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atheism just another religion?

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ITALIAN atheists have lost a bid to run "no God" advertisements on city buses after strong opposition from conservative political parties. The ads reading "The bad news is that God doesn't exist. The good news is that you don't need him" were to have been put on buses in the northern city of Genoa, home to the Catholic cardinal who is head of the Italian Bishops Conference. The mock-up was ready and the contract was sent to the group for signing but the publicity agency changed its mind and said the ad could not run it because it violated an ethics in advertising code, according to Giorgio Villella of The Italian Union of Atheists and Rationalist Agnostics (UAAR). "Right-wing politicians criticised us ferociously," Villella said by telephone from the group's base, adding that at least one bus driver in Genoa said he would refuse to drive a "no God" bus. "It's strange that in a country where ads depicting near-naked women wearing skimpy lingerie is permitted on buses that we can't run ads about atheism," Villella said. Villella said the group's lawyers would likely file an appeal to a court to overturn the decision and that the group would try to run the ads in other Italian cities. Atheists in Barcelona, London and Washington have already run "no God" ads on city buses.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,2757...797-401,00.html

Maybe it should be. At least that way we'd get the same rights and privileges as real religions. maybe some sneaky tax breaks too!

Atheists should elect their own Pope / representative. For the sake of it.

Why? For believing in nothing at all?

Give me a break

Atheists need to reach the same level of charity worldwide that the big 3 religions do before they can be called anything close, if they do that then sure, let them worship an empty jar or whatever it is you guys do.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Atheists should elect their own Pope / representative. For the sake of it.

They have, his name is Richard Dawkins and he's retarded.

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Originally posted by Alex Why? For believing in nothing at all? Give me a break Atheists need to reach the same level of charity worldwide that the big 3 religions do before they can be called anything close, if they do that then sure, let them worship an empty jar or whatever it is you guys do.

Oh yes. Their "charity". Also called "spreading our unsubstantiated opinions over the less fortunate"*. As long as the less fortunate doesn't want to carry out abortions or use condoms of course!

In any case, what my statement really meant was holding and promoting an opinion is ok, as long as that opinion doesn't go against god. Also drawing other people (like krypton) who maintain that atheism is just another religion, which we can see in practice is anything but the case.

*also known as "how many palaces can we build with the coin of the gullible.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN Oh yes. Their "charity". Also called "spreading our unsubstantiated opinions over the less fortunate". As long as the less fortunate doesn't want to carry out abortions or use condoms of course!

You've really been fed the bull shit haven't you

Militant atheists are such a laugh.

I am not an atheist and I am not religious either. BUT, atheists - just like all humans, believe in SOMETHING. It just happens to be that BELIEVING that God doesnt exist is part of their beliefs.

Oh, and dont get me started on religious charity work. They do it for the sake of getting more people (converts) to their religion. Preaching. Missionary work. You get the idea.

True charities are those who do work and dont expect anything in return. They do it for the sake of helping people and making a difference. Religious groups, however, take advantage of the conflicts and poverty and work with those people to help them out, by various means, but incorporating missionary work or services as well.

For example, you wont see Catholic missionaries helping poor Peruan Catholics - but you will much more likely see them in the jungles trying to spread Catholocism to the indigineous peoples of the Amazon. Thats where you'll find most missionaries, where they are people of other beliefs or indigenous beliefs who can be converted, and in their desperate positions, some do!

Religion kills people. Atheists dont go on crusades to free people of their religion, or fight in the name of God or Allah or whomever the diety is. They just live their lives. Some are ignorant, some run productive lives and campaigns.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium I am not an atheist and I am not religious either. BUT, atheists - just like all humans, believe in SOMETHING. It just happens to be that BELIEVING that God doesnt exist is part of their beliefs. Oh, and dont get me started on religious charity work. They do it for the sake of getting more people (converts) to their religion. Preaching. Missionary work. You get the idea. True charities are those who do work and dont expect anything in return. They do it for the sake of helping people and making a difference. Religious groups, however, take advantage of the conflicts and poverty and work with those people to help them out, by various means, but incorporating missionary work or services as well. For example, you wont see Catholic missionaries helping poor Peruan Catholics - but you will much more likely see them in the jungles trying to spread Catholocism to the indigineous peoples of the Amazon. Thats where you'll find most missionaries, where they are people of other beliefs or indigenous beliefs who can be converted, and in their desperate positions, some do!

As a Roman Catholic, I think you're pulling this out of your ass like most people when they try to talk about religion.

Catholic missions do encourage conversion but it isn't a "we wont help you unless you convert" thing at all. I know dozens of people who have gone on missions including nuns and priests and the majority of the people they've helped (in Africa, for instance) have been muslims or people holding strong to their native beliefs. Some converted, most did not. Yet they all benefited from the hospitals and schools that were built for them.

As a matter of fact I know 3 people who have gone on missions to Peru, both to help Catholics and non Catholics by building entire neighborhoods including schools, libraries and hospitals for all the native population both the Spanish speaking and the aboriginals.

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Originally posted by Alex You've really been fed the bull shit haven't you Militant atheists are such a laugh.

Posting on an internet forum does not make one militant.

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Originally posted by Alex Catholic missions do encourage conversion but ...

But ... but ... but ...

I never said they FORCE people to. Oh, they used to FORCE people into their religions. In the past, millions of natives around the world were slaughtered, tortured, forcefully converted - what can easily be amounted to genocide - in the name of religion, to clear the "heretics", and because their God was right.

And not just natives, but peoples of other religions. And religious people are the ones who stirr most of the problems when it comes to beliefs. You dont see atheists protesting and boycotting British buses with religious advertisements. However, devout Christians like the one bus driver from UK refused to drive a bus with "No God" ad. And Italian religious groups have so far successfully fought against bus ads for atheists. While their ads are OK.

Dont feed me the bullshit.

Poser

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium But ... but ... but ... I never said they FORCE people to. Oh, they used to FORCE people into their religions. In the past, millions of natives around the world were slaughtered, tortured, forcefully converted - what can easily be amounted to genocide - in the name of religion, to clear the "heretics", and because their God was right. And not just natives, but peoples of other religions. And religious people are the ones who stirr most of the problems when it comes to beliefs. You dont see atheists protesting and boycotting British buses with religious advertisements. However, devout Christians like the one bus driver from UK refused to drive a bus with "No God" ad. And Italian religious groups have so far successfully fought against bus ads for atheists. While their ads are OK. Dont feed me the bullshit.

Actually that's exactly what atheists do worldwide, whenever religion voices it's opinions on anything the atheists get up in arms and want whatever the religious are trying to do to either remain or become secular.

I don't advocate what people did in the name of God when it comes to killing people, but I don't see how that discredits the religion's motivations nowadays. Especially when it helps millions of people worldwide.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium You dont see atheists protesting and boycotting British buses with religious advertisements.

lol, did you read the OP?

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Originally posted by Alex Atheists need to reach the same level of charity worldwide that the big 3 religions do before they can be called anything close,

says who? what, all other religions don't count?

regardless, it has already done plenty of 'charity', for example, the efforts to maintain an education on evolution rather than creationism.

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Originally posted by Alex if they do that then sure, let them worship an empty jar or whatever it is you guys do.

ironic.

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Originally posted by Alex Actually that's exactly what atheists do worldwide, whenever religion voices it's opinions on anything the atheists get up in arms and want whatever the religious are trying to do to either remain or become secular. I don't advocate what people did in the name of God when it comes to killing people, but I don't see how that discredits the religion's motivations nowadays. Especially when it helps millions of people worldwide.

Hey, I am not for banning religion or destroying it. Religion does help some people. I just dont support its agression. I dont adhere to religion, as I said. Religious people just need to be more respectable and understanding of all people, especially from other beliefs, especially when they are non-violent.

Labeling atheists as people who dont believe in anything - to me its the same thing as considering electronic music (EDM) not to be REAL music. Yes, I hear that a lot about music.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Atheists should elect their own Pope / representative. For the sake of it.

As if atheists could agree on anything other than there being no God

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Originally posted by Lira As if atheists could agree on anything other than there being no God

Hah!

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN lol, did you read the OP?

Ooops. Well, you get the general idea. Of what I meant. I see religious symbols, buildings and people all the time, but I dont boycott a class because one of my teachers is a devout Catholic.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Hey, I am not for banning religion or destroying it. Religion does help some people. I just dont support its agression. I dont adhere to religion, as I said. Religious people just need to be more respectable and understanding of all people, especially from other beliefs, especially when they are non-violent.

I agree.

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Originally posted by Alex They have, his name is Richard Dawkins and he's retarded.

Actually I just read his book "The God Delusion"..and he is not.

He dismantles religion with impeccable religion and logic. Give it a read.

I've read all of his books almost, including the God Delusion

He does not dismantle religion at all, how about you watch some of his debates and see him get torn to shreds by practically anyone?

There was even a debate between him and John Lennox on the issue OF the God Delusion book, and he lost that one too.


So please Don't be such a boring conformist

Fuck, even Ben Stein owned Richard Dawkins and forced him to admit that we were created.

Give me a fucking break

I'll watch it..but I fail to see how it is possible for him to "lose" any debate on religion..because the burden of proof is on those claiming creation/God to be fact. Until they produce solid evidence (that the earth is 6000 years old and God created man out of a woman's rib) to compete with the solid evidence we have on natural selection, evolution, the true age of the universe, etc. they can never truly "win" any debate on the subject.

Yes, theists can.

The burden of proof is on neither of the two groups.

Naturalism, while many think it is, is not grounded 100% in science. A lot of what Dawkins says is not scientific at all, merely philosophical statements he's making about science.

The question of God's existence is one that science cannot decide, even Dawkins admits this on a number of occasions. This is why he admits that "There is a strong case for the existence of God" in one of his more recent interviews.

Don't get me wrong, Dawkins is a decent biologist but he does not understand religion well enough nor does he understand philosophy well enough to make the bold and "ear catching" statements he does.

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Originally posted by Alex Fuck, even Ben Stein owned Richard Dawkins and forced him to admit that we were created. Give me a fucking break

hypocrite. why don't you put yourself on ignore?

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Originally posted by Capitalizt I'll watch it..but I fail to see how it is possible for him to "lose" any debate on religion..because the burden of proof is on those claiming creation/God to be fact. Until they produce solid evidence (that the earth is 6000 years old and God created man out of a woman's rib) to compete with the solid evidence we have on natural selection, evolution, the true age of the universe, etc. they can never truly "win" any debate on the subject.

The only people who could "win" a debate on the existence of god(s) are agnostics. There is a burden of proof on both theists and atheists as both of them take a positive and definite position. For a theist to "win" they would have to produce proof of God, for an atheist to "win" they would have to produce proof there is no god (remember; atheists take the positive position that there is no god, not that the existence of god has not been proven... there is a very important distinction there). Since we cannot produce overwhelmingly persuasive proof of the existence of a/any god(s) or the existence of no god(s) the only position that does not require faith is that of the agnostics.

You're challenge that proof of the earth's age at or near 6000 years old and the nature of the creation of Eve only applies to one interpretation of two faiths, which illustrates that you clearly don't understand the debate to begin with. Moreover, you suggest that natural selection, evolution, and cosmology are evidence that no god(s) exists; this is a logical fallacy... you cannot conclude anything on the nature/existence of god/no god based on any of these things; rather, you can only make conclusions on natural selection, evolution, and cosmology.

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