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Commercialization of Electronica?

There's no more such term as underground electronica. Trance / etc. is becoming more and more popular all around the world, and that's what scares me. In 1999 (known as the best year of trance) you could still consider it underground, it's only that in the past few years that the scene has begun rapidly unfolding, attracting more and more people to clubs & raves.

Back in the days and even now heated discussions about "why don't more people listen to electronica?" filled forums and chatrooms with flame wars and ignorant remarks about the non-trancers. Most people want electronica to become widely popular, sort of like rock.

Unfortunately, even with today's integration of trance into the commercial dance charts, they don't see how dangerous the situation has become. To me, to all the real fans of electronica, the genre is not simply something you listen to when you are bored. Electronica is about emotions, about letting you experience things that you would not able to experience with any other genre of music; electronica takes you on a journey. When I listen to a tune, I feel the tune, I live the tune.

These days with so many commercial tracks coming out, it is really sad to see what the scene has become. As the general Jay-Z, Britney Spears, NSYNC public becomes more familiar with what they call techno (Ian Van Dahl, DJ Sammy, the lowest of the low on the real trance scene), the degradation of electronica becomes more apparent.

My fear is that by undergoing such integration, trance could simply become more and more commercial in the next few years, leaving us, the real fans with nothing special of our own. For now, most of the radios beat to death only the cheesiest tracks that never even make it in our community. Even within our own circle some commercialization has happened, such as tracks that are played to death by every single DJ, so that they lose their special touch when you hear them for the 158th time.

However, with tunes by artists like 4 Strings and Riva sometimes making it to the radio (although, usually, the cheesiest versions), one can see how the apocalypse of electronica has already started. I can not predict what will happen in the future, but I really-really hope that Electronica will be something all the *real* fans who understand it can keep as their own special thing. I'm extremely against the mainstream public listening to trance, because they simply cannot appreciate it.

Dunno, I just felt like saying all that. I know some of you will agree, and some of you will disagree. Sure, who are we to decide what to keep to ourselves and what to give to others? Maybe I'm wrong about this whole idea, and it's a good thing that trance aka electronica is becoming more popular. Just post your thoughts, I want to know what the general feeling about this subject is

It's the cycle of popular culture and music.

underground to passionet fanbase to commercialism then back to the underground then it repeats itself.

I think there is no going back to the underground as it's been in the mainstream for 5 years now. There wont be that buzz that it had 10 years ago but there still are ppl pushing the boundries everywhere in small unknown clubs, warehouse parties & ppl's house parties.

Just look through the shit and you will find gold.

Fear not. Even IF electronic music does become big there's no reason why ALL electronic music will become cheese. There will still be quality tracks, they just take a true tranceaddict to have appreciation for them.
ie. Rap is the mainstream music right now. What we hear is pretty much all garbage mtv run-of-the-mill stuff. But there are underground rappers out there who arent commercial superstars, and dont want to be. They actually write songs that are meaningful to them and have nothing to do with money, bitchez etc. The majority of the people out there who listen to hiphop will probably never hear these underground names because they listen to rap because it is what is cool. But the people who have a real appreciation for that music will hear it, and will love it.... Kind of like our little community here

Have faith bud.

I know exactly what you mean. Its even worse down here where I live. All people know of trance is what they hear on the radio ever 2 years. Atlanta is different, but in the backwoods where I live, Its bad. I almost dont want to tell people about trance, but then I remember, who am I to withhold this gift from humanity? My life has be changed so much by this music, can I sleep at night knowing that I am withholding it from people whom I know it will do good? The answer is no! We must let everyone hear this gift. Im drunk right now, but even in review I still think this is sound. Please pardon an over zelous newbie.

Very well said.

I feel very similar.

I hate it when ignorant fucks are like "yeah, I like trance, yeah dj sammy and moby and stuff, yeah they are cool"; its like STFU you ignorant squirm.

No, I think for the most part the idea of trance becoming mainstream shouldnt lower the standards of music too much. The people who do it now, do it for the music, and the majority of them will continue to do it for that reason.

Also the notion that trance music needs to "be kept away from the masses" almost makes me sick.

interesting...

I think this arguement is completely arrogant.

Its about the music. Listen to the music you want to listen to, let other people listen to the music they want to listen to. The popularization of electronic music may happen, or it may not, who knows. But what does that have to do with the quality of the music being produced by Paul Van Dyk, Dj Tiesto, Armin Van Buuren, Blank and Jones, Gabriel and Dresden, Marco V, Push, ok I could go on for days and days. The only thing that will change is that you wont be the only person in your entire city who actually knows who these people are, and the only one who knows these tunes they come up with. Just because the music becomes popular, how does that change the way the music actually sounds?

ok ok now you all are probably going to say that once it becomes popular, some cheesy new artists are going to make there own trance records and they are going to really suck.

But do you have to listen to them? of course not we all have that freedom to listen to whatever music we want and thats the beauty of it all.

If Tiesto and And PvD ect didnt have some kind of popularity, some kind of fanbase, they wouldnt be making enough money to keep producing more of the great music they do. Your complaints are pathetic.

^^^^

what he said

Re: Commercialization of Electronica?

quote:

Originally posted by TiestoInTheMix However, with tunes by artists like 4 Strings and Riva sometimes making it to the radio (although, usually, the cheesiest versions), one can see how the apocalypse of electronica has already started. I

god forbid should someone have 1 hit in the style of trance music, and make a little money, while more commercial artists in other genres have dozens of hits and no one cares. Oh and I seem to recall that trance is not the only hit worthy style of electronica, Fatboy Slim was huge in America with "Praise You", and he along with several other electronica artists were played out on American MTV. Prodigy sold how many millions of records again? & no one seems to be complaining about how commercial they were for selling too many records.

quote:

Originally posted by Nalin Very well said. I feel very similar. I hate it when ignorant fucks are like "yeah, I like trance, yeah dj sammy and moby and stuff, yeah they are cool"; its like STFU you ignorant squirm.

I dont think most people call Moby or DJ Sammy trance, Moby plays the MTV style electronic dance like Fatboy Slim, Prodigy, etc, & DJ Sammy plays the radio style. I have yet to see the more synthesizer driven radio style ever get on MTV in America though. I could be wrong as I simply dont watch MTV anymore for health reasons.

I agree with The Master... besides, the more people listening to cheese, the more people may get to the real thing and help the scene grow up with good stuff

Well Master you still have to distunguish between Home Listening and Clubbing. Of course, commercialization of Trance won't affect the individual whos lying on his bed at night listening to some fine mix with headphones on. There it won't matter if at the same time other, musically less educated, ppl do the same. But Tranceaddiction also contains the active participation in clubbing life, and that's where commercialization shows its negative side effects such as the "trendiness" to follow the current hip lifestyle without any knowledge about it. Commercialization might indeed pollute the scene in that more and more, how should i put it.."wannabees" or..simply ppl who follow the trend, destroy a unique atmosphere of shared passion for trance just in order to be "cool".

In austria for example, there are clubs with cheesy-and-commercial as hell music leading to a horrible crowd that calls itself "ravers" but goes there for the booze and the chicks. Imagine big Trance parties in the future, with such a crowd. Oh wait, just ask the Dutch TA's about the ppl who go to Sensation and TranceEnergy nowadays. All because of the commercialization of what was once preserved for real fans only.

Timo Maas said it best. "Music for the Maases"

I agree with Rich from Solarstone:

quote:

Over the next few years, how do you think trance will evolve? Rich: I'm more concerned about the state of the world at the moment, but the current climate suggests that most of the greedy manipulative money-making types are jumping ship, so the scene shall return to those who created it, possibly creating two split scenes, i'e a 'Pop Trance' which as we all know isnt really trance just pop music with a similar style of production' aimed at making money, and a Real 'Trance' scene, which is what we're about, melody and quality production for people who love music first http://trance.nu/v3/interview_show.php?id=113

The problem people have with "trance" going mainstream is that it devalues their own image and they don't want to be accociated with something so commercial. No great loss, the scene will be a better place when they move onto the next big thing.

As Rich from Solarstone said, there's a big difference between pop trance and the trance we all like. There's no reason the two can't exist together.

Oh and TiestoInTheMix, Trance wasn't undergroundin '99. Not where I come from anyway

Maybe what I have to say can put some of your hearts at ease.

I've been listening to trance for 3 years now, and I've been spinning trance for over a year. When I first started listening to trance (or techno, as I used to call it), the first things I listened to were popular radio songs like Alice DeeJay - Better Off Alone, and Aha - Take On Me (Techno Remix). From there I progressed to the slightly less heard of but still very popular and trendy sounds of Oakenfold and Atb. After searching for more trance music, I finally came across Tiesto, who is still one of my favorite DJ's, and then after him I came around to PvD (My current Fav), and then after that the deeper progressive sounds of Sasha, Max Graham, Digweed, James Holden, and some others.

The more underground side of the scene might possibly be more accessible in other countries, but here in the US, the only hints you will get of trance music will be the radio cheese, and if it wasn't for that I wouldn't have even discovered trance at all. I think that if people really love music, and value the same things that trance fans and electronica fans value, they will make their way through the shit and discover what trance is really about.

By the way, if all you guys are afraid of the scene losing its quality and turning to cheese, you should go out and write your own sick tunes

quote:

Originally posted by DJ_Skaya Maybe what I have to say can put some of your hearts at ease. I've been listening to trance for 3 years now, and I've been spinning trance for over a year. When I first started listening to trance (or techno, as I used to call it), the first things I listened to were popular radio songs like Alice DeeJay - Better Off Alone, and Aha - Take On Me (Techno Remix). From there I progressed to the slightly less heard of but still very popular and trendy sounds of Oakenfold and Atb. After searching for more trance music, I finally came across Tiesto, who is still one of my favorite DJ's, and then after him I came around to PvD (My current Fav), and then after that the deeper progressive sounds of Sasha, Max Graham, Digweed, James Holden, and some others. The more underground side of the scene might possibly be more accessible in other countries, but here in the US, the only hints you will get of trance music will be the radio cheese, and if it wasn't for that I wouldn't have even discovered trance at all. I think that if people really love music, and value the same things that trance fans and electronica fans value, they will make their way through the shit and discover what trance is really about. By the way, if all you guys are afraid of the scene losing its quality and turning to cheese, you should go out and write your own sick tunes

i guess i'm asking whether the genre is going to become less special to us. if the masses get their hands on it, will it become raped, mutilated, and trampled down into dust beyond recognition so that it'll lose some or most of its special touch. i guess it does have something to do with self-image. how many of us want to be associated with the stereotype of the close-minded and ignorant progressive fans?

yes, i'm a bit selfish, but only because i don't want the masses to listen to this music because it's "popular"; i don't want 12yo girls going crazy over PVD just because it's the "hip" thing to do. it sickens me to think that someone might listen to trance and not appreciate it for what it is, for its possibilities and emotions.

but that's me and i could be wrong, maybe this all doesn't make sense because, as already mentioned, there will always be that "underground" part that we will be able to enjoy.

p.s. oh, if any of you read (or seen, although the movie is much worse in that sense) The Beach by Alex Garland... i guess that's the thing i'm talking about - what would you do to keep your paradise and should you even try to do anything it all?

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Once again I totally agree.

quote:

Originally posted by TranceGiant But Tranceaddiction also contains the active participation in clubbing life, and that's where commercialization shows its negative side effects such as the "trendiness" to follow the current hip lifestyle without any knowledge about it.

waaa.. you dont have to be a active participant in clubbing life. I never been to a club, or rave(i say this cause pvd played in new years eve =[ ) but i dont even believe that you have to goto clubs or whatever. If you love the music, you dont need to participate in anything.
but i agree with you on the commercialization because most fellow college friends of mine goto clubs a lot, maybe its their passion to dance, or stupid reasons. Trance is still 'underground' in california, but i do see a lot of kids listening to it now. Maybe they're doing it because tehy want to be that 'cool raver' or whatever. I doubt i'd see most of them listening to sasha or digweed.

oh yeah, i would have no idea whats popular anymore since i dont listen to the radio or what mtv or whatever. You guys shoudl try to stay away from radios or whatever since it'll ruin your like for the music you love.

It's slowly catching on. We'll see what genre will be huge over here since the urban scene will come to and end soon.

quote:

Originally posted by TiestoInTheMix i guess i'm asking whether the genre is going to become less special to us. if the masses get their hands on it, will it become raped, mutilated, and trampled down into dust beyond recognition so that it'll lose some or most of its special touch. i guess it does have something to do with self-image. how many of us want to be associated with the stereotype of the close-minded and ignorant progressive fans? yes, i'm a bit selfish, but only because i don't want the masses to listen to this music because it's "popular"; i don't want 12yo girls going crazy over PVD just because it's the "hip" thing to do. it sickens me to think that someone might listen to trance and not appreciate it for what it is, for its possibilities and emotions. but that's me and i could be wrong, maybe this all doesn't make sense because, as already mentioned, there will always be that "underground" part that we will be able to enjoy. p.s. oh, if any of you read (or seen, although the movie is much worse in that sense) The Beach by Alex Garland... i guess that's the thing i'm talking about - what would you do to keep your paradise and should you even try to do anything it all?

I don't get why you're bothered why other people listen to trance though? How does that affect your enjoyment of it? Does it mean there's less good quality tunes coming out? I don't think that's the case, it just means there's more shit but you decide what you listen to.

You compare trance to Alex Garlands beach "Paradise". That "Paradise" was actually being spoilt by people who didn't appreciate it, the enjoyment of those who founded it was being directly affected by the newcomers. I don't see how the same can be said for trance.

Plus, that "Paradise" was actually far from that, it was just full of a load of fucked up paranoid druggies.... a bit like the trance scene then Plus there were those who read about it, but never actually went there... again, famililer?

Re: Commercialization of Electronica?

There's really no substance to what you said, if you look at the situation you will realize that it's really rather common. There is no such thing as underground music, get over it, your tastes aren't better than anyone else's, even if they listen to NSYNC. You are both listening to music for the same reasons. So you might as well suck it up, stop being an electronic (and trust me, dance music is not the heart of electronic music) music elitist, and just listen to what you want. It's very selfish to not want other people to listen to a genre of music because you wouldn't want to be associated with them. Not even selfish, just plan moronic...you've missed the point of music entirely...

Everything has the potential to be commercial, and its not up to us to "decide" what to share and what not to share....it's the way things go. If something is overcommercialized, it will eventually die and something else will come about, even in EDM...

except house, which will never die. Ever.

Re: Re: Commercialization of Electronica?

quote:

Originally posted by havok118 There is no such thing as underground music, get over it, your tastes aren't better than anyone else's, even if they listen to NSYNC. You are both listening to music for the same reasons.

That's the problem. We AREN'T listening to music for the same reasons. If classical music were to ever hit MTV (which I really doubt would happen), would people start listening to it because it's "cool to do so"? I wonder how classicaladdicts feel about rap artists rapping and remaking classical melodies. I bet fans of classical aren't too fond of that.

I guess it's hard for many to see my point because you don't feel the same way I do. Maybe I'm just trying to stay independent of the likes of the mainstream public because I don't want them dipping their filthy hands in something that I consider very special to me. Yes, I'm selfish, but only because I don't want the general tourists of music stomping across something precious to me, possibly leaving me with shattered pieces. I'd rather not have trance / etc. become popular at all, than it becoming popular for a short period of time and then dying like disco. I don't know much about disco, but whose fault was it that it died? Was it the public or just lack of fans?

Re: Re: Re: Commercialization of Electronica?

quote:

Originally posted by TiestoInTheMix That's the problem. We AREN'T listening to music for the same reasons. If classical music were to ever hit MTV (which I really doubt would happen), would people start listening to it because it's "cool to do so"? I wonder how classicaladdicts feel about rap artists rapping and remaking classical melodies. I bet fans of classical aren't too fond of that. I guess it's hard for many to see my point because you don't feel the same way I do. Maybe I'm just trying to stay independent of the likes of the mainstream public because I don't want them dipping their filthy hands in something that I consider very special to me. Yes, I'm selfish, but only because I don't want the general tourists of music stomping across something precious to me, possibly leaving me with shattered pieces. I'd rather not have trance / etc. become popular at all, than it becoming popular for a short period of time and then dying like disco. I don't know much about disco, but whose fault was it that it died? Was it the public or just lack of fans?

uh, classical music requires an attention span.

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