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Posted by LiquidX on Feb-19-2003 21:23:

Why boycott ?

Obviously obtained from Foxnews.com

quote:
NEW YORK � Jokes about France are plentiful lately, but many Americans aren't laughing at the European country's resistance to using force with Iraq -- and are fighting back by closing their wallets.

In fact, beaucoup d'Americans have decided to boycott French products such as wine and cheese, in an effort to hurt the country's economy.

Fromage.com, a French cheese distributor, reported that its sales to the United States have gone down 15 percent in the past two weeks. Some U.S. eateries are no longer offering French wines. And a restaurant in North Carolina has even changed the name of its fries.

Neal Rowland, who owns Cubbie's restaurant in Beaufort, N.C., said he decided to put stickers that say "Freedom" over the word "French" on all his menus after he watched France back away from support for war in Iraq.

"Since the French are backing down, French fries and French everything needs to be banned," he told Foxnews.com in a telephone interview. "Fry sales have really gone up. People who eat them now say, 'Freedom never tasted so good.'"

Rowland cooked up the freedom fry idea last week after a conversation with a customer about World War I days, when anti-German sentiment prompted Americans to rename familiar German foods. Sauerkraut and frankfurters became liberty cabbage and hot dogs.

And Rowland said patrons have been in full support of the fry renaming.

"I had a gentleman come in today, who works at the court house, and he was crying, his son is serving in Afghanistan and he said he was so glad someone is taking a stand," said Rowland. "He was proud to see the support in the community for the troops."

If the backlash is strong enough, it could impact the French economy -- American trade with France tops $30 billion a year.

But some French aren't amused by, or afraid of, the boycott.

"Well, if they prefer to eat American food, it is entirely their problem," Guillaume Parmentier, the head of the French Centre on the United States, told the Canadian new service CBC.ca. "But seriously. This never works. Boycotts work when there are grave human rights violations or something like that."

U.S. lawmakers are also eager to remind the French that Americans bailed them out in both World Wars, at a cost of tens of thousands of lives. Some in Congress are even pursuing possible trade restrictions.

Rep. H. James Saxton, a New Jersey Republican, has drafted a resolution that calls for a U.S. boycott of the Paris Air Show this spring.

"If [the Chirac government] fails to find a way to cooperate, we'll urge U.S. citizens, companies and the military to forego participation," Saxton told WorldNetDaily.com.

House Speaker Dennis Hastert said he'd like to target bottled French mineral water and wine. He has instructed Republican colleagues to determine whether Congress should pass laws that would impose new health standards on bottles of Evian and other French waters.

According to the Beverage Marketing Corporation, France is the leading exporter of water to the United States and sold 65 million gallons last year.

It's not the first time Americans have boycotted French products. Back in 1985 when the French would not allow U.S. military planes to fly over their airspace on their way to bomb Libya, U.S. consumers boycotted industries, including fashion, food and wine. And a similar boycott happened in 1995 and 1996 when France refused to stop testing nuclear weapons in the South Pacific.

But Boris Marchand-Tonnel of the French-U.S. chamber of commerce in Paris played down the threat.

"Maybe in a few New York restaurants, a few clients will refuse to order French wine," he told The Guardian. "But it's peanuts against the overall picture, it's really just symbolic."

Whether the boycott impacts the French economy or not, Americans from Congress to Cubbie's are saying the French can "faux-get" our future support and money.

Rowland said one freedom fry eater told him: "On Sept. 11 if a plane had slammed into the Eiffel Tower I guarantee the French would've been on the phone to the Americans saying, 'Please, we need help.' It's time for them to step up to the plate and help us."

Ok, I think its rediculous to boycott a country whose opinions differ from the US. Right here, by the action that some congress mans want to take, show clearly how the US will act against countries that dont want to help the US with the war they want to go into. And by changing the name of French Fries to Freedom Fries ? ? and Wines and Cheese ?? I mean come on, its politics, why should we get politics involved with the rest of our normal daily lifes ? .. If the whole world then starts boycotting against the US in means of ANTI-WAR then, then the US will be in an even worst economic problem. In my OPINION, its rediculous to boycott for this ..

Posted by Izzy on Feb-19-2003 22:00:

i just want to point out the in numerous occasions the french have boycotted american products. there was a big deal a few years ago where there was a large movement to boycott McDonalds and other american chains because it was hurting their local economy. i also remember the french farmers boycotting american items because america was selling cheaper grains, and raw food to france then what there own people could produce

Posted by LiquidX on Feb-19-2003 23:04:

quote:
Originally posted by Izzy
i just want to point out the in numerous occasions the french have boycotted american products. there was a big deal a few years ago where there was a large movement to boycott McDonalds and other american chains because it was hurting their local economy. i also remember the french farmers boycotting american items because america was selling cheaper grains, and raw food to france then what there own people could produce

Good point, but thats like in more of other topic, in means of american products hurting the FRENCH economy.. but in a situation like this, is it right to ? ? .. oh well .

Posted by IronDragon on Feb-20-2003 00:29:

Calling for some mass boycott of French products is ridiculous. Obviously individuals (*cough* neo-conservatives) can boycott French, German, Belgian products if they so desire but to attempt to deprive anyone just because they don't agree with American foreign policy (albeit in an unfortunately bellicose and sometimes unreasonable way) is simply ridiculous.

Posted by Izzy on Feb-20-2003 00:30:

right now none of this boycott is state sponsered or state endorsed, thus its the indivuals desicion on whether to boycott or not. even though i may not agree with his desicion i have no right in telling him what he can and can not do.

Posted by IronDragon on Feb-20-2003 02:10:

quote:
Originally posted by Izzy
right now none of this boycott is state sponsered or state endorsed, thus its the indivuals desicion on whether to boycott or not. even though i may not agree with his desicion i have no right in telling him what he can and can not do.

No one's asking you to be didactic, I just want to know your opinion. As probably the most hawkish and neo-conservative person I see here I would *assume* I know where you stand but I would really like to know.

Posted by Izzy on Feb-20-2003 02:32:

honestly, no i wouldnt boycott french items because realisticly i dont think it will have any effect on the issue, neither will a mass boycott by the public. it'll probably just pull both sides to greater and opposite extremes which means we'll be worse off then where we are now.

Posted by occrider on Feb-20-2003 02:59:

I agree ... it's absurd to boycott french goods over their stance on this issue. Oh well what can you do ... there are a lot of ignorant people on this planet.

Posted by PhaseFour on Feb-20-2003 03:51:

well, people can do whatever they want w/ their cash. i doubt its gonna be a BIG problem to the french economy anyway. but imo, sure beats the hell outta the human shields thing haha

Posted by JM on Feb-20-2003 05:18:

i buy cheddar cheese made in Tillamook, Oregon.
i buy red wine made in NoCal, or Yakima Valley, Washington.

I WILL REFUSE TO BUY FRENCH PRODUCTS!!!!!

The other day, my sister wanted to buy some nice little thing, and when her husband turned it around and read "Made In France" he asked her not to buy it, and gave reasons. She agreed - DID NOT BUY

yes, if there are enough people boycotting FRENCH products, France's economy will be hurt a bit, no?

I myself will boycott French products....i dont like their policies, reminds me of communism.

and to show my support i will write in big yellow bold letters "BOYCOTT FRENCH PRODUCTS - SUPPORT OUR TROOPS FOR JUSTICE"

HEH. Well see if that has some impact. And i will post sooo much that my sig will be seen by many on TA, maybe it will have some impact...

>JM<

Posted by Arbiter on Feb-20-2003 05:49:

France makes products? News to me.

Posted by occrider on Feb-20-2003 07:01:

quote:
Originally posted by JM
i buy cheddar cheese made in Tillamook, Oregon.
i buy red wine made in NoCal, or Yakima Valley, Washington.

I WILL REFUSE TO BUY FRENCH PRODUCTS!!!!!

The other day, my sister wanted to buy some nice little thing, and when her husband turned it around and read "Made In France" he asked her not to buy it, and gave reasons. She agreed - DID NOT BUY

yes, if there are enough people boycotting FRENCH products, France's economy will be hurt a bit, no?

I myself will boycott French products....i dont like their policies, reminds me of communism.

and to show my support i will write in big yellow bold letters "BOYCOTT FRENCH PRODUCTS - SUPPORT OUR TROOPS FOR JUSTICE"

HEH. Well see if that has some impact. And i will post sooo much that my sig will be seen by many on TA, maybe it will have some impact...

>JM<

Out of curiosity, how does boycotting french products support our troops overceas? It's not like french products or the french government has a detrimental impact on our troops. The French only have an impact on our foreign policy. In this case we are not necessarily better off (and in fact we would be worse off) if we went to war. And if you think a war would be good for the US, think about the exoribant costs it would take to not only wage the war but to base significant amounts of troops to occupy Iraq following the conflict. Hmmm kinda ironic how I think we should invade Iraq yet I'm arguing against it in this particular instance. At any rate, if you think that boycotting french products is making a political statement I can assure you it will have no impact. If anything it would hurt the US economy in the long run much like a tarrif or a similar trade barrier. Showing support for Bush and voicing disapproval over France is commendable, but boycotting french goods is just plain silly.

Posted by LiquidX on Feb-20-2003 11:29:

Posted by LiquidX on Feb-20-2003 11:31:

And Ohhh .. about the signature, man, enjoy some trance ! ! ! ! ! ! and leave politics IN THE POLITICAL FORUM. Theres some french people on this forum, its not nice to jsut show it off. But whatever, its your free will...mmmm thats why I dont like many times conservatives, they take it to extremes.

Posted by malek on Feb-20-2003 12:59:

quote:
Originally posted by Arbiter
France makes products? News to me.

dude what kind of comment is that? you've sink lowwwwww

Posted by Renegade on Feb-20-2003 14:45:

Forget the boycotts, what's with all the anti-French sentiment in the US? What have the French done apart from oppose a war which the vast majority of the countries in the world disagree with?

I can remember reading an article in a paper over here about how fervent the anger is over there. They showed a picture of the front of one of the major papers (maybe the NY Times?) that had a photo of the US graves in Normandy with the massive heading "Sacrifice" as if to say "seeing as we helped you in WW2, you have no right to oppose this war now". There were quotes from various articles, which included a description of the French as "yellow-bellied surrender monkies". Firstly, what the hell does WW2 have to do with it? Why do Americans (not all obviously, but a lot) bring up World War 2 at every available opportunity? Many American soldiers may have died protecting France in the 1940's and I'm sure that the French appreciate it, but what does that have to do with the war on Iraq? Can the French point to their support of the American cause in the war of independance as a reason why the US should bend over and follow France blindly, doing whatever they are told?

Secondly, given that there isn't anything France can do to stop the US should they wish to go to war without UN approval, what the hell do Americans care what France think? If you're going to ignore international opinion either way, don't kick up a fuss when another nation tells you what you don't like to hear. What would be the point if every nation on Earth agreed completely with what the US said? It's checks and balances. Can you imagine if any given country in history had been allowed to do whatever it liked? To bomb whoever, whenever? A cause needs opposition so that it may see fault within itself. Any cause that ignores its own antithesis - so convinced of its own self-righteousness - is, in all likelihood, acting wrongly. It's wrong to assume that any individual or state can ever be entirely right or entirely wrong in anything it does, and that is why an opposition is needed. Perhaps Bush, Rumsfeld and the gang could read some Hegel (though Bush may actually need to learn how to read first) before they criticise the audacity of the French to disagree with the US: "It is only in mutual recognition that a dialectical movement can take place" - if the thesis doesn't acknowledge the antithesis, the thesis fails to evolve, to improve.

I'm glad that the French have stood up and voiced the opinions of the vast majority of ordinary citizens around the world. It's no coincidence that the French speech after Hans Blix's report received a stirring ovation in the UN Security council whereas Powell's received none. I hope that the EU can find unity in this issue (they have to a certain degree, declaring that war should only be the final resort) and provide a more stable, less aggressive antithesis to the US than the one provided by the USSR. And that's the point - the US hasn't had any opposition since the collapse of the Soviet Union, no-one to keep it in check, no independant international conscience. I think that French/European opposition is good for the US and, most importantly, good for the globe.

So let me be the first to say: "J'adore France et j'adore les gens de francais. Vive le France".

Posted by Arbiter on Feb-20-2003 15:02:

quote:
Originally posted by ahlamalek
dude what kind of comment is that? you've sink lowwwwww

= sarcasm

Posted by FuzzyGreen on Feb-20-2003 15:44:

Boycotting French items because they have an opposing view on something is stupid and potentially dangerous. This could cause weak views on Americans to become weaker thus causing future hatered. Luckily this has only been happening with a very minute portion of Americans.

Posted by FuzzyGreen on Feb-20-2003 15:50:

quote:
Originally posted by Renegade
Forget the boycotts, what's with all the anti-French sentiment in the US?

I think that a lot of the European anti-Americanism is starting to show it's affects on the American people. Since the French seem to be the most Anti-American then naturally they will see the most reverse discrimination.

Posted by JudgeJulez on Feb-20-2003 16:09:

quote:
Originally posted by FuzzyGreen
I think that a lot of the European anti-Americanism is starting to show it's affects on the American people. Since the French seem to be the most Anti-American then naturally they will see the most reverse discrimination.

I wouldn't say many Europeans are anti-American; rather, they are anti-Bush Administration.

Posted by JohnSmith on Feb-20-2003 16:40:

Nice post renegade! I especially liked this line:

quote:
Any cause that ignores its own antithesis - so convinced of its own self-righteousness - is, in all likelihood, acting wrongly

Posted by occrider on Feb-20-2003 17:46:

quote:
Originally posted by JudgeJulez
I wouldn't say many Europeans are anti-American; rather, they are anti-Bush Administration.

Well like it or not, many Americans share the same views as Bush ... so they are anti-American.

Posted by arj1o1 on Feb-20-2003 18:54:

quote:
Originally posted by Arbiter
France makes products? News to me.

nice reply, bring something usefull information to the topic
french make some good products what do u think of all those cars

Posted by arj1o1 on Feb-20-2003 18:55:

Posted by LiquidX on Feb-20-2003 18:56:

quote:
Originally posted by occrider
Well like it or not, many Americans share the same views as Bush ... so they are anti-American.

Bush represents the country, but not the people .. he didnt get the popular vote so .. he does not represent the vast majority.

Another thing, the Anti-american subject in Europe is because of the actions, and sayings that come out of Bush's administration. Obviously, europeans think that AMERICANS think just like Bush, so they are like ANTI-AMERICANS.. sadly, ( for some, GLADLY) Bush's actions aare seen as if AMERICA .. not thinking that many americans are also thinking like the vast european countries. So, the anti-french thing on boycotting, is just totally different. Are the French doing an action that will affect the world ? ? no.. Its just the way they view things. Where as the US will ACT to what they think ! .. so its totally different hate .. if you know what I mean.

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