As per thread title ..

Thanx,

Crusader

Don't know exactly but I know you have to do it very quick, because everything changes very fast in goa songs. Try listening to a set by astral projection (probably the goa leaders, next to infected mushroom), they mix very fast, and might I add not very well actually.

___________________
"I hated going to weddings. All the grandmas would poke me saying "You're next". They stopped that when I started doing it to them at funerals."

quote:

Het doel van een heel deel hier is niet over muziek te praten maar door zijn deelname aan discussies een zo groot mogelijk intellect proberen aan de dag te leggen en daarmee een rare vorm van zelfbevrediging in werking stellen. 'It's a strange world'

Yea its problematic .. I guess a good guide would be to get to know the intended records for the mix very well or to even pre plan how to mix the trax together .. ?

Crusader

I spin a lot of goa/psy...It depends on the song really. I like to have my mixes around 3 minutes or so each, at least, usually. It depends on what kind of song it is too, how it's arranged, etc...this is a genre where you really need to know your tracks well.

___________________
Alcoholic Alliance
The Ecstasy (MDMA) Bible Thread 2.0

quote:

Originally posted by Masonious you win again dude - and nice move shoving the whole i figured out how to order pizza thing in my face. i tried that 4 and a half months ago and woke up with a Taiwanese transvestite but to Ygrene it's just, "anoother day in the life, noooo biggieee".

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Nuclear I spin a lot of goa/psy...It depends on the song really. I like to have my mixes around 3 minutes or so each, at least, usually. It depends on what kind of song it is too, how it's arranged, etc...this is a genre where you really need to know your tracks well.

On that note .. where do u buy psy vinyls from? Few places have a lot of good stock

Crusader

www.psyshop.com
www.chaos-unlimited.co.uk

you can find some old/out of print stuff on ebay too..

Most psy is released only on CD's nowadays, though.

___________________
Alcoholic Alliance
The Ecstasy (MDMA) Bible Thread 2.0

quote:

Originally posted by Masonious you win again dude - and nice move shoving the whole i figured out how to order pizza thing in my face. i tried that 4 and a half months ago and woke up with a Taiwanese transvestite but to Ygrene it's just, "anoother day in the life, noooo biggieee".

Last edited by Fast Turtle on Nov-09-2003 at 04:04

Psy is one of those genres that tries to break the mould with every song, which usually means that unlike normal trance, the breaks don't line up. Psy music has many 'false' breaks where for 4 beats you think "Ahh here's the break", then the producer says "HA HA fooled you!!" and starts the melody again, except that it's 4 beats later than it should be. Also, the music is only just in harmony with itself, and adding in another sample (from another song) usually sounds bad. The upshot is that if you try to mix the same way you mix normal trance (as in, over 30 seconds per mix) you will be caught out.

Mixing goa well:
http://www.psyshop.com/shop/CDs/tip/tip1cd018.html
http://www.psyshop.com/shop/CDs/tip/tip1cd027.html

Mixing goa poorly:
http://www.hoipolloi.nl/djlurk/Bang...0n%20Mashed.mp3

There are three ways to mix psy/goa:
1) Pretend it's normal trance (BAD!). Cue up the first beat on the incoming track, get the pitch right, wait for the outgoing track to have a 4 beat break, and hit play. Slowly move the crossfader across every 32 beats. Usually sounds terrible (because chances are one of the songs will have a 4 beat break, then the two songs will be out of phrase with each other. Right?)
2) Mix the non-beat portions together. I've been to lots of parties where people do this. You can know nothing about beatmatching, not change the pitch, not even know what the cue button is for (like one 'DJ' who thought he was pretty good) and still make it sound reasonably good. Almost every psy/goa track has a section of weird non-beat at the start and end of it, which is ideal for people to transition songs together with. Doing it this way sure beats the first way, when everyone KNOWS it sounds terrible.
3) The hard way: Do it properly, the way the music cries out for it to be mixed. This is tricky, and requires a lot of preparation. You need to know where the breaks occur towards the end of your tracks. The idea here is to mix in maybe 15 seconds of faint incoming track and get the two tracks to go into a 4 beat break at exactly the same time. As the two tracks break, push the crossfader across to the new track. Done properly, no-one will know that you've changed the playing track, because it will sound just like the rest of the song did -- a weird 4 beat break followed by a new beat.
I write down where the major break occurs on my CD's, and when making a mixed CD I write down everything -- cue point, where to start it on the outgoing track, where to fade across, where to fade out, whether to swap the bass, whether to cut the treble, EVERYTHING!!

Psy/goa is so much harder to mix properly than trance, and when you don't know a lot about it you'd think that the DJ has no skill whatsoever (Look, he just banged the crossfader across, he's not even trying to beatmatch!!). The fact is that 'normal' trance and psy-trance require a different approach to make it sound good. Listen to Raja Ram, you'll be amazed!

Listen, practice, listen to your practice, then listen some more

___________________
I am artificially intelligent.

Two Tips

1) Know your tracks. Know the beginning window, the ending window, the phrasing, the builds and breaks, etc. Because with some psy/goa the phasing is not created in even measures you are going to have to window mix (but not all the time, that is not DJing).

2) Get good with the EQ. You can manipulate the sound to mix the tracks more smoothly.

quote:

Originally posted by nebbian Psy is one of those genres that tries to break the mould with every song, which usually means that unlike normal trance, the breaks don't line up. Psy music has many 'false' breaks where for 4 beats you think "Ahh here's the break", then the producer says "HA HA fooled you!!" and starts the melody again, except that it's 4 beats later than it should be. Also, the music is only just in harmony with itself, and adding in another sample (from another song) usually sounds bad. The upshot is that if you try to mix the same way you mix normal trance (as in, over 30 seconds per mix) you will be caught out. Mixing goa well: http://www.psyshop.com/shop/CDs/tip/tip1cd018.html http://www.psyshop.com/shop/CDs/tip/tip1cd027.html Mixing goa poorly: http://www.hoipolloi.nl/djlurk/Bang...0n%20Mashed.mp3 There are three ways to mix psy/goa: 1) Pretend it's normal trance (BAD!). Cue up the first beat on the incoming track, get the pitch right, wait for the outgoing track to have a 4 beat break, and hit play. Slowly move the crossfader across every 32 beats. Usually sounds terrible (because chances are one of the songs will have a 4 beat break, then the two songs will be out of phrase with each other. Right?) 2) Mix the non-beat portions together. I've been to lots of parties where people do this. You can know nothing about beatmatching, not change the pitch, not even know what the cue button is for (like one 'DJ' who thought he was pretty good) and still make it sound reasonably good. Almost every psy/goa track has a section of weird non-beat at the start and end of it, which is ideal for people to transition songs together with. Doing it this way sure beats the first way, when everyone KNOWS it sounds terrible. 3) The hard way: Do it properly, the way the music cries out for it to be mixed. This is tricky, and requires a lot of preparation. You need to know where the breaks occur towards the end of your tracks. The idea here is to mix in maybe 15 seconds of faint incoming track and get the two tracks to go into a 4 beat break at exactly the same time. As the two tracks break, push the crossfader across to the new track. Done properly, no-one will know that you've changed the playing track, because it will sound just like the rest of the song did -- a weird 4 beat break followed by a new beat. I write down where the major break occurs on my CD's, and when making a mixed CD I write down everything -- cue point, where to start it on the outgoing track, where to fade across, where to fade out, whether to swap the bass, whether to cut the treble, EVERYTHING!! Psy/goa is so much harder to mix properly than trance, and when you don't know a lot about it you'd think that the DJ has no skill whatsoever (Look, he just banged the crossfader across, he's not even trying to beatmatch!!). The fact is that 'normal' trance and psy-trance require a different approach to make it sound good. Listen to Raja Ram, you'll be amazed! Listen, practice, listen to your practice, then listen some more

All of Raja's CD's are computer mixed...I've heard him live before, he was okay...A lot of psy DJ's just don't even bother to mix.

___________________
Alcoholic Alliance
The Ecstasy (MDMA) Bible Thread 2.0

quote:

Originally posted by Masonious you win again dude - and nice move shoving the whole i figured out how to order pizza thing in my face. i tried that 4 and a half months ago and woke up with a Taiwanese transvestite but to Ygrene it's just, "anoother day in the life, noooo biggieee".

If you are looking for a good psy DJ listen to Goa Gil.

quote:

All of Raja's CD's are computer mixed...

How do you know this? Have you listened to the transition between 'Maya' and 'the finger', where he misses the proper point to make the transition while trying to figure out how many beats it takes for the turntable to spin around once for the first massive beat of 'the finger', and then when the outgoing song ends he misjudges the last beat by a noticeable amount? Come on, no-one who mixes on a computer would have a double beat on another one of his transitions in Stash Bag 2? (forget which one, could be between 'sneaky sneaky' and 'eye to eye'). It sounds human mixed to me, very well mixed for sure but still realtime.

Can you tell I've listened to his mixes a lot?

Aww heck even if he did mix it on a computer it's great to listen to. The point is that it's the right way to mix goa, rather than just pretending it's normal melodic trance. They're different animals, you've got to treat them as such.

quote:

If you are looking for a good psy DJ listen to Goa Gil.

Amen

___________________
I am artificially intelligent.

Anyone else have other tips, tricks, or advice?