What's up guys, wondering if you could help me out.

I've been struggling quite a bit lately making my saw synth leads. I know the basics of detuning, envelopes etc and create my own sounds all the time, I am just trying to make this lead line sound that I hear in a lot of trance tracks.

Here is a good example, the main synth at 2 minutes in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d7C5P4eJMY

Im not sure if it is a layering of a saw bass, a chord progression with a big detuned saw, and then a lead melody with some kind of piano? I may be way off but I'm really trying to figure out my layering and parameters on my synth.

I know there are a lot of real talented producers on this forum and some direction would really help me out. Thanks guys.

Well there is a piano playing the chords, layered with a saw, it's a bit generic shouldn't give you many problems. Sidechain compress the saw with gentle lfo and you should have the mid range part. Then it has a raspy bass, probably it's a sawtooth form. Probably the saw has a noise form in an osc.

saw waves + white noise. Rest is EQ and compression. IT really doesn't get any simpler than that. It is incredible how badly mixed that reference track is.

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It has a piano for sure.

nope. That other synth underneath which you can hear at the beginning end is just a typical trance pluck.

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"This is why Superman works alone." GC
old stuff from days gone by (2001-2004)
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maybe, i still think it's a piano plucks rarely have that release it's more like a short pizzicato that's not important though.

quote:

Originally posted by Looney4Clooney Rest is EQ and compression.

Maybe this is my problem. I'm really just not able to layer the way I want it to sound. Perhaps I am attacking the situation the wrong way.

How I go about this type of layering:
Bass: Saw waves w/ noise. Playing one note at a time.
EQ: Low cut between 20-35hz depending on the key of the track. Boost in the sub region, notch out a space for the kick drum around 70-100hz. Carve out all the low-mid, mid range, from about 120hz-1500hz. Boost the high shelf a bit.
Side chain compressor insert to the kick drum. Route to a bus with the kick to compress before the master.

Mid: Detuned saw playing chord progression
EQ: low cut so it doesn't interfere with the bass around 120hz. (Other eq'ing things to do here I don't know and could use some advice).
Side chained as an insert to the kick. Add reverb effects post side chain compression. Route to a bus to be compressed with the top lead and vocals before the master.

High: Pluck or Piano playing a single note melody in the treble clef.
EQ: Low cut around 140hz , clear a bit of range in the low mid with a bell curve by a couple db's between 140-1000hz. (Here is where I really am not sure what else to do).
Route to a bus with the lead and vocals to be compressed together before the master.


Sorry for the long message but I am just really trying to clear this up and improve as a producer because it seems I have some fundamental techniques being executed incorrectly.

Should I be compressing things on the tracks themselves as inserts? And am I missing layers (besides other percussive elements obviously).

Thanks for your help guys.

quote:

Im not sure if it is a layering of a saw bass,

I'll bet there's some layering. Definitely the mastering stage fattened that track up.

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quote:

Originally posted by TyeDynamite Maybe this is my problem. I'm really just not able to layer the way I want it to sound.

Thing is there is no prescriptive answer to this, it's a case of endless - and I really do me endless, experimentation.

Think of it this way. Imagine being a trainee scupltor making those gothic gargoyles you see on the sides of churches.

It would take you years to perfect the art, and for most of us, production is the same.

There is no painting by numbers formula whereby folling steps A - G suddenly allow you to become a proficient scuptor of clay or synthesisers.

Blending layers is also a moving target forever evolving.

Just spend a few years experimenting.

on the contrary i think you can get real close to the sound. If you can identify each elements separatel and have the midi it is just layer a saw bass a saw lead and a piano/pluck then start tweaking, do you think bass sounds too raspy? A bit more of cutoff in the filter. Getting 100% close is imposible though there are several parameters, equalization... even secondary things like hi hats or the kick make the overall mix to sound different.

Thanks guys. Ill keep working at it.