Become a part of the TranceAddict community!Frequently Asked Questions - Please read this if you haven'tSearch the forums
TranceAddict Forums > Other > Political Discussion / Debate > Counting the Hidden Costs of War
  Last Thread   Next Thread
Share
Author
Thread    Post A Reply
Spacey Orange
still loves trance.



Registered: Jul 2004
Location: California
Counting the Hidden Costs of War

In a nutshell, this New york Times article discusses several competing analysees about the economic costs of the iraq war. Some conclusions are that the iraq war is a drag on the US economy, the costs are higher than purported by the press and politicians, and the US economy may have been stronger had the US not invaded iraq.

(There's no link because you have to register)

quote:
October 24, 2004
ECONOMIC VIEW
Counting the Hidden Costs of War
By ANNA BERNASEK

It's often said that truth is the first casualty of war. During a presidential campaign, that may be more apt than ever. Consider a seemingly simple question: What is the cost of the Iraq war to the United States? President Bush and Senator John Kerry have given different answers, but both candidates have ignored what may be the biggest cost item: the war's impact on the overall economy.

After all, the real cost of war is not only the money spent but also the economic effects, good or bad. For example, World War II led to huge levels of production and employment in the United States, while the Vietnam War dragged down economic growth as it wore on.

So, after 19 months of conflict in Iraq, how has the war affected America's economy, and what about the future?

Of course, calculating the net effect of a continuing war is neither easy nor exact. That's why many analysts are reluctant to try. But a few knowledgeable economists have made reasoned estimates, and the results are surprising.

The economic cost incurred so far may be as large as - or larger than - what has actually been spent directly on the war. (While estimates vary, the official figure for spending stands at around $120 billion since the conflict began.) And there are likely to be major economic costs as long as the war continues.

But start with the economic impact to date. Two economists, Warwick J. McKibbin of the Brookings Institution and Andrew Stoeckel of the Center for International Economics in Australia, have calculated that the war may have already cost the United States $150 billion in lost gross domestic product since fighting began in March 2003. That is close to one percentage point of growth lost over the past year and a half. If that figure is correct, the nation's annual economic growth rate, which has been 3.7 percent during this period, could have been nearly 4.7 percent without the war.

Where does that $150 billion figure come from? The study took into account factors like higher oil prices, increased budget deficits and greater uncertainty. When analyzing the effects of uncertainty, the authors estimated the impact of the war on financial markets, business investment and consumer spending.

Of course, the results of any economic model are open to debate, and the $150 billion estimate is no exception. Some economists, like David Gold at the New School University, argue that the figure may be too low while others, like Mark Zandi of Economy.com, contend that it's on the high side.

But if Mr. McKibbin and Mr. Stoeckel are correct in their estimate, the real cost of the war to date, including direct spending and lost economic growth, is in the neighborhood of $270 billion.

Most economists would agree that the war has hurt the economy, mainly through higher oil prices and continuing uncertainty. The war's effect on oil prices is hard to disentangle from factors like higher global demand and supply disruptions, but it is commonly thought that the war's role has been significant.

"It isn't a coincidence that we have oil prices breaching the key $50-a-barrel threshold one and a half years into this war," said Stephen S. Roach, Morgan Stanley's chief global economist.

Mr. Zandi says the war has clearly "had a very large impact on our economy and on the psyches of business and consumers." He explained it this way: First, in the period before the war, fear and uncertainty held back the economic recovery. Then, as the initial invasion succeeded, the economy recovered strongly and found its footing again. Now, as the war drags on, higher oil prices and shaky confidence are dampening the pace of growth and job creation.

What really worries economists, though, is the future economic impact. "The longer this war runs, the weaker our long-run growth will be," Mr. Zandi said. That is because spending on things like the occupation and peacekeeping in Iraq does not do anything to bolster the American economy's productive capacity.

And it adds to the growing budget shortfall. "With a budget deficit already at 3.5 percent of G.D.P.," Mr. Roach said, "that's a really big deal."

To see how big the future economic costs could be, consider a study prepared by William D. Nordhaus, a Yale economist. Back in 2002, when the merits of going to war with Iraq were being debated, Professor Nordhaus published a thorough analysis of the potential economic costs. It has become the most influential study on the topic. (Mr. McKibbin and Mr. Stoeckel collaborated with Professor Nordhaus, and they relied on many of his assumptions to build their model.)

Professor Nordhaus calculated how much output the economy would lose, based on two possibilities: a quick victory or a long conflict. Although he has not updated his results, the long-conflict version has turned out to be pretty accurate so far. He estimated that such a conflict would result in $140 billion in direct government spending, a figure that we are already near. He also predicted that oil prices would spike and that heightened uncertainty would hurt the economy. In addition, he expected large additional costs associated with the occupation and peacekeeping operations as well as with reconstruction and nation-building efforts.

Adding it all together, he came up with a whopping figure of $1.9 trillion in costs during the decade after the invasion.

OF course, any analysis of the war's economic impact over time is not complete without considering the potential future benefits to the United States and the rest of the world. Increased political stability in the Middle East, stable energy markets and diminished global terrorism could pay major dividends. In fact, many people in Washington hope that the benefits will ultimately outweigh the costs, however large.

So far, though, 19 months into the conflict, those kinds of benefits remain beyond the horizon. And until more time passes, estimating the likelihood and magnitude of those benefits lies in the realm of politics, not economics.


___________________
UnauthorizedTranceAddict Youtube Channel where I post older mixes from the TA DJ Promotion Forum

My mixes:

Still up:1:2

Down:3:4:5

Old Post Oct-24-2004 20:23  United States
Click Here to See the Profile for Spacey Orange Click here to Send Spacey Orange a Private Message Add Spacey Orange to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
AnotherWay83
The B00b Maintenance Guy™



Registered: Aug 2000
Location: land of d(-_-)b

on a related note...

www.costofwar.com

Old Post Oct-24-2004 23:52 
Click Here to See the Profile for AnotherWay83 Click here to Send AnotherWay83 a Private Message Add AnotherWay83 to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
Spacey Orange
still loves trance.



Registered: Jul 2004
Location: California

quote:
Originally posted by AnotherWay83
on a related note...

www.costofwar.com


thanks and ouch!

The War in Iraq Cost the United States $141,698,576,462
The War in Iraq Cost (per Household) $2,014
The War in Iraq Cost (per Person) $503

This has to be the most expensive taxpayer subsidized campaign ploy in US history. I wonder if the kerry campaign will get matching funds.


___________________
UnauthorizedTranceAddict Youtube Channel where I post older mixes from the TA DJ Promotion Forum

My mixes:

Still up:1:2

Down:3:4:5

Old Post Oct-25-2004 00:38  United States
Click Here to See the Profile for Spacey Orange Click here to Send Spacey Orange a Private Message Add Spacey Orange to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
Dupz
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne

Now i hear that bush wants an extra $70 Billion within the next few months to bolster the war effort..

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/w...anguage=printer

That's a shitload of money

Old Post Oct-26-2004 12:24  Australia
Click Here to See the Profile for Dupz Click here to Send Dupz a Private Message Add Dupz to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
hardstyle
Technoaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: In the Qlimax
ahgaha

Ahahaha sux to be poor

Old Post Oct-27-2004 08:02  Hungary
Click Here to See the Profile for hardstyle Click here to Send hardstyle a Private Message Add hardstyle to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
hardstyle
Technoaddict



Registered: Nov 2003
Location: In the Qlimax
ok

America will run out of money soon , or they allready did????

Old Post Oct-27-2004 08:04  Hungary
Click Here to See the Profile for hardstyle Click here to Send hardstyle a Private Message Add hardstyle to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
Massive84
Old Relic



Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Sequence Realm

quote:
Originally posted by Dupz
Now i hear that bush wants an extra $70 Billion within the next few months to bolster the war effort..

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/w...anguage=printer

That's a shitload of money


huh?

the 20 billion that he got for the reconstruction of Iraq, what did he do with that? Because i saw on TV 3 days ago, that Bush only spend 1 billion so far from the 20.


___________________
quote:
Originally posted by Octanesyco
Greetings. My name is Casey. You can call me Moose.
-Moose

Old Post Oct-27-2004 10:10  Netherlands
Click Here to See the Profile for Massive84 Click here to Send Massive84 a Private Message Add Massive84 to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
Dupz
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne

quote:
Originally posted by Massive84
huh?

the 20 billion that he got for the reconstruction of Iraq, what did he do with that? Because i saw on TV 3 days ago, that Bush only spend 1 billion so far from the 20.


lol, $1billion to the reconstruction of Iraq... $19billion to Halliburton..

Old Post Oct-27-2004 11:06  Australia
Click Here to See the Profile for Dupz Click here to Send Dupz a Private Message Add Dupz to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message
josh4
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Dec 2003
Location: New York City

Meanwhile Bush and company are making milions or at least they were before it started getting really bad.

Old Post Nov-02-2004 17:23  United States
Click Here to See the Profile for josh4 Click here to Send josh4 a Private Message Add josh4 to your buddy list Report this Post Reply w/Quote Edit/Delete Message

TranceAddict Forums > Other > Political Discussion / Debate > Counting the Hidden Costs of War
Post New Thread    Post A Reply

 
Last Thread   Next Thread
Click here to listen to the sample!Pause playbackHybrid [2005] [4]

Click here to listen to the sample!Pause playbackSzeifert vs. Krash - Angels Crying [2005]

Show Printable Version | Subscribe to this Thread
Forum Jump:

All times are GMT. The time now is 05:20.

Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
[IMG] code is ON
 
Search this Thread:

 
Contact Us - return to tranceaddict

Powered by: Trance Music & vBulletin Forums
Copyright ©2000-2026, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Privacy Statement / DMCA
Support TA!