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what do you think of this trance 'melody' attemp?!

Help!

This wanna be uplifting trance melody is theoretically very incorrect with all of it's dissonances, unresolved tensions and bad voice leading. But still I think it could work quite well. (the last beats sound a bit cheesy but).

I know that trance often ignores classical harmony rules but would this be still better with more proper voice leading etc?

Feel free to attempt to modify it and show us the results!

http://minagi.hybridi.net/saippua/g...for_strings.mp3 Arpeggiated version

http://minagi.hybridi.net/saippua/l...for_strings.mp3

http://minagi.hybridi.net/saippua/l..._for_string.mid Midi file

the problem is that your voicing seems unintended. It just seems like you don't really know what notes you want to play. You don't need to know the rules to hear what it should sound like as the rules were made according to what people thought sounded good.

Arpegiatted melodies tend to be 3 compounded melodies together. You have your main soprano line, your counterpoint line that fills in the harmony and your bass note. Try to keep each voice linear in that don't have notes belonging to one group all of a sudden jump to another. Use restraint. Try to use common tones if you can and don't do needless jumps all over the place.

http://www.subtleinc.net/subtles_adagio_for_strings.mp3

that was pretty bad.

You people need to stop thinking vertically. Good melodies and interaction with counterpoint lines form chords that weave seamlessly. Just playing a melody over chords sounds dull. Think of each note of a chord as a voice that is moving linearly, not just a bunch of block chords.

Terminal.mp3 - 1.14MB
PressureMaster-04m.mp3 - 0.98MB


Did this before I had any formal harmony training. Its just common sense. Looking back, the voice leading is flawless. I didn't know anything about voice leading at the time.

quote:

Originally posted by Mad for Brad that was pretty bad. You people need to stop thinking vertically. Good melodies and interaction with counterpoint lines form chords that weave seamlessly. Just playing a melody over chords sounds dull. Think of each note of a chord as a voice that is moving linearly, not just a bunch of block chords. URL=http://www.zshare.net/audio/79847222ca9fc7ee/]Terminal.mp3 - 1.14MB[/URL] Did this before I had any theory training. Its just common sense.

Ooooh! Les Prities! I'd love to hear what you'd do with it, now, but the point you're making isn't lost.

added another gem. I was a melody machine. To answer your question, it goes into a SCot Project styled super build with german 88 artillery snare drums. The second link does this sick harmonic movement right when the backbeat snare comes in. If I didn't decide to get a higher education, I might of made something of myself. Both those tunes were 2001 - 02

quote:

Originally posted by Mad for Brad that was pretty bad.

What you mean bad ? Damn it took me 2 hours making that clip.

there is no connect between your melody and the chords. It just sounds disjointed. It sounds like melody + chords. And your timbre didn't really inspire.

quote:

Originally posted by Mad for Brad the problem is that your voicing seems unintended. It just seems like you don't really know what notes you want to play. You don't need to know the rules to hear what it should sound like as the rules were made according to what people thought sounded good. Arpegiatted melodies tend to be 3 compounded melodies together. You have your main soprano line, your counterpoint line that fills in the harmony and your bass note. Try to keep each voice linear in that don't have notes belonging to one group all of a sudden jump to another. Use restraint. Try to use common tones if you can and don't do needless jumps all over the place.

You hit the nail on the head. I really didn't have any idea what i wanted to make when I did that.

But thats hard to keep them linear. There are so many dead ends! Or then I should same notes without establishing any chords or harmony.

then sit at a piano and tweak it until every note is where it should be. When you are done, there should not be any second guessing as to where you wanted them. EVerything should sound confident and intended and moving a note should not be a possibility as you've refined it to the point that it is exactly what you want.

What I find just as important to the melody is connecting it somehow to your song so that it doesn't just sound like you are throwing a random melody in. That is why form is so important. Having elements foreshadowed, morphing earlier elements , transposing, retrograding whatever it takes to make something that is arbitrary into something that belongs.

quote:

Originally posted by Mad for Brad that was pretty bad. You people need to stop thinking vertically. Good melodies and interaction with counterpoint lines form chords that weave seamlessly. Just playing a melody over chords sounds dull. Think of each note of a chord as a voice that is moving linearly, not just a bunch of block chords.

I agree but will melody first and/or chords first approaches lead to this?

I can't create other without other. At least I have to create the harmony or uh counterpoint simultaneously!

quote:

Terminal.mp3 - 1.14MB PressureMaster-04m.mp3 - 0.98MB Did this before I had any formal harmony training. Its just common sense. Looking back, the voice leading is flawless. I didn't know anything about voice leading at the time.

Awesome stuff. But uh there are no V-I resolution?

cuz the clip ended lol. Always end on a high note. lol


Anyways, to start, use block chords as it is generally easier but once you have your chords and the melody. Deconstruct your chords and start viewing them as voices in their own right. I've gone thru so much orchestral scores where everything is a voice that it is really easy for me to hear the voices move in a chord but it does take practice and it is hard to hear and do unless you practice. But all the great composers do/did this.

And you don't need to resolve V - I. Harmony is really a game of statistics. V usually goes to one most of the times, it also often but less often goes to vi, but there are no rules as to where you have to go.

case and point

Wagner's tristan and Isolde prelude. Not one V - I resolution in the entire piece which spans 10 minutes but the key is clearly established none the less. its one big cock tease.

Beginning is slow but once it gets into it, you will hear some trancy pants harmonies.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fktwPGCR7Yw

the queers playing clarinet are quite funny to watch.

quote:

Originally posted by Mad for Brad there is no connect between your melody and the chords. It just sounds disjointed. It sounds like melody + chords. And your timbre didn't really inspire.

What do you have to say about something like this then:

http://www.subtleinc.net/terminal_destruction.mp3

/offensive_supersaw_demo_2.mp3http://minagi.hybridi.net/saippua/o...rsaw_demo_2.mp3

How about this attemp of two voice harmony then any opinions on that?


Also is it possible/can someone create following (uplifting) trance melodies:

a trance melody that uses neapolitan sixth chord somewhere?
a trance melody that is in phygrian mode?
a trance melody that is in lydian mode?

I have always been wondering how to keep the sound and feeling the mode while still being 'uplifting trance'?

quote:

Originally posted by offensive_newbi a trance melody that uses neapolitan sixth chord somewhere?

no neapolitan 6 there. b II and N6 are different regarding how they resolve although that would answer his question regarding a phrygian styled scale as that song clearly has. N6 goes to V, bII well in this case is just a neighbour chord. Often seen as an embellishment of iv so sure. Very easy to fit in. I once made a tutorial with a very catchy progression that had an N6, a diminished chord, a half diminished chord a minor chord and a major chord to show how all these elements can be used but it seems to have disappeared.

i'm not going to comment on your second attempt as it is pretty clear you just did it now. Spend some time and use your own ears and stop being so lazy.

Regarding Subtle's second link, much better.

You want to practice melodies chords and modulation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZA6mvMXxBQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VefZ...feature=related

second one is lot easier. Another good idea is listen to any of Zimmer's soundtrack music as it is very simple and the melodies are catchy and easy to implement in trance.


notate that track. All the harmonies are trance friendly, the modulation is clever and should keep you busy. And fuck I love Rocky. I gave that first link to a second year theory class as an assignment and most couldn't figure all of it out so don't feel bad. Today class, we are going to study, Rocky IV mother******s. Nobody in the class even knew the bad guys name. Fckin nerds. Love classical music but god damn is it hard to find anyone studying it that isn't a complete knob. I made so many drug jokes that just went over their heads. And they were all so smug but could not notate a Christina Aguilera song if their lives depended on it. pity.

quote:

Originally posted by Mad for Brad no neapolitan 6 there. b II and N6 are different regarding how they resolve although that would answer his question regarding a phrygian styled scale as that song clearly has. N6 goes to V, bII well in this case is just a neighbour chord. Often seen as an embellishment of iv so sure. Very easy to fit in. I once made a tutorial with a very catchy progression that had an N6, a diminished chord, a half diminished chord a minor chord and a major chord to show how all these elements can be used but it seems to have disappeared. i'm not going to comment on your second attempt as it is pretty clear you just did it now. Spend some time and use your own ears and stop being so lazy. Regarding Subtle's second link, much better.

eh was that so bad? I can assure you that I didn't do it now? And its sometimes confusing to judge own stuff after I have already adapted to their poor quality.

Also thanks a lot for answers anyway!

sorry. Some parts are ok but there is this change of direction that is awkward and again the voice leading is horrendous and some of the chord voicing is rather strange sounding.

quote:

Originally posted by offensive_newbi a trance melody that is in phygrian mode?

I think most psy-trance is in phrygian mode. I've accomplished some uplifting melodies with phrygian too.

I found that playing each note of a passage monophonically helped me compose more like Richie's talking about RE treating each note of the chords as their own voice.

It makes you think of each voice as an instrument in its own right and you think in harmonies rather than chords.

quote:

Originally posted by Mad for Brad sorry. Some parts are ok but there is this change of direction that is awkward and again the voice leading is horrendous and some of the chord voicing is rather strange sounding.

Hehe no need to say sorry. I'll try to fix it.

I think notating or learning classic trance melodies, simple movie scores ( Hans Zimmer ) will really help you with trance melodies. I can't stand Zimmer's writing from a compositional point of view but he sure as hell can make a catchy 8 bar melody and he has a lot to pick from. They vary from simple to somewhat interesting but they are great to learn from for a beginner. Download his scores from the pre gladiator times and you will find alot of motifs that you can apply to trance. Basically any one from Remote Control actually I guess media ventures at the time has the similar simple harmonic catchy approach that has some great learning tools for trance producers.

If you can't hear why your melody sounds weird , perhaps you just need to train your ear to know what sounds good and despite my dislike for alot of Zimmer stuff, all his melodies and chord voicings sound great and are good indicators.

stuff like

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8Xk38J0cYo

Try to learn theory and apply it to these easy progressions and it will help you out.Crimson Tide, The Rock .. that period.

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle

ahh forgot about that track.

quote:

Originally posted by Looney4Clooney that was pretty bad. You people need to stop thinking vertically. Good melodies and interaction with counterpoint lines form chords that weave seamlessly. Just playing a melody over chords sounds dull. Think of each note of a chord as a voice that is moving linearly, not just a bunch of block chords. Terminal.mp3 - 1.14MB PressureMaster-04m.mp3 - 0.98MB Did this before I had any formal harmony training. Its just common sense. Looking back, the voice leading is flawless. I didn't know anything about voice leading at the time.

what do you mean "you people" ?

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