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Should producers DJ?

I was thinking the other day that DJs and crowds would be a lot better off if producers stayed in their studios and didn�t play gigs.

Disregarding the fact that DJing is a money-maker and this is how most producers earn their living, the biggest problem with producers playing DJ sets is that the crowd expects certain things from them. Irrespective of whether you�re seeing Tiesto, LTJ Bukem or Gui Boratto, the knowledgeable people in the audience will general be split into two opposing mindsets: �he didn�t play x and y classics that I wanted to hear� and �he only played all his old shit that we�ve heard a million times.�

It seems to me that having prior experience with a producer�s work tends to ruin the experience of seeing them play, because you�re expecting something in particular from them and are likely to be disappointed.
Some of the best shows I�ve ever been to have been those where I�ve been completely ignorant of who I�m seeing and what kind of stuff they play. Shouldn�t the point of DJing be to hear a well-crafted, coherent set with all the elements being equal rather than waiting for a producer to drop his big hit and passing over everything else he plays? These days I�ve often found that the local nobody playing the warm up set entertains me far more than the international headliner, again the result of me having no prior expectations.

Perhaps this is my fault for pidgeon-holing producers without considering their overall merits, but I have noticed that most people tend to do this too. It seems a bit inevitable. To be clear, I�m talking about DJ sets, not live shows like Underworld and the like.

Thoughts?

some of them can, most of them really can't

the dynamics of production and keeping a dance floor well fed for a few hours are really night and day.

a producer can make a great tracks.

he usually can't mix it in a live setting and have enough time to find other music to compliment said tracks and stay current because of the time involved in making good productions.

plus if i just want to see people show off their own shit, 2 girls one cup is usually more entertaining.

and i don't mean the guy in my avatar because he is the jesus of dance music sans pose.

i think the thread should be about prolific producers vs those that release maybe 5 tracks a year.

quote:

Originally posted by lenazi some of them can, most of them really can't the dynamics of production and keeping a dance floor well fed for a few hours are really night and day. a producer can make a great tracks. he usually can't mix it in a live setting and have enough time to find other music to compliment said tracks and stay current because of the time involved in making good productions. plus if i just want to see people show off their own shit, 2 girls one cup is usually more entertaining.

I'm not debating whether or not producers make good DJs. My point is that they could play the best fucking set in the world and the audience could still be dissapointed and complain that they didn't play their big hit from last summer.

I think you are being a tad harsh there, anyway. There are plenty of great DJ/producer combos. Adam Beyer springs to mind.

read my second post

I'd go ahead and say that it's the party-goer's fault and not the producer's

Although, in some cases the DJ whores out his own productions in every gig he plays which creates expectations in the party-goers. PvD and Tiesto are perfect examples of this. I still can't believe Tiesto is still playing his remix of "Silence" in every damn set.

there are plenty of producers that are not trance guys that play more of their tracks then they should.

it is all about balance and knowing how to control a dance floor. If you pelt them non stop with what they expect is that really fun? No, take them on a ride with a few "hello you know this one don't you you bunch of cheeky monkeys" moment.

The best tracks of a dj set are the ones you don't see coming that still make the place lose their mind. I'm not talking being obscure for the sake of being obscure, but there is nothing wrong with taking your time with a captive audience and saying " don't know this one eh fuckerss? put down your pens, its time to groove".


*fist pumping in boxers.*

I agree with Demoted. I never quite thought of it that way, but he's got a point. I've often had certain expectations when seeing DJs whose productions I know play.

I guess one just shouldn't have those kinds of expectations. The reason being is that it's very hard to pay attention to the music they're playing when you're expecting that one track. Hard to do, I suppose, but like you said, they have to make a living, and who says they don't necessarily DJ well either. And I think there's nothing wrong with asking a DJ to play a track if they produced it.

quote:

Originally posted by woscar I'd go ahead and say that it's the party-goer's fault and not the producer's Although, in some cases the DJ whores out his own productions in every gig he plays which creates expectations in the party-goers. PvD and Tiesto are perfect examples of this. I still can't believe Tiesto is still playing his remix of "Silence" in every damn set.

I agree. It is the party-goer's fault. However, as holding silly expectation is something I recognise in myself yet still do, perhaps it's an inevitable thing?

I also feel sorry for the producers who DJ though. There is huge pressure on them from promoters and clubbers to play 'that' track of theirs, and they lose a lot of creative freedom in their sets when compared with someone who has made none or few productions.

did you go see brendan moeller?

he played nothing that i expected him too, and it was more memorable because of that imo.

I arrived at the very end of his set

sorry to hear that he would have blown you away.

you want to know what you are getting go see deadmau5.

i'll take the talent and people who know what they are doing anyday over an artist that the edm noob is pissed at because he didn't play said track.

the whole concept misses the point on what a good party should be. Save the chin stroking and the train spotting for the dj promo forums, and let someone shine how they see fit imo.

"omg villalobos did not play the 808 bass queen"

i say fucking great, because he played some of the best house music that he did not produce from the decade past.

maybe it is just me. having a good time and listening to great music > track listing and waiting for that big cheap pop.

i will add that look at a talented dj when he plays his "big track", you can see the pain in his face most of the time.

quote:

Originally posted by lenazi sorry to hear that he would have blown you away. you want to know what you are getting go see deadmau5. i'll take the talent and people who know what they are doing anyday over an artist that the edm noob is pissed at because he didn't play said track. the whole concept misses the point on what a good party should be. Save the chin stroking and the train spotting for the dj promo forums, and let someone shine how they see fit imo. "omg villalobos did not play the 808 bass queen" i say fucking great, because he played some of the best house music that he did not produce from the decade past. maybe it is just me. having a good time and listening to great music > track listing and waiting for that big cheap pop.

That's the whole point (which you've clearly been missing).

I hardly ever have a good night when I go to see a producer and know their tracks. When I've seen guys like Pappa or Hernan with very productions, however, they always blow me away (but also because they are just plain good DJs).

I would much prefer to go out and not know a single tune rather than hear mostly tracks I know. My whole point is that it's hard to break out of that mould when you're always seeing producers play. It would be better if the two professions were seperate I think.

quote:

Originally posted by lenazi i will add that look at a talented dj when he plays his "big track", you can see the pain in his face most of the time.

True, but not always.

One of the best club moments I've experienced was hearing Green Velvet do La La Land by playing the dub and singing the vocals live. He clearly loved it and I've have rarely seen a place jump like that. It was ages after the track was released too.

i'm not missing the point, because i am half in the bag and not really reading your posts.

it is about balance. I can't be just shit that people do not know, because that is no good either.

it is almost like the debate of bomb vs filler.

you keep dropping bombs and no one will be there at the end. You drop none = rinse and repeat. Djing is so muh more deep than actual skill, and so little actually understand it (i can even put myself in that category because even if i think i can do 2 hours of pwn...danny howells comes along and does 14 hours without breaking a sweat and no one leaves the floor.)

quote:

Originally posted by Domesticated True, but not always. One of the best club moments I've experienced was hearing Green Velvet do La La Land by playing the dub and singing the vocals live. He clearly loved it and I've have rarely seen a place jump like that. It was ages after the track was released too.

i saw this too and wanted to kill him lol. Maybe it was the drugs, but a big black alien looking dude singing completely off key was not fun;p

quote:

Originally posted by Domesticated My whole point is that it's hard to break out of that mould when you're always seeing producers play. It would be better if the two professions were seperate I think.

I don't find that hard at all, actually. Maybe at first when I had absolutely no idea what a DJ did and thought that he was making the tracks on the go.

Actually, I prefer it when they DON'T play their "huge tracks" because most of the time they just force them in and end up disrupting the flow just for the sake of playing the damn track.

quote:

Originally posted by woscar I still can't believe Tiesto is still playing his remix of "Silence" in every damn set.

And you don't love that??? =p

And hey, even Union Jack and Art of Trance do the occasional show.

I don't understand the point of making the question so broad.


If you're good at DJing, you should do it, if you're good at producing and have interesting ideas, you should also do that.

Pretty simple, and should be judged on a case by case basis.

quote:

Originally posted by Lews And you don't love that??? =p

I did. 8 years ago.

Right now, I really don't care as I don't listen to Trance anymore. But I've seen the occasional tracklist and a few threads here talking about his recent sets and it's just LULZ.

Oh I know. I consider myself stuck in the past (None of my mixes use music post 2001-ish era) and I love it. And I love Silence. It's a great track, though I only listen to it maybe once a month, 11:35 so fucking long, and still haven't used it in a mix.

But I try to expand what I listen to to more modern stuff (House, Techno, and the like... fuck modern "trance" ) and other stuff [right now loving Jay's Mix ] and when I see his tracklists its like... christ. That shit should be done by someone like me, not by you. Every concert, Silence? Really? Why not Traffic, Flight 643, Adagio, and Lethal? Oh they're in there too? Oh... My bad.

quote:

Originally posted by Clovis I don't understand the point of making the question so broad. If you're good at DJing, you should do it, if you're good at producing and have interesting ideas, you should also do that. Pretty simple, and should be judged on a case by case basis.

Nail, head.

Good producers should produce, good DJs should DJ. Some of them happen to be good at both.

quote:

Originally posted by Clovis I don't understand the point of making the question so broad. If you're good at DJing, you should do it, if you're good at producing and have interesting ideas, you should also do that. Pretty simple, and should be judged on a case by case basis.

even if u look like a gay i have to agree.

and even then, if you are taking the time to judge during an event the dj probably sucks because you stopped moving and started thinking.

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