Do you think it's important to understand the structure of Trance music or House music and knowing like when certain parts of a song are supposed to take place? Like I hear you all talking about counts and bars and the last bass part of this song and I just dont understand.

its very important to understand the structure of a song you play...

I really can't explain all very well so i guess this post will be more of a bump than anything else. what you are talking about is tied into phrase matching.

a good way of understanding phrases is to hear for a crash or a break down in a song...thats usually when a new phrase starts. most trance songs very in how many beats are between each phase however its almost always a multiple of 32. in any event it is recommended to start your next track right when the phrase just begins in the track that you are playing that way you can prevent vocals from clashing or worse yet the introducing song hitting its breakdown before the outgoing tracks phrase ends...

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Why would it be bad for one of the songs to begin its breakdown before the other song is out?

well thats for you to work out. If it sounds bad, yes it is a bad thing. You don't have to wait for tracks to play out, generally that doesn't sound too good. You should be mixing out of tracks before they play out. Learn phrase matching, keep practising mixing skills (just by experimentation is the best) and sit and have a think about what you are or aren't doing.



And learning the structure of your tracks is absolutely vital. Keep listening and practising and you'll learn them.

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quote:

Originally posted by Trance Nutter You should be mixing out of tracks before they play out. Learn phrase matching, keep practising mixing skills.

So I shouldn't wait for the very last 30 seconds of a song to mix out? Woopsie! It's easier when its just kicks. Phrase matching is just cueing in the song as the first beat of the 'phrase' kicks in with the first beat of the other song, right?

Start counting from a track's first beat...you'll see either every 16 ,32, 64...etc beats the sound or beats will change (usually) or a new effect or synth will be added. As a dj, you want to have your cued record on the first beat ready to synch with the first beat on the playing record after 16, 32, 64, etc. so the tracks are phrased together. If you loose count of beats, start your count after a new sound element is added (on a lot of older trance tracks, a clash of cymbals usually starts a new phrase.) If you just beatmatch a new track in at a random time, you're gonna hear the problem, that is, the breakdowns and changing elements I mentioned earlier will be out of synch. If you're mixing vocals tracks, you could really get into trouble bc two vocals could overlap which is a big no no.

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I replied to your other question too. I'm no expert but...it makes me feel I'm getting somewhere when I can answer others.
You need to learn about phrases mate. I could give you a short answer here but instead I suggest you get over to DJ Recession's site and read read read it three times. Particulary basic and advanced mixing techniques. There you'll learn about bars, phrases, breakdowns and more.
Sorry to say it but if you still don't get it after that...sell your decks.

Cool it's late so I'm goin to bed but I'll read the website!

take a listen to unmixed favourite song you have

now actually count the beats in a 1,2,3,4 ; 2,2,3,4, ; 3,2,3,4 ; 4,2,3,4 type sequence

you'll notice changes in the music happen at 8 beat intervals, 16, 32 and 64 most common

you want to release your incoming track so both are on a "1" count, called phrase matching

this is so you can mix both tracks and have the elements of each compliment each other as well as drop out of the mix and into the mix near seamlessly

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Also a good hint: In most of the tunes, after about 55 seconds, the song gets a boost or a quick break down. Check it out if you don't believe me.

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quote:

Originally posted by IgnazZio Also a good hint: In most of the tunes, after about 55 seconds, the song gets a boost or a quick break down. Check it out if you don't believe me.

Yeah, this is usually true with trance-esque genres, good tip. The track will generally either "step up a notch" and get a bit more driving or it will go into a breakdown for maybe 16-32 beats (sometimes longer) before kicking in again.

If you time it well, you can drop your incoming track in so the outgoing track ends when this happens, resulting in a nice sounding mix most of the time.

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"If you put a cat infront of a speaker pumping this track out, it would die for sure."

a friend is writing on all his vinyl the sequence : 2 + 2 + 4 + ...
so when he mix he knows the perfect time to launch second vinyl.

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