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Writing music without a MIDI keyboard

I was wondering if anyone could offer an opinion about writing a track with their software alone, without the help of a MIDI keyboard.

Is this method a viable option? Would you most likely or prefer to download a soft-synth as your alternative?

Also would this keyboard be considered good enough/just as good/better than a standard midi keyboard? (As far as getting started is concerned)

http://zeneszmagazin.hu/uploads/RD-300SX_1.jpg


Any input is appreciated.
-Ankh

Re: Writing music without a MIDI keyboard

quote:

Originally posted by Ankhsunamun I was wondering if anyone could offer an opinion about writing a track with their software alone, without the help of a MIDI keyboard. Is this method a viable option? Would you most likely or prefer to download a soft-synth as your alternative? Also would this keyboard be considered good enough/just as good/better than a standard midi keyboard? (As far as getting started is concerned) http://zeneszmagazin.hu/uploads/RD-300SX_1.jpg Any input is appreciated. -Ankh

I do this all the time. I don't play piano nor will I ever need to. I use soft synth vsts and hardware modules for my sound, hell , why spend $300 on a decent midi keyboard when you can do the same with your mouse and qwerty keyboard? But a Midi Controller is nice to have

If you want to hear a track done without a keyboard for help, you will not tell the difference between one that was made with a midi keyboard.


Andie


EDIT -- that MIDI keyboard isn't one I would choose mate, I would go buy one with both a Pitch and MOD wheel, along with a few other neccessities, the Yamaha S80 is a good start IMO, but any midi keyboard will do the job!

Re: Writing music without a MIDI keyboard

quote:

Originally posted by Ankhsunamun I was wondering if anyone could offer an opinion about writing a track with their software alone, without the help of a MIDI keyboard. Is this method a viable option? Would you most likely or prefer to download a soft-synth as your alternative? Also would this keyboard be considered good enough/just as good/better than a standard midi keyboard? (As far as getting started is concerned) http://zeneszmagazin.hu/uploads/RD-300SX_1.jpg Any input is appreciated. -Ankh

Yes, a lot of people write music just fine without a controller by just drawning/writing the notes into their piano roll or staff note views in their DAW and controlling soft synths that way. But, many people (myself included) find that to be very inefficient compared to playing the parts in with a keyboard and using the editors to fix errors, try variations, etc. There's no right or wrong. If you want to improve your musical skills and/or are already a pianist, and if you don't wnat to spend all your time staring at computer screen and clicking with a mouse, then I'd definitely recommend getting a keyboard.

But, I agree with Phrequency that there are probably better options - that Roland is a nice stage piano, but there are many other better options for working with computer-based music.

Why not try using a midi keyboard then decide.I know I wont be going back to not using one.

not using a keyboard will benefit you in some ways because you will get good at using the piano roll but my opinion is to get a midi keyboard one with some knobs and sliders, m audio do a really cheap one for less than 100 pound that would be good enough for any pro producer i often right the melodies in the piano roll but i need the keyboard for things like touch sensitivety, the knobs for tweaking cuttof etc also to just to play on to get some ideas going

I wish I had that keyboard.


Instead...

I have a Yahama PSR-170.

Pros: Has MIDI and full sized keys.
Cons: Sounds like crap and every time a cat jumps on the buttons, it changes the sound of the soft-synth I'm using.

I wouldn't do it without a keyboard. I already hate editing MIDI, enough. I can't imagine hanging out in an editing bay in the time it would take to draw in a lead run.

It is absolutely possible to put in the sweat and edit your way to a whole song but not something I'd choose to do with my time. The trade off is that it does take time to become proficient at playing the keyboard and even with my level of proficiency which I'd consider a 3.9 on a scale of 0-10 - 10 being my continuously moving goal post - I'll still spend time in the editing bay.

quote:

Originally posted by EddieZilker I wouldn't do it without a keyboard. I already hate editing MIDI, enough. I can't imagine hanging out in an editing bay in the time it would take to draw in a lead run. It is absolutely possible to put in the sweat and edit your way to a whole song but not something I'd choose to do with my time. The trade off is that it does take time to become proficient at playing the keyboard and even with my level of proficiency which I'd consider a 3.9 on a scale of 0-10 - 10 being my continuously moving goal post - I'll still spend time in the editing bay.

different DAWs have better or worse midi editing methods, the DAW I use, FL, is VERY fast and easy at creating complex melodies with ease, and I compare to something like ProTools, yes your right, most DAWs are a bitch when it comes to MIDI editing, but FL may be the exception Hence I don't like the use of MIDI Keyboards vs MIDI Piano Roll

Perhaps, but there's a trade-off made in quality (although I have yet to find a DAW with every single feature implemented they way I think they should be implemented). I've only used a very old, cracked version of FL (spare me the opprobrium - I pay for all my stuff, now), a while back, and based on that experience can't share in your opinion of their software. That doesn't mean there aren't any changes that have come along which may change my opinion, but, on the whole I find FL to be a great beginner's tool-box but a lousy platform for an industry which requires more fidelity in less time than FL is capable of affording.

That's my opinion of FL, however. I used to use Project 5 (with Reason) but have recently graduated myself to Sonar 8.5. The difference is night and day but I don't think I'd be anywhere near as close to what I am currently doing with it if I were simply relegated to drawing in notes. Regardless of whatever software the OP is using (Acid and Reason), keyboard skillz aren't something I think ought to be shirked.

I've had one producer who was a genius on the guitar and in a partnership with an equally stellar pianist and even he played keyboards (better than I, at the time, at least and probably still, now.) My point is that the man, because of his abilities, had options open to him in his studio that people who are without such abilities are quite literally cut off from.

Having made my first track without a midi keyboard, I would definitely say it's harder. I believe when you have a keyboard, creating melodies are simpler because if you know your notes, you just simply play them in the order you want them to.

quote:

Originally posted by EddieZilker I wish I had that keyboard. Instead... I have a Yahama PSR-170. Cons: Sounds like crap and every time a cat jumps on the buttons, it changes the sound of the soft-synth I'm using. .

How can you stand the sight of that monstrosity. That would be the biggest con for me. It looks absolutely revolting.

quote:

Originally posted by RichieV How can you stand the sight of that monstrosity. That would be the biggest con for me. It looks absolutely revolting.

I should bounce a track through it's MIDI - a full blown track - just so you can hear it's pristine 22,500 (Digital - NOT analogue) Hz, 8-bit glory. It has the sonic fidelity of a home-made record from the 1930's and the piano... Well, every voice, really, is startlingly bad - horrific.

Bland, Static, Unconvincing, Dull, Trite, Blunt, Obvious, Unlistenable


It's a child's toy and a bit of an irony as it's currently hooked up to one of the most expensive pieces of software money can buy (apart from top-shelf Pro-Tools, I surmise).

I got it for free and it's been reliable through every song I've produced in the past three and a half years - but I have to admit, having had my hands on Ensoniq, Kurzweil, Casio (Pro - VZ1), and Alesis (QSsux.1), the action of the unweighted keys is comparable and the keys have taken a beating while remaining ultimately faithful in their duties.

I remember Andy Blueman saying in an interview that he doesn't have Midi keyboard.
But that was probably years ago.

Yeh but a mouse will never inspire you like a keyboard.
I'm sure a carpenter can hammer nails with his forehead, but generally the right tool is gonna get you there quicker, and less painfully.

I do think too if you are just starting out, and don't know a single thing about music theory, it would be extremely stupid to try punching in melodies with a mouse.
With a keyboard you have 10 fingers working, with a mouse you have 1. You have a much higher chance of accidentally finding melodies (10x) compared to a mouse. And as a newb, you really need all the leverage you can get.

quote:

Originally posted by IceColdWater I remember Andy Blueman saying in an interview that he doesn't have Midi keyboard. But that was probably years ago.

It wasn't too long ago but his new massive fame probably got him enough money to get one.

He said most of what he came up with was through playing on a qwerty keyboard, though, which is actually how I do a lot of it. Though he's not an ideal example, he started out writing orchestrated works (not surprisingly) and his works in that area are much more complicated than anything he's done with trance.

Thank you for your input guys, I really appreciate it.

I'm currently using Cubase 5 (I should say learning, more so than using) and using the soft-synths with a qwerty keyboard. It seems to work well enough, although I would imagine that a midi keyboard would make finding and hitting the appropriate notes/chords way easier.

That piano belongs to my girlfriend and it's kind of just sitting around so I was hoping it was possible to put it to use as a substitute in the meantime of acquiring a midi controller proper.

Thanks again for the advice!

Cheers!
-Ankh

heaps of people, including a number of pros don't use them..

i rarely use one, unless i'm in the mood for some loose, live-feeling strings/pads or lead sounds...

it's nice to have one, but unless you can play the piano it's really not a necessity... just type em in

Re: Writing music without a MIDI keyboard

quote:

Originally posted by Ankhsunamun I was wondering if anyone could offer an opinion about writing a track with their software alone, without the help of a MIDI keyboard. Is this method a viable option? Would you most likely or prefer to download a soft-synth as your alternative? Also would this keyboard be considered good enough/just as good/better than a standard midi keyboard? (As far as getting started is concerned) http://zeneszmagazin.hu/uploads/RD-300SX_1.jpg Any input is appreciated. -Ankh

not sure if this helps, but if you dont have a midi keyboard, there are vst's that can turn your computer keyboard into a midi type device that will let you play notes. you just have to learn where every key. not nearly as good as having a midi keyboard, but works if you dont.

Isnt that already done for you...? My DAW has it built in to program your keyboard to do that when you enter the piano roll.

Re: Re: Writing music without a MIDI keyboard

quote:

Originally posted by Kismet7 not sure if this helps, but if you dont have a midi keyboard, there are vst's that can turn your computer keyboard into a midi type device that will let you play notes. you just have to learn where every key. not nearly as good as having a midi keyboard, but works if you dont.

Yes, I can already do this with my QWERTY board. I didn't touch any settings, since I'm still an utter newb, but all I have to do is open a synth and my qwerty works just fine.

the cubase getting started page used to say something like "having a midi keyboard is almost essential, while it is possible to make music without one, any serious musician should have some sort of midi keyboard" it made it sound like it was the number one priority of thingy to buy, perhaps the number two being a set of monitor speakers.

So I bought one, and it has collected a lot of dust over the past 6 years. I mostly use it to twist knobs and tap notes while im trying to program a synth or figure out the notes that correspond to whatever melody I thought of in my head. It helps to have it but I don't think it is as necessary as that help file told me it was.

one of these days I would really like to learn how to actually play it like a proper instrument though.

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