I'm finding this more and more these days; I always end up starting a mad rant whilst composing and end up with 5 or 6 sweet climaxes and absolutely nothing else, except maybe one or two good breakdowns.

Where is the problem you ask? It's all within the same song and sounds as if I took 10 different tracks and glued them all together.

How do some of you trance greats manage to stay on topic within a song, keeping the track within a certain sound or theme?

How do you come up with intermediary melodies that don't just sound like the 5th or 6th climax in the song?


Limiting your samples helps but that's something I'd rather not take too far.

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Best thing to do is come up with a chord progression first.. most trance uses the same progression throughout the entire song which is how it keeps 'on task'

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my problem was the same ... too many themes in one song!

But now - max 2-3 themes , 1 breakdown with climax , 1 intro and 1 outro , maybe 1 or 2 little breaks 1-4 bars max, 5-15 effect sounds, maybe 1 vocal phrase,

that's all

but it's work only with epic trance maybe progressive too.

If you like hardstyle then different story listen DJ SCOT PROJECT "FM1" song .... there 4 breaks , 5 climaxes ,30 effects, 5 themes and more


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sebra

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This is a good question. Can't wait to hear the answers. I would assume a lot of it is discipline.

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Discipline, and being able to say "no" to yourself. It's really hard abandoning a good tangent, but I usually go through 2 or 3 before I find where I want the song to go.

Just to branch off for a second...

quote:

5-15 effect sounds...

15!?!

I have trouble coming up with one or two per track!

How do you manage to come up with that many non tone based (well, kinda) sound effects that still fit within a certain category of sound? Sampling is the easiest way I've found so far, changing the speed etc, but do you guys have any techniques you like to use for generating sfx via synth? Any type of sound you like to sample?

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If I'm really honest then I use only commercial FX cd's and I have no time to generate these by myself like drums.
Dont want to use one synth and MIDI track like one effect sound. CPU!

But you can always just tweak the synth and mixdown the effect to wav and then use these bastards in your track as audio.

It depends what's important to you. Who want sound like AvB or Tiesto , who want sound original. Both wins

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sebra @ tonight will explore the virtual synths FX presents and render favourites to wav file for later use.

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If you've got so much material, then why not split it up in certain combinations and make a few remixes of the same track.

quote:

If you've got so much material, then why not split it up in certain combinations and make a few remixes of the same track.

I don't like to work like that. When I produce, I like just going with the flow from start to finish. When at all possible I do it on a day off and oftain work 8-12 hours strait. A little inspiration from the night before and I can finish in one day, minus minor adjustments. On days like that I have little problem with deviating from the beaten path. It's when I don't finish in one day that I have a problem. Changing mood etc.

I like alanzo's idea of starting with chord progrssion. That would satisfy both needs.

Thanks guys.

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When I started producing I felt that something needes to change after about 2 to 4 bars. That left me with like 3 to 4 minute trax that had at least two different themes in it.

Over time I learned how to create tension by repeating stuff a lot just to the point where it HAS to change before it becomes boring but create an effect of subtle changes thru ambient percussion and effectsounds. Now when I start off with an idea the first thing I do is create a rought arrangement that leaves no space for more than two themes an fills up about 7 to 8 minutes. This basic arrangement sure is subject to changes in the process but helps me control both time and tension in my track. I can see where to build, where to break down and where to hold.. somtimes it doesnt sound right, then I rearrange but most times this works fine for me.

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