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trancaholic
Danish Prophet of Doom
Registered: Oct 2000
Location: Aalborg
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| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
Newtonian physics: it's laws govern the heavens and the celestial bodies movement within them. Safe to say that those same laws apply on the surface of those same celestial bodies.
Given that, one could assume that the origins of life have given away to billions of years of biological development (notice I didn't say the E word) on the, say, statistically sound number of 100 of those planets that are just far enough away from their star to support such development. The dominant species, using the same Newtonian physics, would undoubtedly stumble across electricty. Leading to communication. Then radio waves. Then microwaves. VLF, EHF so on and so on.
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Man, you are applying induction as there was no tomorrow.
1. Newtonian laws govern nothing - they are bad names for a bunch of equations whose predictions happen to be good approximations to what we observe. At least for what we observe on the kg scale and moving sufficiently slow.
2. Even if we (through observation) has determined that the Newtonian world model is a very good approximation for the movements of planets around the sun, then we have no reason to assume that this model is a fine approximation for the areas around other stars.
3. If there were other civilizations in space you are assuming that their history would naturally follow that of ours. That's generalizing from one example.
I'm not saying that we can hope for any better guesses than that of all parts of the universe behaving similarly, but we shouldn't draw ontological conclusions from such reasoning IMO.
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
Either we are the first one to accomplish this given or devolopment and the rest of the universe is playing catch up.
Or there have been civilizations come and gone and their high freq echoes have diminished.
Or we're bringing up the rear in development in a cosmic way and every one else is using a much highly advanced form of comms bypassing the exitement of electrons altogether.
No clue. |
Or maybe the other civilizations are following totally different paths than that of ours. Say, communicating by varying magnetic fields around them. Or applying principles unknown to us for moving objects through time and space. Just because we have not found any radiowaves, the existence of civilizations out there is not an impossibility.
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 Apr-02-2004 08:23 
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Q5echo
asymetrical scepticism
Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Dallas
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Point taken. Maybe I should have been more specific in the opening, more like, Einsteinian physics govern the movements of celestial bodies in the heavens. (that has yet to be disproved) I am still convinced though, that even an approximation of Newtonian physics would exist on an earth-like planet elsewhere in this galaxy giving way for the evolution of a similar species of dominant life form like us here on earth. No doubt different, but still governed and questioned by that lifeform (I sound like Mr. Spock). It would seem natural that, through development of questioning their physics, they would eventually come across the exitement of electrons. A GENERALIZATION? Yes, but one that is proven by the only history we know. Ours. And we know that it takes baby steps to go from observing gravity (Newton) to exploiting the atom (Einstein) to communicating with gravity waves (whoever). Within that timeframe, experiments with electrons and transmission is essential. If your looking for advanced civilizations in the cosmos, I think that the evidence of their evolution in their science should leave that distinct footprint.
I'm not totaly convinced there is other life out ther either. Thats a long limb to stand on. In fact, my first post was purposefully written to question that fact.
goin to bed now.
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Apr-02-2004 09:41 
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i'm rather sure that there is life in the universe, not as advanced as us though, or as trancaholic said, they may be very different from us, perhps they have no need whatsoever to explore things etc...
