Hey Opus, I think it's great that the Democratic party got mobilized. I think it's great that we had record voter turnout. As they say in the markets, volume = conviction.


Did you see that not a single county in Oklahoma went to the blue while the trend in Kansas was fairly similar.

Even though I may not agree with all of your points and political views, I do agree with what I think the general movement your post suggests.

For one, this has been a major turnout. And both sides are majorly divided. I think what the majority should do now, is try to find a way to bring the country out of this split it is in now with one side VS the other.

It's something that can happen, yet how and when?

Rodas

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Hey Opus, I think it's great that the Democratic party got mobilized. I think it's great that we had record voter turnout. As they say in the markets, volume = conviction. Did you see that not a single county in Oklahoma went to the blue while the trend in Kansas was fairly similar.

Yeah, and I think what's even more telling is how sure so many folks and pollsters were giving the OK Sen. race to Dem. Carson as a result of Coburn being the smarmy fella that he really is, yet it went pretty handily to Coburn in the end.

And what's more - NH went to Kerry, while NM went to Bush. Can our country be any more divided between the North and the South now? This really needs to change.

And only two counties went Democrat in Kansas. I'll let you take a wild guess as to which KS county I live in (you have 2 guesses).

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

quote:

Originally posted by MisterOpus1 This will be my last post this week, so I want to state something that has been alluded to by a number of liberals.- Conservatives, watch your back. I've mentioned that this current situation is somewhat reminescent of the '64 defeat of Goldwater, giving rise to the Conservative movement. A very similar pattern is starting to brew with the Progressive movement. Granted, there are a myriad of problems with the Democratic party, and they simply must be addressed. But one thing is certain - we became more mobilized and fired up than ever, and this is only the beginning.

i agree, that after this huge victory in the face of an relentless and unmistakeable progressive/liberal/socialist movement, we must stay aware. i disagree with what you may be alluding to IMO as constant backstabbing for the years to come. i'm hearing this from you, Air America (i'm listening to right now) and somewhat in Edward's concession speach. this country did not become the greatest country in history because we abandoned working together internally.

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I cannot deny the fact that you were MORE mobilized, thus your righful success today in our government. But you cannot deny our mobilization, nor can you deny the cohesiveness of the Progressive movement this early on. Honestly it surprised the hell outa me - I really didn't think a bunch of tree-huggin' hippy libs. like myself would actually stick together so well . But we did. And you Conservatives should be concerned. It took the Conservatives 2 decades to become fully mobilized to the superpower you are today. What we've merely accomplished we did in less than 2 years.

nobody is gonna buy that for a second who is old enough to know better. conservative values haven't changed within the last 20 years to justify some current powerhouse that your talking about. second, the so called hippie/liberal, tree hugger movement didn't magically begin within that same timeframe either. those same hippie/liberal treehugging leaders that made those voices being heard so loud that it had this campaign on the run so many times this year got it's start decades earlier. what was accomplished in two years was more lies, exageration, and spin. something you can't deny because you were party to it.

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And you must simply remember that this nation is, indeed, deeply divided into those who absolutely love Bush vs. those who simply can't stand the sight of the guy. You have a slight majority right now, but denying and ignoring the other 49% of those who disagree with you can simply be your undoing if you're not careful. This is why I say that you must watch your back, the growing movement behind you has only begun. And you must also consider to keep your arrogance and confidence in check. You deny those who disagree with you, you are denying many more citizens than you are willing to admit. And as I've stated before, I think it's right that our President and his GOP Congress remain in power over the next 4 years because it was they who put us into this domestic fiscal and foreign occupation mess, and it must be they who find a way to get us out. If Kerry were elected, much of the blame could have been shifted to him and his efforts to climb us out of this hole. Not the case here, and I think it's rightly so. Conservatives, no matter how you try to spin it - our country and the rest of the world will blame YOU if you fuck this up. Show us the way out, show us how we'll keep ourselves on our feet, or else you'll have more than just a few angry liberals to deal with. Which brings me to my final point - if you cannot bring us out of our domestic and foreign mess, you should not only be watching your back, you should be running for cover, because it will surely fuel our Progressive movement that was once in its infant stages back in the good ol' days of '04. By then it will not be a difficult task, indeed, to pick up a great majority of citizens who were all collectively burnt by your idealism trumping realism, and begin to mow every one of you down, and take back a liberal majority. You have a job to do, Conservatives. I suggest you waste no time doing it. Get us the fuck on the right path and keep us there, or else that small, infant Progressive movement you feel breathing down your neck will soon be running you over, and it will not be looking back.

Noted.

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Originally posted by Q5echo i agree, that after this huge victory in the face of an relentless and unmistakeable progressive/liberal/socialist movement, we must stay aware. i disagree with what you may be alluding to IMO as constant backstabbing for the years to come. i'm hearing this from you, Air America (i'm listening to right now) and somewhat in Edward's concession speach. this country did not become the greatest country in history because we abandoned working together internally.

Not sure if I would agree with Air America here completely on the backstabbing, if that's what they're saying. But if history does indeed repeat itself with power and corruption in the Legislature, you should be very concerned about the Conservatives turning on one another.

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nobody is gonna buy that for a second who is old enough to know better. conservative values haven't changed within the last 20 years to justify some current powerhouse that your talking about.

No, that's not what I'm referring to. I was merely speaking in generalities about the Conservative movement - no one denies the fact that it has taken 20 years to get to where you are today in our government. You can certainly get to where you are now and not change your values in any way. I don't disagree with you there.

quote:

second, the so called hippie/liberal, tree hugger movement didn't magically begin within that same timeframe either. those same hippie/liberal treehugging leaders that made those voices being heard so loud that it had this campaign on the run so many times this year got it's start decades earlier.

True but a number of factors have come into play. But one in particular, the conservative mouthpieces (AM radio, Fox, WaTimes, etc.) is a giant hurdle that the liberals have never encountered before. Only recently have they been able to start the movement via Air America and through blogs. That's just but one small example, but as I stated, the overall sentiment is that our counter-forces to you clear advantage have only begun and are in their infant stages.

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what was accomplished in two years was more lies, exageration, and spin. something you can't deny because you were party to it.

I think that's simply the pot calling the kettle black there Q5. If you want to continue talking about issues and how they were presented to the people, I'm game to opening up another thread and discussing "rhetoric vs. reality." I fail to see how the Dems. "spun", "exagerated", or "lied" about the situation in Iraq and our growing ridiculous fiscal problem here at home any worse than the Republicans. In fact, I'd venture to say we were clearly outspun. It's no secret that this Administration and the GOP Congress clearly puts their idealism ahead of realism at times - sometimes it pans out, other times it doesn't. That really doesn't matter, though, because I think this election was a testament to the fact that perception was most certainly not the same as reality.

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

Last edited by MisterOpus1 on Nov-03-2004 at 22:30