you could use the H4 with a mic and record the noise seperate from the music. Then you can overlay them somehow so that they become one track.

I think you'll need a recorder that can handle 3 tracks at once (2 for stereo and 1 for the crowd) if you want to be able to do it in one unit.

For my new years gig, I did a six microphone set up. I had a AKG 451 on each side of the stage mounted on the lighting truss. Both mic's pointing directly at the crowd. At the front of house mix position there were two more 451's pointing at the stage and the other two were in the corners. Each input ran direct to Pro Tools, plus the left and right feed from the DJ mixer. With this technique I was able to pick and choose during the mixdown. Of course this is an expensive way of doing it.

I recently recorded another show of mine using an old school Akai DR-4 four channel recorder. I ran all the inputs through a Mackie mixer then to the DR-4. I did the two mic thing both mic's onstage pointing at the crowd and the direct feed from the DJ mixer. It worked out really well and it saved me from bringing out the Pro Tools rack.

Sorry for the ramble. Best thing to do is find a multitrack device which could record in the fashion you want it to. Or if you have some type of software like Logic on your computer, that would be another way to it.

There's a lot of multitrack recorders like the Akai on eBay right now. Pretty cheap too. It's an older technology but will get the job done.

Last edited by Brandt Slater on Apr-06-2010 at 04:41

i've used two ways of doing this before...

one was: route the record out of the main mixer into another mixer, and adding some microphone feeds in there. you can route this back into traktor through an unused input on your soundcard, or you can use any other recording software.

the second one was: two microphone pre-amps built into the 5 1/4" bay of a computer system, routing their outputs as left and right directly into the cd-audio input of the soundcard (can't remember the make any more, sorry...). the signal of the main mixer goes into the line in of the same card. you can then mix the two sources with the soundcard's internal mixer and record that.

the latter solution was built as a "portable" solution... lol.

both solutions have one big disadvantage: you have to select your mixer levels before or during recording. there's no way of changing what was recorded afterwards.

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Thanks for the replies lads.

Seems it's a little more complicated than i thought it might be.

I'm not really keen on bringing another large piece of kit (like a mixer) so think that method is out the window. Mulitple mics etc are also out as to be honest it's not THAT important but I am aware that this method would give the best results (especially in a larger venue i assume).

The multitrack recorder does mean i'd have to bring another (pretty large) piece of kit to my gig which again is something i'm trying to avoid.

The reason i was initially look at the Samson Zoom H4, was the fact that it does have 4 separate channels. It's compact and from what i've read the mics on it are pretty good (condensers). Just wasn't sure if it would work for what i was looking to apply it to. And i'm not that keen on spending the money to find out it isn't.

Here's a link with some info on it.

CLICK ME

I'm liking Katmaus' idea of layering over the crowd sounds during the mix down and picking and choosing when i want to introduce the crowd's reactions.. Just need to know if there's a nice portable way of doing that. (recording not the mixing down of course)

Thanks again for the input so far lads.

Grab a fistful of pills and an old rca tape recorder and record some kids giving each other blow ups. Then splice that shit in.

Instacash.

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Promo Grab a fistful of pills and an old rca tape recorder and record some kids giving each other blow ups. Then splice that shit in. Instacash.

I smell sample possibilities for the new ep.

We'll turn their moans and squelches into the most brooding bassline the tards have ever e'd.

Which at that point it won't even be a bassline. It'll be a broodline. A brutal broodline.

I'll get my coat.

I'll be impressed if you can get good results from a single mic. Of course it's entirely possible if it's in the right place and you spend long enough post-processing.

The BBC have entire outside broadcast kits they deploy for recording live gigs with highly trained engineers (and occasionally some not so highly trained...!) Of course that's to try and get it right first time so they don't have to spend days in the studio tidying it up later, so theoretically someone with a bit of common sense but less experience, a few mics and long enough playing about afterwards should be able to get some pretty good results.

It's not going to hurt to try it with one mic, so I say go for it and see what you can come up with. Judging the levels so that the music from the front of house rig doesn't distort the whole spectrum could be one of the biggest challenges... would be nice to spend some time during the day having a play about if you've got that luxury!

Also might be worth bearing in mind that your mics need to be far enough away from the crowd that one person standing near your mic talking loudly isn't the only thing you pick up. This could be very hard to achieve in a small club and the last thing you want is your live demo to end up with some twat moaning about the music or how tired he is. That's another advocate for a multi-mic approach I guess.

Would be very interested to hear how you get on, good luck.

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Last edited by Stu Cox on Apr-06-2010 at 19:20

On my New Years gig, the best recorded crowd noise came from the mic's that were mounted on the lighting truss onstage. The two which were at the front of house mix did ok but picked a lot of the pa. Plus someone forgot to tell us that a bar was getting set up in front of the mix. So during mixdown, you heard bottles breaking, ice getting chopped up, and so on. The other two mics did ok as well. Since these two were away from the dancefloor, I was able to capture more ambient crowd noise.

At first i wasn't sure what the Samson H4 was, until I saw the picture. It's simply called the Zoom H4 in the states so that's what threw me off. I bought one for my girlfriend for her to use on auditions. Works great. If I'm not mistaken, I believe the H4 comes with software which can be used for editing the material the H4 recorded. Actually any software will work with H4.

Multiple micing is the best I think. It's a technique I've used for years mixing live sound. The stage seems to be the best place for the mics. On occasion I will also add mics in the crowd but hang them in a down position off of the lighting truss or something like that.

Hmmm...

Maybe i should get two mics, 2 long XLR's plug them into the Xone 92's mic channels and every now and again turn the mics on to record any reactions that might occur throughout the set and later on post process them. Or just plug em straight into something like the Zoom H4 and us that device to record rather than routing it through the mixer (which obviously if Traktor is recording it) i wouldn't be able to edit each separate channel independently.

I'm not quite sure what direction i'll go in. Might get the Zoom H2 as i'm not sure i need 4 tracks..

I'm still a bit confused. If i decide to go for anything i'll let you know.

Cheers for the heads up and advice though. As always it's appreciated.