not that the guy you were talking to was messed, but i doubt a 120mm flipped his Abrams... lol

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Originally posted by ******** If it took enough of the ground underneath out it could..

It wouldnt do that either, unless it was rolling on an embankment and even then an abrams is hardly top heavy enough to roll over.

See edited.

Most modern MBT have 120mm cannon, so most MBT are also designed to withstand 120mm shells, especially HE shells which is what you would assume to be used here. SABOT would not deliver enough force to do that (nor would it even work right being used as an IED).

Also, unless it really did flip the Abrams I doubt a tank sliding off an embankment would cause death to the crew inside.

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Originally posted by ******** you can believe that but it ain't, unless it has rocket thrusters underneath.. pit traps are deadly to tanks. - they need to be big enough though.. really bad at high speeds.

None of that mentioned, and I seriously doubt the insurgent groups have enough time to set those up with out being noticed.

Those are more defensive measures that an adversary would take, not ones that an offensive insurgent group would use.

Abrams are very strong tanks, they have taken numerous RPG rounds on all parts of their armor under combat conditions and barely received a scratch.

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Originally posted by ******** He said it was modified as an IED not fired.

Which would mean its even less likely to do anything as you would take away the kinetic energy of its forward momentum.

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Originally posted by ******** I've researched Abrams before and their armour and its succeptabilities. None the less who knows.. unless they have seismic scanning being done - which they could it is very pissible depending on the locale. This is not to say sink holes can't form on their own be known and used for impact.

But none of this would flip an abrams, and if it did not in away to cause fatal injuries to the crew.

If anything Krypt got the vehicle wrong, maybe it was a Stryker or other IAV/IFV, but even then I doubt a 120mm would do that.

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Originally posted by Joss Weatherby But none of this would flip an abrams, and if it did not in away to cause fatal injuries to the crew. If anything Krypt got the vehicle wrong, maybe it was a Stryker or other IAV/IFV, but even then I doubt a 120mm would do that.

Sorry mate, it was an artillery shell converted into an improvised explosive device, which is very capable of knocking out even the strongest tank. And if you think the insurgents wouldn't have time to set one up, you'd be wrong many times over...

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Originally posted by Krypton Sorry mate, it was an artillery shell converted into an improvised explosive device, which is very capable of knocking out even the strongest tank. And if you think the insurgents wouldn't have time to set one up, you'd be wrong many times over...

Yea, but it wouldnt have been a 120mm, maybe a 155 or some of the larger varieties (Iraq had a formidable artillery force).

And what I was saying about time is that the wouldnt have time, at least not in most areas to dig out a tank trap and then build cover over it.

Besides most forces in Iraq don't roll around in MBTs unless they have a specific engagement where they know heavy armor is going to be needed. A cell phone + 155mm or 200mm HE round is more than enough to disable and force the abandonment of a Bradly or Stryker.

Thats what their goal is, force a disable of a patrol vehicle and draw troops out of the other vehicles where they can then engage them with small arms fire. Usually they get suppressed pretty quickly, but it causes confusion and a draw of forces to protect and pull out the attacked convoy.

What ******** is describing is the sort of shit you see in nK and other heavily fortified and un-attacked positions. That is tank traps (ditches with iron bars that make it hard for the tank to get traction), impediments (giant concrete blocks that can be toppled over roads), minefields (hand laid in most of these cases, most countries do not have airborne mine laying weaponry), and true AT emplacements (fixed ATGM launchers).