TranceAddict Forums (www.tranceaddict.com/forums)
- Production Studio
-- Quick question about drum loops

Quick question about drum loops

Hi folks,

I'm wondering if any of you can shed any light on this. Okay so you've all heard the hundreds of pre-made loops on the likes of the vengeance CD's etc... My question tho is have any of you been able to produce drums of the same quality of a sample cd loop using one shots? I am just wondering where drum loops originate from because as far as I know, vengeance guys rip loops from tracks, but how where the loops created for the track they ripped it from... one shots? Vengeance one shots or other one shots? Where did the samples start from and who are the people creating the loops lol?

Drum loops of the quality you get on sample cds seem to be somewhat unatainable to me as without using a few loops myself my drums tend to sound 'one shotty' if you get me?

My question is very vaugue lol so if you can shed any light its appreciated.

Thanks

Drum machines , synths , banging of kitchen hardware etc.

But I think , most people get other one shots and massively edit them (effects and all) , such that they become a totally new sound.
Like , you can feed a tr 909 a piece of bitcrushing.. And the new sound is totally different.

Re: Quick question about drum loops

quote:

Originally posted by maclean Drum loops of the quality you get on sample cds seem to be somewhat unatainable to me as without using a few loops myself my drums tend to sound 'one shotty' if you get me?

Its the swing in the loops that makes them a bit tricky to make.

Re: Re: Quick question about drum loops

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle Its the swing in the loops that makes them a bit tricky to make.

Ten points to Ableton's Groove Pool .

Re: Re: Re: Quick question about drum loops

quote:

Originally posted by Acton Ten points to Ableton's Groove Pool .

+10,000

Re: Re: Quick question about drum loops

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle Its the swing in the loops that makes them a bit tricky to make.

Some have no swing.

I think it has more to do with processing.

I have tried to make loops out of the one shots and it's hard to make them sound as good as the loops.

I imagine the loops come from songs, and might be reprocessed again. A lot of vengeance stuff sounds noisy.

I've made a few drum loops using one shots for some of the sample developers out there. Obviously, having a good sense of rhythm/feel is important, and it's important to know when/what to quantize, what to swing, and what to just play loose. Having a good interface for creating your rhythms also helps, which is why I really love my Maschine. I think it's pretty easy to do from a production standpoint and requires little processing IF you have quality samples. A good example are the Wave Alchemy samples - the demo loops from their upcoming Drum Tools library were made by various users and, from what I can tell, are all using very little processing.

http://www.wavealchemy.co.uk/products.php?fs

Cue in player and hit the play button. The loops I made are from 2:13 to the end and use almost no processing, aside from some of Maschines built-in effects (reverb, bitcrusher, etc.).

quote:

Originally posted by Beatflux I have tried to make loops out of the one shots and it's hard to make them sound as good as the loops. A lot of vengeance stuff sounds noisy.

I agree, and most are way overcompressed, which is why I think that most of their loops sound pretty bad.

quote:

Originally posted by cryophonik I've made a few drum loops using one shots for some of the sample developers out there. Obviously, having a good sense of rhythm/feel is important, and it's important to know when/what to quantize, what to swing, and what to just play loose. Having a good interface for creating your rhythms also helps, which is why I really love my Maschine. I think it's pretty easy to do from a production standpoint and requires little processing IF you have quality samples. A good example are the Wave Alchemy samples - the demo loops from their upcoming Drum Tools library were made by various users and, from what I can tell, are all using very little processing. http://www.wavealchemy.co.uk/products.php?fs Cue in player and hit the play button. The loops I made are from 2:13 to the end and use almost no processing, aside from some of Maschines built-in effects (reverb, bitcrusher, etc.). I agree, and most are way overcompressed, which is why I think that most of their loops sound pretty bad.

The vengeance stuff sounds more cohesive. Maybe the excess processing glues to all together.

I downloaded the drumtools sample pack, and it does sound pretty good. But it's not even available yet...

quote:

Originally posted by Beatflux The vengeance stuff sounds more cohesive. Maybe the excess processing glues to all together. I downloaded the drumtools sample pack, and it does sound pretty good. But it's not even available yet...

A lot of that glue comes from a well set room reverb and some compression IMO. I doubt whether you even need to use parallel compression to get it to sound good, just a compressor over the hats and some 'verb oughta do it...

to be fair I have made some not too bad loops in my time, mainly doing what has already been said, such as the delicate use of swing, initial sound choice very important, also I have used the dry loop > Reverb/delay > compressor idea, occasionly side chaining gives it a nice rolling feel. But never really hit the same level of quality as I hear in tracks/sample cds, guess its just a case of practice.

One more question, do you guys go on loop making sessions? for example when I do drum loops, sometimes the processing and routing gets a bit mad and hard to keep track of in the context of a project, so I wonder if some of you spend time making loops and render out as many as you can for future use?

Re: Re: Quick question about drum loops

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle Its the swing in the loops that makes them a bit tricky to make.

Guru > A technical itch > 30% fun times

put a vocoder on the hihat!

quote:

Originally posted by DjStephenWiley put Camelspace on the everything!

That's better

Here's mine that got released almost 3 years ago.

Triloops

I found that messing with FX creates intersting patterns. Oftentimes taking an arpegiated sound to like C1 creates nice textures that when sideshained qnd mixed with drums create something quite menacing and evil.

Also, splicing out the parts you want and gluing them with certain sounds creates funky results. Experemintation is your best source that are purely your own. Time consuming but very rewarding. I'm only scratching the surface of the art after many hours of trial and error.

Oh and I absolutely LOVE my MASCHINE. It opened the world I never could find with conventional drum machines and I've had them all - 909, 808, machinedrum, and tons of others.

quote:

Originally posted by Lolo Here's mine that got released almost 3 years ago. Triloops

dude tinyurl that link in your sig - it stretches the screen

after this thread i started messing about and made i loop but put a chorus on the closed hat, compressed the snare tail to make a thwack sound and then i got a sweep and put camel space on it and tinkered with the trance gate and got some nice results

I'm useless at loops and have been in the 4+ years producing in Cubase. I've just realised re-wiring in Ableton with my main DAW - Cubase, and just using edited loops seems like the way to go, they are in-time with your Cubase track - whatever you throw at it and its even a good way to start a remix of a track with vocals etc..

I'm pretty new to Ableton so will have to checkout this 'Groove Pool' these elders speak of.

quote:

Originally posted by daeus I'm useless at loops and have been in the 4+ years producing in Cubase.

i was never good at, or even really interested in, making loops until I got a Maschine. But, now that I have one, I find myself sometimes just making various loops for hours on end. The problem is that I never stop to save them - I just sorta improv in real-time. Not sure how productive that is, but it sure is fun and beats the hell out of watching TV I guess.

Never used a drum loop here. Add a touch of reverb on the midrange percussion, a little extra on the snare, 25-50% swing or a good groove template, some light compression with a quick attack/release, then compress it again against near the final stage against the kick. Never had any complaints about drums, although I usually put in a crapload of other processing as well (filter automation, stutters, fills and reverses, that sort of thing).

There's only one thing I still find difficult, and that's achieving the super snappy sustained yet somehow not overpowering snare/clap-like sound that you typically hear in good breakbeats. It's doable, mind you, I just find the process frustrating.

For four-on-the-floor, trance or housey stuff, easy peasy.

One other thing: I don't "make loops", I write MIDI sequences against a drum mapper (Battery) and bounce for post-processing if/when needed. I can't stand listening to the same loop 500 times in my own track, I have to change something every 4-8 bars or so.


Edit: Oh yeah, one other other thing: A lot of people underestimate the effect of a bassline on a drum loop. Those loops on the vengeance CD may sound uber phat but you don't necessarily want them in your mix. A lot of times you can take a fairly ordinary-sounding drum loop and when you put it together with a big warm bassline and possibly a midrange rhythm loop, it will sound better than any drum loop on any sample CD.

There was a time when I used to listen to some released tracks and go "shit, how do they make the percussion so tight?" And eventually I realized that in 9 out of 10 cases it's not really the percussion at all, it's just a very well-coordinated ensemble of rhythmic elements.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut There was a time when I used to listen to some released tracks and go "shit, how do they make the percussion so tight?" And eventually I realized that in 9 out of 10 cases it's not really the percussion at all, it's just a very well-coordinated ensemble of rhythmic elements.

+1 I was listening to tech trance/house and was like how do they use just a closed aht and a snare and get it sounding so great, it was the bassline pushing the loop forward

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright © 2000-2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.