someone posted this in the dj booth

www.tranceaddict.com/forums/showthr...threadid=365644

i actually agree with most of that the bit about ableton is interesting

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ah
i don't venture in there too often

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All the weekend rockstars in the toilets
Practicing their lines

This post is better than your post

quote:

Like Marshall McLuhan said in the sixties, the medium is the message. It’s the nature of the medium itself, rather than the information disseminated by it, that has the greater influence on society. It was radical idea at the time, but forty years later, it’s still being taught in classrooms.

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The only reason vinyl still exists is because people have spent loads of money and time on their vinyl collections. It's a fetish.

We all know that "better" is subjective. Vinyl does not sound "better" than digital, just like softsynths aren't always worse than hardware. It's just subjective difference.

We get used to something, and we become too close-minded to expand our horizons, especially when time and money are involved. This is why I feel sad for DJs who aren't willing to adapt with the times and use both vinyl AND digital... at least until the technology completely envelopes vinyl and turns it into another casette tape.

ugh

digital is inevitable

vinyl can try to heal itself, but it will die soon.

what can vinyl do that digital can't?

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Shibby Vinyl does not sound "better" than digital.

I know you said it's subjective, but i disagree. Vinyl sounds better than CD/Digital, and is supported by so many audiophiles it's bordering on fact.

However, I think the whole ableton thing is good and will only make things more interesting.

What I would like to see though is in about 8 years, i kind of vinyl rennaisance...

I really don't understand why people care. Use what you want to use, let other people use what they want to use. You're not better than someone for sticking with vinyl, and you're not better than someone for progressing with technology and using CDJs/Ableton/Timecode Software.

Simple.

The second article was a sappy moral justifcation. It was propaganda, pure and simple. It eschewed real fact and appealed to what Shibby rightly terms a fetish. Both authors mention the sexyness of vinyl, and that is what a fetish is, in no fewer words.

I was convinced by the first article and bored by the second.

quote:

Originally posted by JuB jUb I know you said it's subjective, but i disagree. Vinyl sounds better than CD/Digital, and is supported by so many audiophiles it's bordering on fact.

It's psychological. Honestly, I'll trust science before I trust some fuck who could just as easily say "there is a difference" as he could wipe his ass. I have yet to see empirical proof that any human can tell the difference.

Furthermore most vinyls these days are made from a digital master anyway, so any difference that the audiophiles could discern is moot.

Now, having said all this, I admit that I like vinyl. You could say that I've succumbed to the fetish, and maybe I have, but I don't let it control me.

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quote:

Originally posted by thoughtlessjex The second article was a sappy moral justifcation. It was propaganda, pure and simple. It eschewed real fact and appealed to what Shibby rightly terms a fetish. Both authors mention the sexyness of vinyl, and that is what a fetish is, in no fewer words. I was convinced by the first article and bored by the second. It's psychological. Honestly, I'll trust science before I trust some fuck who could just as easily say "there is a difference" as he could wipe his ass. I have yet to see empirical proof that any human can tell the difference. Furthermore most vinyls these days are made from a digital master anyway, so any difference that the audiophiles could discern is moot. Now, having said all this, I admit that I like vinyl. You could say that I've succumbed to the fetish, and maybe I have, but I don't let it control me.

heh, I had a whole post written up for him, and you basically summed it up for me.

Music is definitely psychological; it really is all an illusion, and trends in technology affect it, whether it be vinyl or over-compression of today's music, etc.

If you play the same track on 10,000 different speaker system models, you will hear 10,000 variations of that track, however subtle (or often not subtle at all).

Cheers

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Shibby The only reason vinyl still exists is because people have spent loads of money and time on their vinyl collections. It's a fetish. We all know that "better" is subjective. Vinyl does not sound "better" than digital, just like softsynths aren't always worse than hardware. It's just subjective difference. We get used to something, and we become too close-minded to expand our horizons, especially when time and money are involved. This is why I feel sad for DJs who aren't willing to adapt with the times and use both vinyl AND digital... at least until the technology completely envelopes vinyl and turns it into another casette tape.

You're right...to an extent....it's not that people are unwilling to change, but more likely that the concept of DJing is being "grandfathered" in...because when you've spent your whole life studying one artform to fanatic extremes, its hard to give up all thbose skills just because a better one came around. All those years, and all that practise goes wasted. The motorcycle is a far faster and superior vehicle, yet people still ride bikes.

I cutnpaste what I said in this thread here:

"The reason why most DJs stop playing vinyl is generally because they were never very good at playing vinyl in the first place. Ergo, they don't miss it when they switch to something else, and the new equipment probably gives them some added skills and techniques that they didn't have the aptitude to accomplish with vinyl anyway, so it's a step up for them to be better DJs.

REAL vinyl disc jockeys who have plied their trade for years and are exceptionally good at what they do will still cling to the artform. After spending that much time practising and honing your personal flavour on a specific aparatus, would you want to immediately throw it all away?

That is why you see trance and house DJs flocking to digital, because it neither disrupts nor interferes with the way they DJ. But I have yet to see one hip hop DJ carry around a laptop and Ableton."

quote:

Originally posted by thoughtlessjex It's psychological. Honestly, I'll trust science before I trust some fuck who could just as easily say "there is a difference" as he could wipe his ass. I have yet to see empirical proof that any human can tell the difference.

Actually, there is a difference, and if you would sit down for a moment and listen, you can hear it: The truth is there is a low-end feedback humm coming from the decks to the mixer that creates a sort of "warmth" or lo-fi feel to the sound. Digital decks don't have this, so feel much more pristine, sharp and clearer. And also, as vinyl degrades with playing, it's never in perfect condition. It's smoothed and muddied around the edges, giving it an additional appeal. Most clubs today have vinyl and CD decks set up, with DJs being makeshift hybrids, using both digital and analog decks, hopping back and forth from vinyl to CDs all night long, I can tell in an instant, from across the room, sitting at the bar having a drink, at any point in the night whether the music is playing is coming from a digital or analog source.

Last edited by Ishkur on Aug-26-2006 at 15:11