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Soundcloud going to****... now what?

ever since that redesign a while back and now with the promoted tracks and advertisements being shoved in everyone face (which is totally backfiring btw) it's looking like SC is adamant about ruining their own service

youtube is the way music really gets around but they are also fucking it up, read up on Zoe Keating and their new streaming service, actually all streaming services seem to be screwing the artist

the argument is "well just don't use the services" but honestly that's like going back to the 90's and telling musicians "just don't use CDs then"

Yeah as far as actually having an audience of non producers Youtube seems the best despite constantly shooting themselves in the foot interface wise.

I still like soundcloud for keeping up with my fellow producers despite the shenanigans. My biggest gripe with SC at the moment is I am a paid user and I am still seeing advertisements... why? I likely won't renew my subscription next year but I will still continue to use SC unless they change that.

What advertisements?

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery What advertisements?

time to start slangin' mixtapes again.

Don't follow artists associated with bigger labels or the bigger labels themselves = no promoted tracks/ads as far as I know. I've never seen one on my screen.

Also the 80/20 rule is amplified on internet, major players (Soundcloud is the only relevant social streaming platform for audio specifically) take 98% of the market. For now there will be no alternative as there is no leverage. You can always try Youtube...

I always find it hilarious when people complain about commercial companies wanting to make profit. Did you really think they were running Soundcloud out of charity?

People feel the service has changed so much that Soundcloud betrayed their trust. Gotta hand it to Soundcloud; their strategy has been quite interesting.

Making artists pay for webspace, refusing to pay royalties as you must state you are in no way associated with copyright collection societies indemnifying them from having to pay anything to artists while legally they would be obligated to. So now they only have to deal with rightsholders such as Universal/Spinnin'/etc.

Basically: let artists pay for getting their music out on their platform, refuse to pay royalties, just labels to deal with. It's almost a complete reversal of the traditional chain and flow of money.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery I always find it hilarious when people complain about commercial companies wanting to make profit. Did you really think they were running Soundcloud out of charity?

+1
I've got 900 followers and 40k plays on SC, got 5 followers on YT for a Cirklon clip i once posted. I'm only worried about myself and the labels i work do work for on SC, so I never see any adverts.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery I always find it hilarious when people complain about commercial companies wanting to make profit. Did you really think they were running Soundcloud out of charity?

Not even the point.

Soundcloud sold one service, then changed that service to something completely different despite the protest of tens of thousands of paying customers and basically told them 'fuck you'.

You're arguing a point nobody has made.

quote:

Originally posted by tehlord Not even the point. Soundcloud sold one service, then changed that service to something completely different despite the protest of tens of thousands of paying customers and basically told them 'fuck you'. You're arguing a point nobody has made.

And what do you suppose is the reason behind all that?

Can't say that I've noticed Soundcloud getting all that bad, but I mostly only go there to post my own tracks. I rarely listen to or comment on other people's music, although I probably should...

It seems harder to generate any kind of following with Youtube IME. ReverbNation is much more social, but it can be very annoying with all the ads, suggestions, spam, notifications, etc.

quote:

Originally posted by cryophonik Can't say that I've noticed Soundcloud getting all that bad, but I mostly only go there to post my own tracks. I rarely listen to or comment on other people's music, although I probably should... It seems harder to generate any kind of following with Youtube IME. ReverbNation is much more social, but it can be very annoying with all the ads, suggestions, spam, notifications, etc.

Well if you used SC as it was originally sold then there are a lot of features that have been stripped away. It originally proclaimed itself to be a platform where like minded musicians could share and collaborate on music, specifically. It's the fact that people paid for that service and a lot of features designed to cater for that, that have now gone that pissed a lot of people off. If you just want to upload tracks for people to listen to it's not so much of a big deal. I think it's pretty obvious that they were being misleading from the start as they have charged people to supply themselves with content that they were later going to monetise.

Yeah, that's probably why I haven't noticed it. I bought into the most basic paid subscription a little over a year ago, and it lapsed last month or so. I really only wanted it for the ability to replace tracks, having the "Spotlight", and a little extra storage space, just in case I ever need it. Those don't seem to have changed, so I'll probably renew the basic plan for my main cryo SC someday, but right now my focus is on the new project.

quote:

Originally posted by tehlord Well if you used SC as it was originally sold then there are a lot of features that have been stripped away. It originally proclaimed itself to be a platform where like minded musicians could share and collaborate on music, specifically. It's the fact that people paid for that service and a lot of features designed to cater for that, that have now gone that pissed a lot of people off. If you just want to upload tracks for people to listen to it's not so much of a big deal. I think it's pretty obvious that they were being misleading from the start as they have charged people to supply themselves with content that they were later going to monetise.

Yeah this is the problem. Soundcloud already had a source of income with the premium accounts, and some of these paying customers are having their tracks 'promoted' without the permission or even knowledge of the artist. A friend of mine found this out. I don't know if you guys have noticed but the comments on some of these promoted tracks are brutal. Spam + commenting system do not mix, great way to piss off your fans and make you seem like a tool. It's just a shit move

Bandcamp isn't infested by this stuff but its also not as much of a social platform unfortunately.

I'm glad if soundcloud is going to shit. Much as I never want any business to go under, they must be reading How to Lose friends and Alienate people.

I agree with everyone else on here; They had a good business model by via subscriptions, but the spam and ads, combined with the circle jerk comment for a comment thing is nothing more than a vehicle to drive away your paid members.

But let's not forget, shitty/lossy audio stream quality and a buggy interface. I just don't understand why no one has been able to program a better interface with lossless streaming that isn't buggy as hell. Even if they only offered it as a premium version, but you'd think with server space costing nothing, bandwidths getting ridiculously high, that someone would make a platform and interface that could take advantage.

Hey, Storyteller - you up for it?

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN I agree with everyone else on here; They had a good business model by via subscriptions, but the spam and ads, combined with the circle jerk comment for a comment thing is nothing more than a vehicle to drive away your paid members.

yeah the follow-friend circlejerk is bad but also they've done nothing to combat the 'buy soundcloud comments/plays' services that the broducers love. Maybe there's nothing they can do and maybe thats why bandcamp is leaving out the social media stuff

quote:

Originally posted by meriter yeah the follow-friend circlejerk is bad but also they've done nothing to combat the 'buy soundcloud comments/plays' services that the broducers love. Maybe there's nothing they can do and maybe thats why bandcamp is leaving out the social media stuff

I think alot of these problems are inherent to free social media. The whole "follow for a follow" and to an extent "comment for a comment" is going to happen wherever this is a feature.

The low cost of entry for spammers / fake follower services means that they will run rampant across the service even if Soundcloud is fairly diligent about policing them.

Maybe a more ideal service would allow you to follow and comment but not show follower numbers or "likes" to the public.

quote:

Originally posted by meriter yeah the follow-friend circlejerk is bad but also they've done nothing to combat the 'buy soundcloud comments/plays' services that the broducers love. Maybe there's nothing they can do and maybe thats why bandcamp is leaving out the social media stuff

I don't give them that excuse. The broducers are the ones driving soundcloud sumbers at the moment, and the problem is that the model for ads is based on how many impressions they get, therefore it's not in their interests to stop it.

This is the fundamental issue with soundcloud; their model is no longer paid subs, it's advertising and leveraged media.

A good friend of mine until recently worked for a large start up webTV company. They had 10's of millions invested in them in seed money and she was the social media director. After working there for about a year we were chatting and she told me the youtube views stats (basically what they derive their ad revenue from) and I told her there's simply no way they are getting close to those figures. It worried her so she started digging.

She she found out their plan was not to make the business profitable, but to sell it with as much hype as possible. The views mattered more than the actual revenue. 6 months later she quit as she discovered there was a team of 4 guys - who no one there knew actually what they did for the company - whose sole jump was to artificially manipulate the views with bots/robospam accounts.

With expensive acquisitions in the music industry at an all time high (Beats By Dre, Beatport, etc) the model is not make a solid platform with sustainability, it's to build something with as much hype as possible and get out at the right time.

I have no doubt Soundcloud will go the same way soon.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN I have no doubt Soundcloud will go the same way soon.

This may or may not be related, but...

Have you seen the new Beatport beta? It's pretty much identical to Soundcloud.

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Originally posted by Mr.Mystery This may or may not be related, but... Have you seen the new Beatport beta? It's pretty much identical to Soundcloud.

How so? explain.

quote:

Originally posted by Innocence Lost How so? explain.

What do you mean "explain"? It looks and works almost identical to SC.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery What do you mean "explain"? It looks and works almost identical to SC.

You can upload material and share it without it being taken down?

No, the player and the site layout.

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