood to be bootleg remix's?

One example would be dirty souths "the end" which is a cover of The Doors. This track was played very early on by Pete Tong and labeled as Dirty South - the end (white label) untill a few weeks later Pete Tong announced dirty south had signed the deal to release the track.

however I have also heard the term "white label" used when artists/labels are simply hiding which label has actually released the record.

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