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Bass - How?

One of the areas I need massive improvement in is Bass I have spent a lot of time learning theory, fx, etc but not bass.

If anyone has time could someone run me through how to construct a big trancey bass the layers, sounds, and how to process the sound after your happy with it.

Bass is an afterthought in my productions where as I know that Bass is key to a good production. Sure it could make a useful thread.

What DAW are you using?

Can you honesty say you've read (and tried) everything in this thread relating to bass lines?

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...037&forumid=48&

The best piece of advice I can give you is to try writing a track, starting with the bass line. You'll probably learn a lot more about what you want to acheive becuase your focus will be on the bass line first, and the restof the elements after that.

I've always done this anyway just because I was crap at music theory and found it a safe way to start a project, so for me, the bass is anything but an after thought.

Bass is the hardest part of a track to get right, and if you dont the track can never turn out good.

But tbh, i dont think it can be taught by anyone else but yourself.

Learning sidechaining can get you a long way though.

And you need the kick to play along as well, again you need to use your ears here too.

Also, low cut those lead sounds and pads, all of them!

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle Bass is the hardest part of a track to get right, and if you dont the track can never turn out good. But tbh, i dont think it can be taught by anyone else but yourself. Learning sidechaining can get you a long way though. And you need the kick to play along as well, again you need to use your ears here too. Also, low cut those lead sounds and pads, all of them!

Good advice, but the strange thing is, I've never once used sidechain on any tracks (not for bass anyway).

Tbh mate, there is endless variations.

You can whack together a bass in 3xOSC like this in 5 mins.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/ogc4ji

Pretty basic I know, but it would work for some tunes.

What sorta bass you after?

Im using Cubase sx3

I do know how to side chain, I just mean that (and maybe I should have not said afterthought) When I write a bass it is just an oompa following the root note or just one synth playing some basic pattern. I know nothing about sub bass I hear some tracks where the sub bass appears to be moving under the bass almost driving the track. I also see people on here talking about layering basslines etc and paying attention to each frequency like having a mid bass and a low bass etc.

I also dont process my bass ever well not individually just end stage mastering. Someone on here the other day was talking about stereo image for basslines i thought they were pretty central.

All i do is pick a preset and make a pattern I get real into all the other parts of the track I just havent with bass wanted some pointers

I had not checked that thread which I am gonna do now thanks for suggesting it.

quote:

Originally posted by Lunar Phase 7 Pretty basic I know, but it would work for some tunes. What sorta bass you after?

The sort you just uploaded what did you do? What kind of pattern? that would go great with the melodic thing im trying to do now.

EDIT:1 Also did you reverse the section just before it kicks in thats a cool effect!

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle Bass is the hardest part of a track to get right, and if you dont the track can never turn out good. But tbh, i dont think it can be taught by anyone else but yourself. Learning sidechaining can get you a long way though. And you need the kick to play along as well, again you need to use your ears here too. Also, low cut those lead sounds and pads, all of them!

Nah, Bass isn't the *hardest* part to get right, id say its the composition. If you make the bass properly you won't need to side chain much.

Bass has two parts, the bass and the sub. And its easy if you seperate those tracks. The bass is the 200hz + range. The sub is down in the 0-200hz range with the kick.

I find that for the sub of the kick and the bass, if they notes don't hit on the same beat,there isn't much to worry about. And if they do, then you need to blend them. They are sub, they don't need to be distinct, and also you don't want the sub and the bass to have the same melody. The sub benefits most when its extremely simple. Most trance, or edm in general, that i have heard, the whole sub is at most 3-4 notes. in trance its usually one note. at least that is what i have noticed. the bass however is a normal melody like the lead.

in short, the bass and sub should be seperate, it makes things very easy to work with, and you don't want the sub playing all the same notes as the bass, come up with a new yet similar melody based on the root key of the bass.

I'll make an example mp3

Composition is getting loads easier for me Im doing a course in music theory and as soon as you have a great progression the melodies etc become much easier. Interested to know what you mean by sub and bass playing different melody I would never ever in a million years do that for some reason I thought it "broke the rules" for want of a better phrase.

quote:

Originally posted by Sonic_c Im using Cubase sx3 I do know how to side chain, I just mean that (and maybe I should have not said afterthought) When I write a bass it is just an oompa following the root note or just one synth playing some basic pattern. I know nothing about sub bass I hear some tracks where the sub bass appears to be moving under the bass almost driving the track. I also see people on here talking about layering basslines etc and paying attention to each frequency like having a mid bass and a low bass etc.

Sub bass is often just a part of the bassline, its not necessarily made on purpose, its just there.
And dont layer a bassline just for the sake of it, listen and hear if it needs layering

Oh and yeah the more notes you use for the bass, the harder its gonna be to mix it, since bass often looses power on certain notes.. that can be a bitch.

http://soundwolf.net/?page_id=153

Great info here, just read it and try to follow it all before you whine and complain.

Here is an example, took less than 5 minute to make. its not my idea of "perfect" but it proves a point, the bass and sub play different melodies.





This is just an example of how i do it, other people may do things differently.

quote:

Originally posted by cronodevir Here is an example, took less than 5 minute to make. its not my idea of "perfect" but it proves a point, the bass and sub play different melodies.

Wierd, never heard of anyone using different notes for sub and bass, yeah it does work.. but i could not imagine it.
I rarely ever make sub bass, but interesting!

I do it because in the sub, as one user mentioned, the dynamics can change a lot, take out a osciliscope [sp?] and play with the low bass keys of a sound, the wave is dramaticly different for each key, despite being only one key up/down. You could have a solid bass, but then go one key up, and it just drops off the face of the earth. So if you keep the sub simple yet still following the theme of the bass, you can control it alot better. Your regular bass melody may have a high note or so [look at my example image] where the sub vanishes...[that isn't good]

quote:

Originally posted by Sonic_c The sort you just uploaded what did you do? What kind of pattern? that would go great with the melodic thing im trying to do now. EDIT:1 Also did you reverse the section just before it kicks in thats a cool effect!

Really basic man. I'll try break it down as best I can.



I used this kick

http://www.sendspace.com/file/ao1525

Notice the tail of the kick has a lot of sub rumble to it?

Subtle mentioned sub bass sort of just happens. And this is a fine example. The kick has punch at the start, but the tail has good sub content.

Notice this sub is about where the offbeat bass you speak of usually goes. Because of this my bassline I made does not require lots of low end, I opt for a more mid bass style sound. So the low end is filled up evenly.

Here is the bass solo

http://www.sendspace.com/file/40b19v

As Subtle also correctly pointed out, it is pointless to layer sounds for the hell of it. This bass is simply a single saw tooth wav form, I have use the filter envelop to make it 'plucky' and then used a simple 'rolling' style notation.

Here is a picture of the synth/notation

http://www.sendspace.com/file/wwfp8z

The only processing I did was a bit of eq, I cut some very low out of it, and then some mid where it sounded a bit 'plasticy'.

Throw some loops over the top and viola!

Literally took 5 mins, less than if you dont count the loops/ silly effects I did.

(Incidentally that reverse effect was dblue Glitch, just reversed the last bar of the bass.)

There you have it. It's not ground breaking, but it works. Hope this helped. Sorry for the ghetto uploads too, I will buy webspace one day.

i make my basslines in layers. and look out for octaves and diffrent ranges. kick placement is important to.
key thing here always make the bassline and kick on its own! it sets the staple for the rest off the track.

and helps keep things in key

bass is a pain... its like women, you can fuking love or fuking hate them....

I no nothing of sidechaining also, but mate explained to me although i never used it. I find that moog has some pretty decent basses for trance. Vanguard can be good also, in the LD section (screw the BS. I think they r shit) but I would suggest using a lowerer sound also as they can eb quite high (and are unaudible too low)

erm.... what else to say that i know. Nexus has some decent bases also.. A one i liek is called 'bigdad' or something like that... but play around with it. Even try adding some fx, such as bassbooster in fruity, or even delay to make it hop all over the place (although this is hard to get right I think)

I just did a 'answers' remake, and used moog 'polite bass' along with 'bigdad' from nexus and really like it...

Bass is the easiest for me.

For the fact that a lot of bass is being dulled out and all the his cut out. (in the majority of tracks) Hi's and mid's are where all the sonic character, overtones, lfos and intricacies are heard.

I'm thinking the problem may not be your bass at all but every thing else besides the bass.
Try building a track that sounds good with NO bassline at all. Fill out all the synths, drums, pads & fx, make it sound full and it can actually sound pretty thick w/out any bass at all (except for the kick).
THEN, put a bass in, run it through a low pass, get the notes right so it grooves, and even though the bass is there its not exactly prevalent in most tracks. It just kind of thickens things out and helps drive the kick drum. Are there some sick ass tracks that drive soley on bass? Yes, indeed, but its rare for a reason. The brighter sounds are usually the ones that pay off when you pay more attention to them, bass is def important, but not to the extent where it should be the harder element to work with in your mix.

ya mon

bass is 99% mixing skills. the sounds and patterns are very simple. but they have to work in the mixing context. that's why a lot of people fail with basslines. they are just not experienced enough to have the right mixing skills for proper basslines.

Get a good set of monitors and you will make great bass.

You could be making a great bass but wont know its great if your not monitoring it properly.

If your talking about basses like
Haris C - Back On Track(Big bang mix)
Alex MORPH - Sunshine(Nitrous Oxide remix)

There are probaly 2 layers of bass , or sections , the sub and the mid bass.

The mid bass is probaly the most 'hearable' bass in the track , but it doesn't feel 'bassy' Mid bass are probaly those sawtooth bass you hear.
And the Sub bass is the reinforcement , it kinda reinforce the mid bass , by making it more 'bassy'. They are generally not loud , but its just there for the listerner to 'feel' the bass. Most sub bass are real bass guitars(I think) or just pure sine waves.

Thats what i think.

I made a sample , with the bassline in it.. Tell me what you think


[[ LINK REMOVED ]]

quote:

Originally posted by 9Vibes If your talking about basses like Haris C - Back On Track(Big bang mix) Alex MORPH - Sunshine(Nitrous Oxide remix) There are probaly 2 layers of bass , or sections , the sub and the mid bass. The mid bass is probaly the most 'hearable' bass in the track , but it doesn't feel 'bassy' Mid bass are probaly those sawtooth bass you hear. And the Sub bass is the reinforcement , it kinda reinforce the mid bass , by making it more 'bassy'. They are generally not loud , but its just there for the listerner to 'feel' the bass. Most sub bass are real bass guitars(I think) or just pure sine waves. Thats what i think.

Yes, you can layer basses. But I personally feel it is better to get one sound right first before trying to make complex arrangements using many layers of bass sounds. It's tricky to mix a sine wave with other waves and not either:

a) swamp your track with muddy low end.

or

b) kill the effect fo your mid bass.

Btw, you did neither, good effort!

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