hmm... to start off, i think very little trance is underground any more, but aside from that, you can't hate something just because it's commercial IMO. you hate it because you think it's bad. would you hate a delicious cheeseburger just because the masses love it as well? in my opinion, commercial music, in general, doesn't necessarily have to be of less quality, rather just have a more generalized style that may appeal to more people rather than just a specialized group that have an acquired taste.

i love house music for example, and even though i'm a picky mother****** for the most part, the is a lot of commercial house i can take, and even enjoy, to make an example.

now, commercial trance could be a tricky term. generally, everything bad gets catalogged as commercial, but for the most part, commercial is synonymous to cheese. so what we in fact hate is the cheesiness, rather than its attribute of commerciality, perhaps.

my point is, i for one, hate it if it's bad. if it's commercial, and yet it's still good (which is VERY rare, but still happens from time to time) i may very well like it. of course, if you're serious about the music, it's a strange occurence to stay listening to the commercial side of things and not evolve into a specific area of that which you like.

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I don't make a big bone about these two terms (and some others like "mainstream" for that matter), but for me... I'm an odd bird. I listen to all sorts of stuff over the map. Not to mention I've seen those certain artists featured on many a MoS, or Godskitchen, or Cream, or Gatecrasher, etc. compilation. I'm not even sure I could consider a superstar like Tiesto to be underground by absolute means -- compared to Britney, maybe, but how big is she compared to Ayumi in Japan, for example? That I do not know.

Ahhhhhh so I like keeping it simple:


-"underground" for me is a transient term.

Like, "train passing by". Noteworthy artists were at one time, ALL underground. (And yes, several years ago, no one heard of Avril Lavigne either.) Just like how we were all babies. No one escapes that, although some people like to perpetually be "young at heart", some DJs just don't like having too big a profile. That's their choice. I respect that. But I don't respect it when some "underground" person trashes the popular echelon all flamey. I'm like "Shhh buddy, you choose what works for you, PvD will do what's right for him!"


-"commercial" is often linked to "popularity" but I see it as music that is made solely or primarily for $$$ gain with little or no attention paid to the rich culture surrounding EDM.

I can't judge other people's hearts but there is greed out there hoppin' bandwagons or slagging off stuff *unless* it gets profitable, and a lot of knockoffs like Kate Spade bags. This doesn't only extend to the outer limits of trance music, by the way. Of supersaws and stutter-glitches, even IDM/Braindance have people who are so interested in remaining "underground" that they deliberately sort of generate this inverse sine wave of their reverse psychology beaming back at the spotlight like a mirror, and having it all reflect back in . . . showing that types of electronic music, and general music for that matter, ain't that different after all.


You think a dog or a cat could tell the difference?

Cheers.

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None of the music you listed is underground.

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actually it's cheese vs trance.

(for example) suburban train is commercial and i loved it and many other also.

but it just so happend to be 90% of the commercial dance tunes are cheese, lasgo, sammy etc.

So you mite wanne ask, why call cheese trance then?\

My answer would be, it is not my fault that these tunes end up in the: "Traaaaaance the ultimate collection" CDs

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quote:

Originally posted by Octanesyco Greetings. My name is Casey. You can call me Moose. -Moose

why don't you just listen to good music instead?

quote:

Originally posted by Radagast None of the music you listed is underground.

Seconded, Ministry of Sound underground? Hahah

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i like it like i like too much sugar.

it depends how you look at it..in the bi picture, trance is basicly all underground, its not very big in the world (other than some of Europe).
i would say underground would be mainly your local djs? small djs and producers, premoters etc. the people who are lowest on the dj charts, but not specificly the worst, here in vancouver there is lots of amazing talent, but there are not known. so i guess underground is how you view the scene, and how you relate to it.

just my $0.02

If the music is being sold, it's commercial.

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This is turning out to be a very educational thread...

DOes anyone else find that the people who often listen to stuff like MOS, Gatecrasher etc. Usually aren't into trance as such as thier favourite music?

Also.. does anyone esle find that in some of such labels (though some of the music is refreshingly good), a lot of music is just cheap remixes of pop songs... Vocals trying to sound cool, and tough, in getting the party started... Does anyone else find that a lot of the music is very.... flat.... IT doesn't seem to have uplift, progression, climax or anything... it's just high energy party music...

quote:

Originally posted by Abhay Also.. does anyone esle find that in some of such labels (though some of the music is refreshingly good), a lot of music is just cheap remixes of pop songs... Vocals trying to sound cool, and tough, in getting the party started... Does anyone else find that a lot of the music is very.... flat.... IT doesn't seem to have uplift, progression, climax or anything... it's just high energy party music...

Yes, you just described a cheese track

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quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery If the music is being sold, it's commercial.

thats technicaly true, but im sure you also know thats not the point of this discussion, but promo cds from local djs and unknown producers, those can be sold and perchased, without it being commercially known..with your statment up above..according to that, this thread is really meaningless then