Hagel's voice along with McCain's and some other Moderates are refreshing to hear from the other side of the aisle.

The two extremes from both sides do nothing to help our country move forward in a positive direction. We need more moderates from both sides who are willing to make compromises.

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

We don't need bitching and moaning about Iraq, we're there, power has been transferred and we're trying to help them make a go of it. Don't believe a realistic solution to turn the minds of young Arabs is by bringing them into the US in an immigration status. This would probably only serve to provide an opportunity to plant more terrorist cells in the country. Security is the prime concern in Iraq now and NATO has come on line to help by training their police and security forces. Hagel has political motives else he would suddenly start jaw jacking and criticizing the administration.

quote:

Originally posted by emander We don't need bitching and moaning about Iraq, we're there, power has been transferred and we're trying to help them make a go of it.

"Bitching and moaning" from a conservative? The majority of Americans now believe invading Iraq was a mistake - does that mean the majority is doing nothing but "bitching and moaning" too? Or perhaps they disagree with Bush's foreign policies, and it is an indication that Bush ought to change his stance for future reference? That old saying about learning from your past mistakes.....

quote:

Security is the prime concern in Iraq now and NATO has come on line to help by training their police and security forces.

Funny how Bush snubbed NATO and the UN before, only to come begging for their help later. Most people around the world see your statement in reverse - Bush has finally come in line with NATO...

quote:

Hagel has political motives else he would suddenly start jaw jacking and criticizing the administration.

Can you name me one politician that doesn't have political motives? That's a given. But his voice of moderation is in desparate need, esp. with the extreme partisanship we have observed over the last 4 years. Bush promised to be a uniter, but the exact opposite has occurred. Who is to blame? Well, who controls both House and Senate?

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

quote:

Originally posted by MisterOpus1 "Bitching and moaning" from a conservative? The majority of Americans now believe invading Iraq was a mistake - does that mean the majority is doing nothing but "bitching and moaning" too? Or perhaps they disagree with Bush's foreign policies, and it is an indication that Bush ought to change his stance for future reference? That old saying about learning from your past mistakes

this whole issue SHOULD be way beyond partisaned lines and you should know it.

quote:

Funny how Bush snubbed NATO and the UN before, only to come begging for their help later. Most people around the world see your statement in reverse - Bush has finally come in line with NATO.

WRONG! Bush took no for an answer, twice. that, you do know.

quote:

Can you name me one politician that doesn't have political motives? That's a given. But his voice of moderation is in desparate need, esp. with the extreme partisanship we have observed over the last 4 years. Bush promised to be a uniter, but the exact opposite has occurred. Who is to blame? Well, who controls both House and Senate?

the Dems have drawn the partisanship lines for four years without a strategy terrorism. as far as i'm concerned nothing the dems have said in four years have motivated anyone to unite around anything but
put the dems back in office.

quote:

Originally posted by MisterOpus1

Why do you hate America Mr. O?

Everyone knows that in order to stay safe from the A-rats we must shred the constitution and kill all towel heads.

/Cspan caller

quote:

Originally posted by DaveSZ Everyone knows that in order to stay safe from the A-rats we must shred the constitution and kill all towel heads.

thats not entirely true

quote:

Originally posted by MisterOpus1 "Bitching and moaning" from a conservative? The majority of Americans now believe invading Iraq was a mistake - does that mean the majority is doing nothing but "bitching and moaning" too? Or perhaps they disagree with Bush's foreign policies, and it is an indication that Bush ought to change his stance for future reference? That old saying about learning from your past mistakes..... Funny how Bush snubbed NATO and the UN before, only to come begging for their help later. Most people around the world see your statement in reverse - Bush has finally come in line with NATO... Can you name me one politician that doesn't have political motives? That's a given. But his voice of moderation is in desparate need, esp. with the extreme partisanship we have observed over the last 4 years. Bush promised to be a uniter, but the exact opposite has occurred. Who is to blame? Well, who controls both House and Senate?

OK, you belittled me pretty good at first glance aand I admit it. Hopefully, the majority will realize we're in the muck and backseat driving doesn't do anything for future foreign policy. Believe the administration is trying to make amends now and get the world back into it. Bush never snubbed NATO, NATO snubbed him by refusing to provide forces and they still take that stance. They only agreed to provide a cadre of trainers to help Iraqi security forces, but will not put forces in harm's way. To ensure that, they even want to train the Iraqi security force outside of Iraq; a preposterous offer. Bush has weathered the storm and we don't need Kerry or even Nader. Kerry will give a left nut to get elected just to drag us back into the Jane Fonda era of bowing to threats against our own country.

At least some people can see the forest for the trees on this. This full-page ad appeared in the USA Today this morning.

___________________
FLUSHED THE JOHNS!

quote:

Originally posted by emander Kerry will give a left nut to get elected just to drag us back into the Jane Fonda era of bowing to threats against our own country.

I wholeheartedly disagree. Everyone knows that Kerry would give his right nut to get elected. He's got to hang on to everything he can on the left side. Can you imagine if the wrong group of liberals found out that Kerry had sacrificed his left nut? It would be pure, unadulterated chaos, I tell ya.

quote:

Originally posted by imokruok At least some people can see the forest for the trees on this.

Great!

So you're all set to volunteer to serve in Fallujah?

quote:

Originally posted by Q5echo this whole issue SHOULD be way beyond partisaned lines and you should know it.

For the most part, it is beyond partisanship. Even the ardent Bush bashing Dems. want a democracy in Iraq - I mean really, what choice do we have now?

But does that mean that everyone should be in lockstep with Bush's foreign policy decisions?

Would you honestly expect Conservatives to be in lockstep with a Democratic President if the reverse situation was true? Shall I bring up a few well-known opposing Conservative quotes in opposition of Clinton's choice on Bosnia?

There's always going to be partisanship, whether it's appropriate or not. The fact that the majority of Americans now believe Iraq was a mistake, however, seems to tell me that the opposing argument by Democrats is not unfounded. Couple that with the fact that there's some descent logic involved with the Dems. counterarguments as well. For example, imagine not having al-Zarqowi around right now - it could have happened, but for some reason Bush turned down the opportunity to take him out not once, not twice, but several times:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4431601/

Does criticizing change events now? Certainly not. But if this President doesn't get his head out of the collective neo-conservative asses and realize his past mistakes, we just might be walking into another invasion situation that fatally attracts more terrorist organizations to that given region, and an ill-conceived post-war plan as well. Personally, this is my greatest fear about Bush being in the office another 4 more years.

My second fear, of course, is where the economy will go with a monumental deficit to cover and the baby boomers retiring, but I digress.

quote:

WRONG! Bush took no for an answer, twice. that, you do know.

Not to be naive, but could you clarify? From what I've gathered, we have snubbed the help from the UN and NATO until recently (I'm speaking strictly in terms of military assistance, not financial).

quote:

the Dems have drawn the partisanship lines for four years without a strategy terrorism. as far as i'm concerned nothing the dems have said in four years have motivated anyone to unite around anything but put the dems back in office.

Clarify. What has the Dems said that led you to come to your conclusion?

Their strategy involving terrorism, for the most part, is a simple one - it is a global strategy to bring down known terrorist organizations, esp. Al Qaeda. This did NOT involve attacking Iraq, because Iraq was not a direct threat to our country in the sense that Al Qaeda and organizations similar to it are. There is a bi-partisan effort to tighten our borders and strengthen Homeland security, yet it is YOUR president whom has underfunded this project.

We must also keep in mind that much of the Democratic voice is squashed in both the House and Senate as a result of Republican majority. Many of their criticisms are left unchecked or followed up on, primarily because the Republican majority in those given Congressional Committees perform their agendas and overrule any dissenters' ideas. So if you do hear a lot of criticism, but very little follow through, you can also attribute much of this to Republican majority overruling all.

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...