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Question for old school Trance addicts ?

Sorry , i past so manny hours triying to find whats good with old denmark ones ! such as DJ Choose , Soren Weile , Kevin , FtW Rec , etc ? they left the business of trance and tech stuff for some reason ? or any kind of information that why they doesnt even anymore on the escene ? thanks you very much all of you !

I remember those names from ten years ago or something? but my knowledge of the multilayered, sweet Danish trance pastry is limited to say the least. It does appear that at least Michael Parsberg has moved into slightly different musical territory:
https://www.discogs.com/artist/2580638-Pegboard-Nerds

most of the producers from back then werent djing full time , they had other tech related jobs like graphic design or software related stuff that allowed them to produce in their free time becaus3 equipment aint cheap

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Originally posted by LoveHate most of the producers from back then werent djing full time , they had other tech related jobs like graphic design or software related stuff that allowed them to produce in their free time becaus3 equipment aint cheap

This is actually true and a lot of people don't realize this. There was a great interview with Danny Howels years ago where he said how scared he was to give up his full time job (I think he was a graphic designer) and by then he was already a pretty big name.

Now compute that Danny Howels was one of the later generation of DJ's and the earlier Gen had even less money in it.

Hard House Legend Tony De Vit was a computer programmer (and pretty well paid apparently) which let him gig on weekends and it was only when timing and travelling caused too many headaches with the job that he quit it.

I think it depends, in Germany at least a lot of people were doing this full time and making good money even in the dearly days. I know even around 92/93, bigger DJs here in Berlin got paid about 1000 DM (about 500 euros now), per gig, which was really good money at the time, probably more than enough to live off a month soemwhere in east Berlin. By 94/95, DJs at those mega-raves like Mayday were earning thousands per gig. The commercial side of things really took a nosedive around 2001/2002 though when the whole superstar DJ era came crashing down.

Hell, I remember Derrick May talking about how all these Detroit high school parties and later the music institute had a 50$ (in todays dollars) entry fee. In Chicago, early house hits could sell tens of thousands of copies just in Chicago alone. There was money to be had.

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Originally posted by DJ RANN There was a great interview with Danny Howels years ago where he said how scared he was to give up his full time job (I think he was a graphic designer) and by then he was already a pretty big name.

Danny Howells was a psychiatric nurse before he became a DJ.

I think it's quite a legitimate fear to totally give up the day job, even if you're a relatively big name. If you're a DJ but not really a producer, you're not putting much in the way of transferable skills on your CV in the event your career collapses. Must be a nightmare getting a mortgage as a jobbing DJ or musician.

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Originally posted by Woony I think it depends, in Germany at least a lot of people were doing this full time and making good money even in the dearly days. I know even around 92/93, bigger DJs here in Berlin got paid about 1000 DM (about 500 euros now), per gig, which was really good money at the time, probably more than enough to live off a month soemwhere in east Berlin. By 94/95, DJs at those mega-raves like Mayday were earning thousands per gig.

Do you think all that applies to the illustrious DJ Choose, though?

Obviously not, I was just arguing RANNs point about famous DJ-producers having day jobs in the 90s. I actually once read an interview with a guy that ran a german techno magazine in the 90s about how in that period of the first techno explosion ca. 92-98 loads of people that weren't even DJs or producers just quit their jobs/education/careers to do anything even vaguely related to techno (media, fashion, merchandise, events etc.). And it actually worked sort of well for a few years because there was suddenly a huge demand for "techno products" but no established industry to supply them and costs of living were really low back then, especially in the east. But then again, maybe things were different in the UK because you guys already had the acid house explosion in the late 80s and rave had already became sort of worn out by 92-93. Although I do remember once reading a comment about how even during the first acid house explosion, there were already ton of highly commercial events with high ticket price and big fees for the DJs.

That said, I'm obviously not disputing that loads of well known DJs had day jobs in the 90s, I just think for the bigger guys it wasn't due to a lack of lucrative gig opportunities.

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Originally posted by DJ RANN This is actually true and a lot of people don't realize this. There was a great interview with Danny Howels years ago where he said how scared he was to give up his full time job (I think he was a graphic designer) and by then he was already a pretty big name. Now compute that Danny Howels was one of the later generation of DJ's and the earlier Gen had even less money in it. Hard House Legend Tony De Vit was a computer programmer (and pretty well paid apparently) which let him gig on weekends and it was only when timing and travelling caused too many headaches with the job that he quit it.

It's not easy to make a living as a artist. To get what you want out of this life, you will likely have to struggle for years. Most ppl ain't ready for that type of commitment and sacrifice, so i can see the fear that Danny howel's faced leaving that comfort zone,

but how easy it is to make music nowadays its totally doable to keep your day job and do music on the side until the latter takes off.

interesting story here about a woman who worked for the nba making 80k a year and left it all to become a rapper

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Originally posted by LoveHate It's not easy to make a living as a artist. To get what you want out of this life, you will likely have to struggle for years. Most ppl ain't ready for that type of commitment and sacrifice, so i can see the fear that Danny howel's faced leaving that comfort zone, but how easy it is to make music nowadays its totally doable to keep your day job and do music on the side until the latter takes off. interesting story here about a woman who worked for the nba making 80k a year and left it all to become a rapper

Inspirational. Thanks for sharing.

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Originally posted by Woony But then again, maybe things were different in the UK because you guys already had the acid house explosion in the late 80s and rave had already became sort of worn out by 92-93. Although I do remember once reading a comment about how even during the first acid house explosion, there were already ton of highly commercial events with high ticket price and big fees for the DJs.

In the early days it was the promoters pocketing most of the cash. Sasha was the first superstar DJ, and I've read his fee doubled annually in the early '90s. So around 1990 he was on about �500 a gig. By 1992 it was �2,000. He was obviously at the top tier of earnings. So the bigger events back then which were hooking one or two thousand people were probably making �10-20,000 for the promoters, of which probably less than a quarter went on the venue/sound hire and DJs. This is why a lot of criminals quickly got involved in the orbital rave scene at the end of the '80s.

Down the years the balance has clearly tipped in favour of the DJs. Looking at old rave flyers, I don't think the average ticket price has changed that much in the last 25 years, which is mad to think about.

Anyway, the original comment was about producers having day jobs, not big name touring DJs. Trawling through Discogs, it quickly becomes apparent that a hell of a lot of names from the '90s only ever produced 10-20 records before vanishing. I think it's fair to say that the majority of records circulating were made by people producing on the side.

update she moved to LA to sell crystal meth , kidding.

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Originally posted by SYSTEM-J In the early days it was the promoters pocketing most of the cash. Sasha was the first superstar DJ, and I've read his fee doubled annually in the early '90s. So around 1990 he was on about �500 a gig. By 1992 it was �2,000. He was obviously at the top tier of earnings. So the bigger events back then which were hooking one or two thousand people were probably making �10-20,000 for the promoters, of which probably less than a quarter went on the venue/sound hire and DJs. This is why a lot of criminals quickly got involved in the orbital rave scene at the end of the '80s. Down the years the balance has clearly tipped in favour of the DJs. Looking at old rave flyers, I don't think the average ticket price has changed that much in the last 25 years, which is mad to think about. Anyway, the original comment was about producers having day jobs, not big name touring DJs. Trawling through Discogs, it quickly becomes apparent that a hell of a lot of names from the '90s only ever produced 10-20 records before vanishing. I think it's fair to say that the majority of records circulating were made by people producing on the side.

Dammit.Beat me to it.

In the 90's the promoters made out like bandits, some clubs and raves were charging �10-20 to get in and on big nights up o $50, yet top DJ's we paid �2000 for two or three hour set, and supporting DJ's or WArm Ups were typically �500 tops.

Sasha was getting �2k for giant raves. I remember oakenfols saying he usually got $10k a gig but would often discount for interesting gigs or places he wanted to visit and that was around 97.

Sure, if you played very week or even several times a week, that was decent money, but remember that your agent and or manager took 15-20%, then you usually had a driver if you were gigging a lot...the expenses started to wrack up,and compared to a decently paid job, it only really made sense if you were in the top flight.

If you were a grafting DJ, working the circuit in the UK, playing out a fair it, Quitting a decently paid job was a bit scary.

I's nothing like it is now if you hit the big time one gig is what you'd be lucky to clear in a year.

I think Danny Rampling wasn't even what you'd consider wealthy until the late 90's, and he'd been plugging away for 20 years straight and had one of the most influential clubs.

Don't get me wrong, there was money to be had and there wer certainly poeple that did't have regular jobs, but there's countless stories of DJ's eventually quitting their day job to go full time.

Back on Topic, producers were somewhat a mixed bag. You could make money as sales were physical and if you sold 1000 copies you'd get a couple of grand. But on the whole you could have 20 decent selling tracks, get some club play and not make enough to survive a year.

I think people forget that there were plenty of producers that never played a gig, and many who also had to start DJ'ing to make money off it or increase their sales etc.

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Originally posted by SYSTEM-J In the early days it was the promoters pocketing most of the cash.

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Originally posted by DJ RANN In the 90's the promoters made out like bandits, some clubs and raves were charging �10-20 to get in and on big nights up o $50, yet top DJ's we paid �2000 for two or three hour set, and supporting DJ's or WArm Ups were typically �500 tops.

Interesting, didn't know that, maybe it was specific to the Uk though? In any case, it seems like that relationship is now almost inverse, where promoters get the short end of the stick since even more popular underground artists will often have outrageous booking fees that will swallow most of the revenue made on the night with covers and drinks. I remember one of the guys from Concrete (probably the biggest underground clubs in Paris the last 6 or 7 years) talking about how fees for many artists have almost doubled each other for the past few years.

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