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When it comes to hooliganism, the US media really is the pot calling the kettle black. Riots at US sports events occur far more frequently than they do in the UK. And yet, in American popular culture, the "hooligan" is almost without exception portrayed as a soccer fan (and nearly always as English).

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Typical of this world-view is an article by Mickey Charles on sportsnetwork.com. He starts with an overview of US sports rowdiness: "There are riots in the streets after a championship comes to town in any sport. Looting, burning cars, terrorising women and ripping their clothes off as part of the ceremony seems to have reached obscene levels ..." But he then concludes that this is no big deal compared to the psycho-antics of those crazy Europeans. "In England ... the fans rushing on to the field don't want to embrace the players. They are carrying knotted ropes used historically for lynching, rocks, beer bottles poised to be thrown and whatever else is not nailed down. Frenzied followers of one team chase down those of the opponents, not to congratulate for a good effort, but to dismember."

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"The European hooligan thing is really overdone by the US media - it's much worse here," admits Philly sports fan Al Petrillo. "Eagles games are out of control. It's like a rite of passage, you get shit-faced drunk and out of control. The FU's start flying and then the fists start flying. There was this guy, an old guy in Redskins attire, maybe in his sixties. They roughed him up, broke his leg and sent him back to Washington."

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Whenever American football fans riot or ice hockey fans beat the hell out of one another, whenever the supporters of basketball or baseball teams go on a cop-taunting, car-torching, window-smashing victory spree, the violence is invariably treated as a local disturbance or an historical anomaly. And whenever college football fans engage in riotous behaviour that would be considered a national scandal if it happened in Britain (as they frequently do), no one seems terribly inclined to call it hooliganism.

http://sport.guardian.co.uk/america...1660848,00.html

Looks like the Americans are as bad as the European hoolies (and probably WORSE than the English!!!)

Ok so the points from this article...

1) Is this true? Anyone have any experiences?
2) If it is true, why is it being ignored and brushed under the carpet?

I really don't see it occuring that often here in the US, but when it does, it's blown out in front of the media to no end.

For example, I got my undgrad and am currently working on a graduate degree from Ohio State. We've become infamous for the rioting that took place after the Michigan game in 2004. As crazy as the OSU/Michigan rivalry is, it's pretty peaceful (for the most part). However, you get a bunch of drunk college kids rioting 12 hours after the game and people claim that it's sports related. Hell no. It's just a bunch of drunk people rioting.

I'm not saying it very well, but my point is that I believe in the US most "hooliganism" is drunk people being idiots, with sports only used as a spark to get things going (or as an excuse later on). It appears that in the UK, "hooliganism" is the mindset of using an intense sports rivalry as the sole reason for causing chaos.

In the US, a fan for team A goes and sees a match against team B. Both fans drink until they're stupid drunk and end up fighting.

In the UK, a fan for team A goes and sees a match against team B so that he can beat the hell out of the fan for team B.

I hope that made sense, and I also want to point out that is how I percieve things.

(Okay, been up since 2:00 PM yesterday, time for sleepy)

So do you think it's a problem? Does it have the potential to become worse/more organised as per Europe?

Personally I don't view it as a huge problem. I actually partook in a dc area "riot" when maryland beat duke two years ago in college basketball. Just a bunch of drunk kids blocking the streets trying to get more drunk. Riot police came out and started shooting tear gas and bean bag guns to disperse everyone. The media played it until no end making it a much bigger deal than it ever was. I've never been to a European football match so I can't really compare (my friends went to a Lazio game while we were in Europe ... they said the salute was ... interesting), but there isn't organzied racism in the US at sporting events that's for sure. I haven't seen any worse riots than what goes on in Canada when they lose the stanley cup ...

Philly is probably one of the worst cities. If there's any place like European "hooliganism" than it would be Philly. There you'll get your ass kicked if you're loud and obnoxious, and there have been a few famous incidents such as them throwing snowballs at the refs. But that's just philly ... nowhere else is as bad as there, and the incidents are infrequent at best. I don't know if there's enough in the US to make a video game about it yet.

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Last edited by occrider on Jun-27-2006 at 16:26

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Originally posted by George Smiley So do you think it's a problem? Does it have the potential to become worse/more organised as per Europe?

As of right now, no. In Europe football/soccer is the sport. Yeah, you have others, but it has pretty much unrivaled popularity. In the US you have the "big" ones, being football, basketball and baseball (hockey to a much smaller degree). You simply don't have entire towns or regions or countries that go insane about one particular sport as you do in Europe.

I was in Rome for the AS Roma/Lazio game a few years back, and it was crazy. People riding around waving flags, honking horns, screaming on the metro, days before the match. It was as if two countries were at war. Then there were the inevitable images of Italian riot police cracking people over the head with rifle butts. That same year while I was in Sicily at a regional match, a fan was killed in the riots surrounding a game.

I just don't see a sport in the US where rivalry is used as a means of justification for physical violence nearly to the degree as in Europe when it comes to football/soccer. We just like to get trashed and beat the hell out of each other, regardless of the occasion.

I guess in the end it's like the anti-video game lobby. To me it's not the video game (or the sport) that causes violence, it's people being dumb asses that causes violence.

no, cos american really aren't as passionate about anything.

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Hate how Scottish fans get lumped in with English ones on this. Celtic fans were so good in europe that they recived two fair play award (they are ment for teams!!!). Now when they come togeather with Rangers fans might be a bit different but thats more relgious than anything.

>LINK<

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Celtic fans 'Europe's best'

>LINK<

Ranagers fans got fine over there actions against villareal in spain. Celtic have always had a good name. Ranagers seem to still have that bad name when they travel abroad though.

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Originally posted by Spacey Orange no, cos american really aren't as passionate about anything.

Quite right. Also, America is a much "cleaner", more squeamish place than Europe.

Many things which are extremely common in Europe -- such as smoking, drinking, street hooliganism, and prostitution -- are very rare in the States; there is much more respect for the law and a public dislike of the so-called "vices", and people are also more impressionable and naive.

One other thing, slightly off-topic but still related, re: "passionate about anything". I see this difference most clearly in girls. European girls actually have hobbies and interests that they pursue just as enthusiastically as guys, such as music, DJs, etc. American girls for the most part only have one interest: finding Mr. Right. There are exceptions but most American girls do not have the type of interesting hobbies or passions (I'm not talking about shopping) that other girls do. I may actually create a separate topic on this.

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Originally posted by Michael19 Ranagers fans got fine over there actions against villareal in spain. Celtic have always had a good name. Ranagers seem to still have that bad name when they travel abroad though.

Singing religious songs, not attacking anyone though.

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Originally posted by HardTranceProd Quite right. Also, America is a much "cleaner", more squeamish place than Europe. Many things which are extremely common in Europe -- such as smoking, drinking, street hooliganism, and prostitution -- are very rare in the States; there is much more respect for the law and a public dislike of the so-called "vices", and people are also more impressionable and naive. One other thing, slightly off-topic but still related, re: "passionate about anything". I see this difference most clearly in girls. European girls actually have hobbies and interests that they pursue just as enthusiastically as guys, such as music, DJs, etc. American girls for the most part only have one interest: finding Mr. Right. There are exceptions but most American girls do not have the type of interesting hobbies or passions (I'm not talking about shopping) that other girls do. I may actually create a separate topic on this.

You seem to be awefully dissatisfied with American culture/life here and a little "homesick." Did you grow up/live in Europe? How long have you been in the US?

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"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller

Wanna see Hooligans?? Go to any little league baseball game. I was calling a game one time and got jumped at my car by some angry parents, then I am the one that was sued for breaking a father's nose in my self defense the league's insurance paid, but damn....