Short summary:
In 2007, 12-15 people were killed in Iraq by a couple of American Apache helicopters, including two reporters from Reuters. The military has always claimed that everything went as it should and that those who were killed opened fire on the helicopters..
Reuters asked for an investigation and asked to obtain footage from the helicopter, which is mandated under the Freedom of Information Act, but was ignored by the military.
Now WikiLeaks obtained the video, probably from a military officer with a bad taste in his mouth, and it shows around. ten men who peacefully are walking around on a street, two of them with cameras over their shoulders which the helicopter pilots see as AK rifles.
The helicopters firstly butchered these people who never at any time behaved threateningly. Then a black van with 4-5 people and 2 small children arrived, trying to rescue the wounded and dead from the spot, then the helicopters again open fire on the unarmed people and against the car with the two children.
The whole time the helicopter pilots and gunners are laughing and congratulating each other for the killings.
Not much to debate, I just think we have a duty to let us be informed about these things, especially when we ourselves participate in the war.
One can simply not afford to behave like that when you are the aggressor in a war where we are supposed to help these people. And even worse is when the military refuses to admit mistakes and illegally detain, the incriminating footage.
Last edited by Znack on Jan-03-2011 at 07:21
Jan-03-2011 07:16
Moongoose
Supreme tranceaddict
Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Celje, Slovenia
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Jan-03-2011 07:22
Joss Weatherby
Banned
Registered: May 2008
Location: The Pacific Northwest, of course
They were just doing their jobs. There wasn't any sort of personal malice against the people that were mistook for insurgents.
Its also a war zone and there had been a fire fight in the area not much earlier.
It sucks, but maybe people shouldn't take their kids out into the streets like that when its not safe. Reporters know what they are getting into too. Press should be protected in war, but sometimes mistakes happen and that is part of the job.
Jan-03-2011 07:30
Lira
Ancient BassAddict
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: Brasilia, Brazil
Re: American mass murder in Iraq
Nou... the more hawkish you sound, the more puzzled I get. Why have you never joined the military?
quote:
Originally posted by Znack
I am not sure if this has been posted.
It has.
Pro Tip: Whenever you see something polemic and old, you can be almost certain it's already been debated in these quarters.
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Jan-03-2011 07:33
Spam
OMG Hai2U!
Registered: Dec 2004
Location: Mississauga, Ontario
Old news, still don't care.
Happy I'm not living there though.
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Water, Fire, Earth, Wind, Heart???
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Bullshit.
Those forces combine to create a soaking, boiling mudstorm on Valentine's Day.
Jan-03-2011 08:01
Joss Weatherby
Banned
Registered: May 2008
Location: The Pacific Northwest, of course
Re: Re: American mass murder in Iraq
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
Nou... the more hawkish you sound, the more puzzled I get. Why have you never joined the military?
It has.
Pro Tip: Whenever you see something polemic and old, you can be almost certain it's already been debated in these quarters.
I'm not being hawkish, I am being realistic.
These people were mistaken for insurgents in a neighborhood that recently had been the site of a firefight (like in that same day). They had gear that looked like through the sights on the Apache to be weapons (RPG) and they engaged them. Insurgents will often try to collect their wounded in vehicles, so they also engaged the vehicle that showed up. There are plenty and plenty and plenty of Apache gun-cam videos on Youtube that could have been the exact same situation.
Its only people tossing a bitch fit about it when its published in such a context to make this sound like some one off occurrence. Shit like this has been happening in Afghanistan and Iraq for almost 10 years. People are mistakenly killed, the friendly forces there try their hardest to make sure that doesn't happen, but sometimes it does. So I am just a bit peeved when groups randomly focus on one event for whatever reason (in this case because it was "covered up") and don't give a fuck about the hundreds of other incidents like this. They just look for the opportunity to make the biggest bang for their buck in advancing their agenda.
And people fall for it.
Jan-03-2011 08:04
we_R_DNA
Thermionic Trance Mission
Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Right, Here
Jan-03-2011 08:04
we_R_DNA
Thermionic Trance Mission
Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Right, Here
Jan-03-2011 08:04
Sushipunk
Flickering, I roam
Registered: Sep 2006
Location: Chateau Verdafloor
Yay! we_R_DNA is here to impart some wisdom to us all, through poetry, and poorly constructed prose!
Or Youtube videos.
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Jan-03-2011 08:15
Moongoose
Supreme tranceaddict
Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Celje, Slovenia
Re: Re: Re: American mass murder in Iraq
quote:
Originally posted by Joss Weatherby
Its only people tossing a bitch fit about it when its published in such a context to make this sound like some one off occurrence. Shit like this has been happening in Afghanistan and Iraq for almost 10 years. People are mistakenly killed, the friendly forces there try their hardest to make sure that doesn't happen, but sometimes it does. So I am just a bit peeved when groups randomly focus on one event for whatever reason (in this case because it was "covered up") and don't give a fuck about the hundreds of other incidents like this. They just look for the opportunity to make the biggest bang for their buck in advancing their agenda.
And people fall for it.
The simple fact that it was covered up is what makes it a big deal. That its been going on for 0 years makes it a huge deal. That there were over 100k civilian casualties there makes it a big fucking huge deal.
Also, when they are eagerly begging for the permission to shoot and giggle like schoolgirls when they get it...thats not trying their hardest to make sure stuff like this doesnt happen.
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Jan-03-2011 08:24
Meat187
Diese scheiß Katze
Registered: Dec 2007
Location: The Night's Plutonian Shore
So wait, this war thing is actually not that great and even kills people? Gee, who would have thought?
