.1

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about the same as technics tt's. they have the same length slider. the display may only show 0.1 increments but movement of the slider without a change on the disply will affect the pitch.

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the pitch slider is longer on the pioneer than a technics and the slider is so loose and sensitive that when you move it you can't get much more accurate than .1 sometimes you may be able to get it in between a percent change so itll go back and forth between 5.7 and 5.8 but essentially its .1. Personally i don't think mixing on the pioneer is pleasurable it's more of a chore.


Btw supposedly the pioneer 100s is supposed to be one of the faster front loading cd players is that true?

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Originally posted by richg101 about the same as technics tt's. they have the same length slider. the display may only show 0.1 increments but movement of the slider without a change on the disply will affect the pitch.

It actually will only change the pitch in 0.1% increments, it's simply down to the number of sensors in the pitch control, it being digital. You'll always find with CD decks, and as I think we proved with the Numark TTX1 in another thread, if there's a digital display then 99% of the time the accuracy the display shows is the accuracy to which you're able to change the pitch.

If nothing else, because it's a lot easier to program the thing to show the exact pitch change it's applying (even if it requires adding another digit to the display) than make the pitch slider itself more accurate, so it would be stupid for them to do the more expensive of the two and not the less expensive one, without making a marketing point about how accurate the pitch is.

The spec chart here: http://www.pioneer.co.uk/uk/product...onomy_id=44-106 confirms that it has 0.1% "Tempo Control Steps", as they call it.


And it does load pretty quickly, yes

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Stu Cox |

Last edited by Stu Cox on Sep-26-2005 at 00:36

As much as I love my 100s, I'd say you're better off with a 200 if you can push the extra cash - pitch control is just as accurate as a cdj1000 with the same pitch ranges (apart from +/-100%), it's got loops, fx etc... about the only thing it lacks is vinyl mode. I think the jog wheel is probably better built too so should last longer.

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Stu Cox |

i still think its takes forever to load though...hence why i like vinyl

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Originally posted by spdandpwr i still think its takes forever to load though...hence why i like vinyl

Of course yeah, vinyl is a lot quicker... and with vinyl if you need to get it cued up quicker then you can, it's just down to how quickly you can move your hands instead of how quickly the technology works!

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Stu Cox |

quote:

Originally posted by spdandpwr the pitch slider is longer on the pioneer than a technics and the slider is so loose and sensitive that when you move it you can't get much more accurate than .1 sometimes you may be able to get it in between a percent change so itll go back and forth between 5.7 and 5.8 but essentially its .1. Personally i don't think mixing on the pioneer is pleasurable it's more of a chore. Btw supposedly the pioneer 100s is supposed to be one of the faster front loading cd players is that true?

i thought both sliders are 100mm? there's no way the slider on the 100 is more than that of a tech..


it seems like the inclusion of a display automatically makes people question increments of the slider. if i set my vestax pdx-d3 mk 2(from back in the days before plastic vestax...) to +/-3% and move the slider then i can move it more than 3 mm before the display changes by .1%. but the platter speed is definately affected even if the display doesnt change. these are digital decks...

a movement of the slider on the 100's will change a voltage supplied to the motor/laser control. and surely this is pretty much infinate? wouldnt it be more complex to have the control setup so it notches the pitch by .1 every time?

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quote:

Originally posted by richg101 i thought both sliders are 100mm? there's no way the slider on the 100 is more than that of a tech.. it seems like the inclusion of a display automatically makes people question increments of the slider. if i set my vestax pdx-d3 mk 2(from back in the days before plastic vestax...) to +/-3% and move the slider then i can move it more than 3 mm before the display changes by .1%. but the platter speed is definately affected even if the display doesnt change. these are digital decks... a movement of the slider on the 100's will change a voltage supplied to the motor/laser control. and surely this is pretty much infinate? wouldnt it be more complex to have the control setup so it notches the pitch by .1 every time?

No, because it's digital they have to digitally process the data on the CD to make it speed up, so they need to know how much to make it speed up... again as it's digital the pitch shift value will be a binary number, so the accuracy will depend on how accurately they convert the value being read by the pitch control from an analogue signal to a digital signal if it is just a variable resistor although I very much doubt this is the case, I think it is effectively just a big row of switches (possibly optical, I'm not sure) so it's down to the number of switches in the length of the slider as they'll determine the accuracy.

Remember CDs don't read like vinyl, if you speed up or slow down the rotation of the CD it doesn't make playback speed up or slow down because it always reads the same number of bits per second, which obviously helps with skip protection and means that you won't get fluctuations in pitch with a dodgy CD player.

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Stu Cox |

Yep that's correct. A number of people say that an analog TT such as as Tech 1200 has "infinite" pitch increments, since the pitch slider is an analog potentiometer connected to a motor. While this is partially true, it doesn't necessarily mean that a 1200 is more accurate than a CD deck, since you have to deal with the analog aspects of vinyl (wow and flutter).

I find I can keep a mix much tighter with my CDJ-1000's than with my Technics. The Technics require riding the pitch, whereas I can keep the CDJ-1000's locked for a good long time.

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Originally posted by Stu Cox No, because it's digital they have to digitally process the data on the CD to make it speed up, so they need to know how much to make it speed up... again as it's digital the pitch shift value will be a binary number, so the accuracy will depend on how accurately they convert the value being read by the pitch control from an analogue signal to a digital signal if it is just a variable resistor although I very much doubt this is the case, I think it is effectively just a big row of switches (possibly optical, I'm not sure) so it's down to the number of switches in the length of the slider as they'll determine the accuracy. Remember CDs don't read like vinyl, if you speed up or slow down the rotation of the CD it doesn't make playback speed up or slow down because it always reads the same number of bits per second, which obviously helps with skip protection and means that you won't get fluctuations in pitch with a dodgy CD player.

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Originally posted by Ryan0751 Yep that's correct. A number of people say that an analog TT such as as Tech 1200 has "infinite" pitch increments, since the pitch slider is an analog potentiometer connected to a motor. While this is partially true, it doesn't necessarily mean that a 1200 is more accurate than a CD deck, since you have to deal with the analog aspects of vinyl (wow and flutter). I find I can keep a mix much tighter with my CDJ-1000's than with my Technics. The Technics require riding the pitch, whereas I can keep the CDJ-1000's locked for a good long time.

Well that depends on the quality of the deck... a relatively new 1210, or one which has been looked after and serviced well has only got a wow/flutter of 0.01%, making it more accurate than a cdj1000

Although admittedly in most clubs they're about 5 years old and they've had the shit kicked out of them.

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Stu Cox |