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Shoud we be worried about the LA underground scene?

Here's an interesting article from Metromix. I posted the link in the AUDIT thread, but this needs its own.

http://losangeles.metromix.com/webt...erground/964764

quote:

Overhauling the underground Warehouse parties go legit�but can they keep their edge? By Ramie Becker Far away from the velvet-roped clubs of Hollywood, a dance culture thrives in Downtown's previously deserted warehouse spaces�or at least it did until the LAPD crashed the party. 2008 was a turbulent year for these underground parties, most of which are illegal. In either a uniformed or an undercover capacity, the police have been almost omnipresent, shutting down parties for everything from noise and permit violations to illegal alcohol sales. Consequently, event-producing collectives such as Space Island, the Do Lab, Ninja Skillz, Plump and HipGenesis have forsaken warehouses in favor of legal, mainstream venues. Even groups steeped in the nu-rave and nu-disco movements, like the optimistic USC-based Danceism, no longer take their chances. "Underground parties are like cockroaches: You'll always find them where it's dark and dirty," says DJ Wolfie, a veteran promoter, producer and DJ who laments the loss of Downtown's "dark and dirty" past. Following a series of close calls, injuries and increased police scrutiny, Wolfie finally cashed in his party-throwing chips and retired from the underground in 2008, effectively dissolving his production team, HipGenesis. "It's only bars and clubs for me from now on," he says. "It's just too much of a headache to operate at unpermitted venues anymore." These cycles of party boom and bust are nothing new to underground dance culture. Drug sweeps in the late '90s and early '00s, along with the Illicit Drug Anti-Proliferation Act passed in 2003 (which made it possible to prosecute promoters for drug use at party venues), spurred many promoters to seek out mainstream alternatives. As a result, megaclubs like Vanguard and Avalon have soaked up much of the warehouse party clientele. But with the surge of social-media websites like Going.com and Tribe.net, the underground thrived again�and at a pace that outstripped police resources. By 2005, Downtown parties had picked up, this time tinged with the burgeoning subculture of Burning Man. Nightlife calendars filled quickly with fantasy-themed warehouse bashes, busting at the seams with heavily costumed (and intoxicated) partygoers. A sizeable swath of stripped-down techno crews and art-punk ensembles also stormed in, resulting in a flurry of activity that the police and even the DEA couldn't react to fast enough. Until now. Officer Ernesto Vicencio, of the Police Commission Office, explains why such parties are under fire: "First, it's all the residential development going on downtown. Now these parties have neighbors living next door, and they call in and complain about the noise." He adds, "Secondly, we've ramped up our organization and communication between the different branches. The fire marshal, Building and Safety, the Police Commission and vice units�we are all in the loop and are liaisoning to keep each other informed of where and when parties are happening." When asked about undercover police action, Vicencio replies, "Without saying too much, I can tell you that there is always undercover activity." Seasoned party promoter DJ Travis Lea is convinced he felt the undercover squeeze via a plainclothes officer at his monthly Plump party at Hangar 51, which was busted Nov. 15 as part of a police sweep that allegedly shut down six parties in one night. Now Lea and his partner owe approximately $1,000 in lawyer fees and are on probation for one year. None of this has stopped Lea from throwing his events, however. He's just going the legal route now, taking over 1018 Studios, a permitted venue with an art gallery vibe, and getting permits. The Do Lab, which throws some of the most elaborate events of this kind (such as the four-day Lightning in a Bottle festival) has also had to deal with permit complications and utilizes only legal venues these days. Do Lab's massive bohemian ball Lucent L'amour (see photos), held almost annually in February, is perhaps the crown jewel of the warehouse party circuit. And while this year�s Valentine�s Day event (featuring superstar DJs Z-Trip, Adam Freeland and Kazell) went off without incident, last year's event was almost canceled. It was set to take place at a raw warehouse known as the 2415 space (near the intersection of Santa Fe Avenue and Washington Boulevard), but Do Lab organizers learned less than a week before the event that the space failed to obtain proper permits and had caught the attention of LAPD vice officers in the past. "We were under the impression that it was a permitted space," recalls Do Lab's Jesse Flemming. "We were misled." "It was ridiculously stressful scrambling to relocate all our decorations, art installations and sound equipment on such short notice," says Do Lab's Dede Flemming, who helped hastily move the event to the 4,000-square-foot Premiere Events Space on Imperial Street. For many promoters, including HipGenesis' DJ darkMatter, the writing is on the wall: "I don't know what's going on with the city government, but I'm telling all my people, 'Get the freakin' permits for your damn party!'" While some underground die-hards call it selling out or going corporate, for the Do Lab, it's the only feasible course of action. "You've got to take care of your attendees, their safety and well-being," says Dede Flemming. In the meantime, venues like Premiere Events Space that already have these legalities taken care of have been inundated with business. Dave Young, of Premiere Events, thinks the police must really be cracking down. "We've been getting tons of calls from promoters looking for a last-minute venue change," he says. "We're booked almost solidly through April." What does the future hold for warehouse nightlife? It's tough to say. Undoubtedly, the line between underground and legal events has blurred, which raises the question of whether it's the venue or the culture that defines a scene as underground or mainstream. Wolfie says, "We are entering an era where our underground scene is quietly ending, and an era that I call 'alternaground' is beginning. [It's] underground culture in mainstream venues." �2009 Metromix.com

nah, that scene died years ago.

quote:

Originally posted by DizkokidD nah, that scene died years ago.

*snicker*

I used to throw underground parties in the late 90's early '00's. I did them both in LA and OC, and boy, it's a bitch doing those parties. I'm done throwing them.

The cops raided one of my warehouse parties. I thought the placed had gotten all the permits, after all I had signed a lease for one day. So when the cops showed up, I showed them my lease and the keys to the warehouse. Three months later, they showed up to my school and arrested me in class. That was embarrasing. It turned out to be that the guy who leased me the warehouse was a fraud. He ripped me off, and basically they were trying to charge me with braking & entering, giving alcohol to minors and other shit.

Eventually they dropped the charges. But they did prohibit me from attending or throwing underground parties in the city for a year. And what do you know, a few months later I went to an underground, it got raided and the cop who busted me before was there. He recognized me and gave me a lecture but let me go without charges. I lucked out.

Oh yeah, another thing that fucked it up for us was all the people OD'ing at the parties. It got really dangerous.

Vanguard & 740 used to be underground spots. Vanguard used to be called Q-Topia and 740 used to have another name. Both crackhouses! lol

If you look up an event called CIRCA 97 at the LA SPORTS ARENA, that's when everything started going downhill. A shit load of people overdosed on GHB that night. That party was all over the news & radio that day. I remember it like it was yesterday.

quote:

Originally posted by DjWoody Oh yeah, another thing that fucked it up for us was all the people OD'ing at the parties. It got really dangerous. Vanguard & 740 used to be underground spots. Vanguard used to be called Q-Topia and 740 used to have another name. Both crackhouses! lol If you look up an event called CIRCA 97 at the LA SPORTS ARENA, that's when everything started going downhill. A shit load of people overdosed on GHB that night. That party was all over the news & radio that day. I remember it like it was yesterday.

You are confusing "underground" with "rave." Q-topia (Vanguard) and Orion (740) were fully permitted venues. Yes, they were essentially crackhouses, but they were legal. Neither venue had alcohol sales because they did not have the permits.

it's all about perception. i'm sure the big "underground" parties thrown in downtown secure their permits anyway. the promoter just needs to work on the experience.

of course, it's no fun if you're not taking any risks.

If "Metromix" (The LA times company) says the underground is dead.. you listen

Their writers also said the UNDERGROUND is alive!! (about 3 months ago)

quote:

Originally posted by |Thrax| If "Metromix" (The LA times company) says the underground is dead.. you listen Their writers also said the UNDERGROUND is alive!! (about 3 months ago)

The article says nothing about the scene dying. It says there is a movement toward more legitimate events. Please read it again and then respond. Thanks for playing!

Let's not overthink things here. We are here to dance and party. Who cares what some newspaper says. We know what is what and we fucking know what's up.

Seems as though if you stay legit you wouldn't have a problem. I don't see why you can't throw an "underground" warehouser and still be within your legal limits

I'm not playing.

Should we take caution? yes. Will there always be a chance of a legitimate event getting shut down. Unfortunately, yes.
I'm all for parties of any type, as long as the crowd agree's.

edit: fuck me, you posted the same article I read back in feb. Which is what I was using as a point of reference.
http://losangeles.metromix.com/bars-and-clubs/article/overhauling-the-underground/964764/content

quote:

Originally posted by Brian Scott You are confusing "underground" with "rave." Q-topia (Vanguard) and Orion (740) were fully permitted venues. Yes, they were essentially crackhouses, but they were legal. Neither venue had alcohol sales because they did not have the permits.

Unfortunately to the cops they are both the same shit.

That still doesn't change the fact that back in the late 90's when I was doing underground parties in LA people were OD'ing. The cops and fire department started busting every type of warehouse party legit or not. There was times when there were warehouse parties literally down the street from each other. Sometimes the cops would just chill outside, sometimes they would bust them. Eitherway, they were fun until they all started getting busted.

Hey, its UNDERGROUND. So there is ALWAYS a risk to get busted etc. So just always take precautions and always be ready to ditch whatever stuff you have in a moments notice, and you'll be relatively ok.

I know someone who promotes in the Deep and Jackin House scene who just got taken into court and will be in front of a judge next week.

Having said that, other than Audit, there were two other parties that got closed last week. One of them was right behind the venue where HEAR happened last Saturday. But HEAR just stopped their music for 30min to 1 hr I heard, and continued after, without a hitch when the cops cleared the other party.

I honestly think its when the undercover cops feel in doing it that they raid back and forth. Really has no rhyme or reason, just when they feel like it. Ergo, the LA Underground scene just has its ups and downs.

In the meantime, WOMB and BIANCA's JOINT awaits til the smoke clears.

quote:

Originally posted by alan Hey, its UNDERGROUND. So there is ALWAYS a risk to get busted etc. So just always take precautions and always be ready to ditch whatever stuff you have in a moments notice, and you'll be relatively ok. I know someone who promotes in the Deep and Jackin House scene who just got taken into court and will be in front of a judge next week. Having said that, other than Audit, there were two other parties that got closed last week. One of them was right behind the venue where HEAR happened last Saturday. But HEAR just stopped their music for 30min to 1 hr I heard, and continued after, without a hitch when the cops cleared the other party. I honestly think its when the undercover cops feel in doing it that they raid back and forth. Really has no rhyme or reason, just when they feel like it. Ergo, the LA Underground scene just has its ups and downs. In the meantime, WOMB and BIANCA's JOINT awaits til the smoke clears.

There have been several events shut down prematurely by the authorities over the last few weeks. It seems we're in the "flow" part of the ebb and flow that is LAPD cracking down on underground events.

Bas is correct: It is definitely within the realms of reason to expect to put together a good event while still working within the law. I know we're looking to make our July event 100% permitted and we will probably do so for every event subsequently.

It also sounds like it's not 100% the promoter at fault. I mean if the owner of a venue says they have permits for something and they don't, what can you do? I've never actually thrown a party I have no idea if that's how it works

quote:

Originally posted by bas It also sounds like it's not 100% the promoter at fault. I mean if the owner of a venue says they have permits for something and they don't, what can you do? I've never actually thrown a party I have no idea if that's how it works

In some cases, yes, that's how it works

The cops are pretty cool about it though. When I was at the AUDIT party they were going to let us continue, but then I think they got upset about the bar situation and then decided to shutter it.

But they weren't asses about it.

I think location is key as well - if you are away from normal areas, don't do all ages (like 21 and over), and use a list as though its a private party, then you don't really warrant too much attention especially if there are easier targets to hit elsewhere.

That being said, I do wish they'd just leave us alone. Aren't there other more pressing issues to be worried about rather than a couple hundred people getting together to dance?

BTW, any amount under 50 people is not considered a public gathering and does not fall under the jurisdiction of the Fire Marshall, FWIW.

rob.

best line ever!

"Underground parties are like cockroaches: You'll always find them where it's dark and dirty,"

I don't know how it is now since I haven't been to an underground in years. But back when I was promoting, there also used to be beef between promoters. Than it got ugly and they used to call the cops on each others parties.

Than once in a while you'll get the one person who you didn't let in at one of your events or for some reason doesn't like you and calls the cops on you.

I know a girl who did that. They didn't let her into a club and she called in underage drinking. Before you know it, the club got raided.

that's just fucked up...i know it happens, but wtf? come on people, grow up...if you have to call in other parties either cause of beef or trying to get people into your event instead, maybe this isn't the scene for you...i know i'm gonna hear it for saying that one but its my opinion...maybe i'm just too into the music to understand all the other drama that goes down

i assume that was kiddie parties..


Brian, I'm sorry I jumped to conclusions.. we all need to be safe.
bronze planet just went off without a hitch though.

quote:

Originally posted by |Thrax| i assume that was kiddie parties.. Brian, I'm sorry I jumped to conclusions.. we all need to be safe. bronze planet just went off without a hitch though.

Glad to hear the planetary series remains in full swing. Good tunes and good people at those events always.

I think we were just unfortunate to pick a venue that was already in the cross hairs of the authorities. We'll be sure to do a better job in selecting the next location for July 18 event.

You guys should try to find a place that's LITERALLY underground. Like some bomb shelter or something. Worst case scenario, a sewer.

quote:

Originally posted by bas You guys should try to find a place that's LITERALLY underground. Like some bomb shelter or something. Worst case scenario, a sewer.

Fuck it, let's do it in my basement at home. I can fit upward of 11 people in there.

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