Getting a loud, punchy kick comes from choosing the right kick sample and setting appropriate levels for all the instruments in the mix.

Mastering should only be used to fix mixing issues as a last resort.

quote:

Originally posted by derail Getting a loud, punchy kick comes from choosing the right kick sample and setting appropriate levels for all the instruments in the mix. Mastering should only be used to fix mixing issues as a last resort.

If "picking the right levels" is the problem, then "picking the right levels" is nothing like I think it is, because I know already.

I understand how one sound can suffocate another, and I understand phasing/inteference/compression and all the crap that needs to get right at the end, but I don't understand why it still doesn't do a lot.

Throw Izotope over the "right levels" (in your next mix) then try telling me afterwards that was the real problem. Important? Yes, extremely, still limited compared to what Izotope does? Yes, extremely.

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I use Izotope, it's good. Although I scarcely use it because I feel like it stunts my growth as a producer. It may make things sound great but it also keeps you from figuring out what you're doing wrong. Which means you're not improving.

quote:

Originally posted by mfitterer1 I use Izotope, it's good. Although I scarcely use it because I feel like it stunts my growth as a producer. It may make things sound great but it also keeps you from figuring out what you're doing wrong. Which means you're not improving.

Yeh but do it right, then put Izo over it and you will still realize you did it "wrong".

Thats because in music theres always room for improvement.

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If you just picked the CD mastering preset then it's sticking on an exciter, multiband compressor, leveler, and maybe even stereo imaging depend on which CD master preset you used.

In all likelihood your track is getting squashed and most of what you think you're hearing is just loudness and a little distortion from the exciter. If you're sure that it's what you want, wonderful, but I've been a long-time Ozone user and would never even think about just slapping on a preset.

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+1 with what diginut said above.

I would never use a preset to master a song. Every song will require a completely different treatment depending on what you want to achieve, the style of track, tempo, freq content etc etc etc.

If you are having problems with your bass drum fix this in the mixdown, not mastering. Getting a kick to work is all about getting the source right to begin with and tuning it to fit the track.

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut If you just picked the CD mastering preset then it's sticking on an exciter, multiband compressor, leveler, and maybe even stereo imaging depend on which CD master preset you used. In all likelihood your track is getting squashed and most of what you think you're hearing is just loudness and a little distortion from the exciter. If you're sure that it's what you want, wonderful, but I've been a long-time Ozone user and would never even think about just slapping on a preset.

+1 I have the educational version (I'm sure it is the same thing) and i have to say the presets are the worst thing i've ever heard in terms of what people call "mastering". If you use each piece from scratch you get a unique result that i always find to sound really warm (for lack of a better word).

Then again you shouldnt even need to use each part of ozone if your track is mixed well from the start.

I downloaded the demo version yesterday and tried it on one of my latest songs. Some of the presets do instantly hype up the sound with exciters, EQ, limiting and widening of the stereo image, and the initial impression is "ooh, thick, creamy, lush, bassy, more stereo-y". But then you listen some more and notice everything that has been taken away/ obscured.

It did alert me to some creative options - I went back to the original version of the song, toned down some high end and widened the stereo image a bit on some lead instruments. The overall result was much better than using an Ozone preset.

It seems like a very useful set of mastering tools, if you determine what the mix needs in terms of overall treatment, then set each processor individually. As other people have noted, every mix will require a different treatment.

If your song sounds better using an Ozone preset, then I contend that you still have issues in terms of choosing sounds that work well together and setting appropriate levels, even though you say you understand these things.

Years ago my stuff sounded way better going through a mastering chain cranked to the max, in the meantime my mixing technique has improved a lot. I still have a long way to go - not that I'll ever reach the "perfect" mix, because there is no such thing.

I haven't used Ozone itself, but I have Sound Forge 9, which includes the "Izotope-powered" plugins. These are essentially 4 of the most essential modules from Ozone - limiter, multi-band compressor, linear EQ, and mastering reverb. I have some standard effects chains in SF9 that I start most of my finalizing with and all of them use the Izotope EQ, MB comp, and limiter (I'm not crazy about mastering reverbs). I start with default settings for each plug that I created myself and dial them in for each song.

http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/soundforge/izotope

Any time people ask about Ozone, I usually try to steer them toward SF9 instead because it's a full-fledged .wav editor and comes with the Izotope plugs, all for only $30 more (Amazon.com price) than Ozone.

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Yeh see the problem with this thread is just details I dont have to time/patience to mention, so Ill try just this once.

Why Ozone is useful for me:

When you throw the cd master on you can quickly figure out some things. If you slowly drop the kick level there is a very quick in/out change where the kick literally will drop out of the mix completely. Right above that point is where I put my kick and it sounds great even if izotope is muted.

You can use different presets for different channels, not just a "master", throw a preset over JUST your kick and bass then tweak some levels and its so much easier to hit that sweet spot.

You can take individual sounds and beef them up seperately if you need. I know what people are saying about the "perfect mix" notion. If a mix is perfect you shouldnt need ozone. But just compared to other things Ive used before, Izotope makes a significant noticeable difference in the way Im learning to use my native mastering plugins, and Ive tried using a lot of shit.

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Sequencers: FL Studio 9XXL & Reason 3.
Main Synth Bass GTs - Pro-53, V-Station, Sytrus, Subtractor, Trilian, Blue, Sylenth & Z3ta.
Main Synth Lead/Pad GTs - Z3ta, Sytrus, Sylenth, Vangard, Albino & Nexus.
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Hardware - Truths, Echo Audiofire, Virus Snow, & Novation Xio Midi-Synth.

Last edited by DJ Robby Rox on May-11-2009 at 05:26