The European Court of Human Rights has agreed to hear the case of a Latvian man who claims he's not being allowed to use his name as it was given to him at birth. Ruslan Pankratov is an ethnic Russian living in the Latvian capital, Riga. According to the country's laws, all foreign names must be written using Latvian grammar (Pankratovs). But Mr Pankratov objects to having the letter “S" attached to his names.
Latvian courts have twice rejected his appeals.
“The aim of the case is to allow people to spell their names the way they like. Why do linguists or lawyers, instead of us, make the decision? In no other country are names distorted this way,” said Ruslan Pankratov.
He went on to argue that if Latvian rules applied everywhere, people would be constantly changing their names.
“According to this logic in Ukraine I will become Ruslanko Pankratenko and in Georgia I will be Ruslanidze Pankratidze, won’t I? This is absolutely unacceptable,” he added.
First, they accepted Nazi parades and their appeal to the government officials. Now the laws to force people change their last names to have 'S' at the end. What kind of law is that? Should they also tell that guy what to dress and what to say as well?
His analogy is pretty good. Since Latvia uses Latin alphabet, there's nothing wrong with his last name being Pankratov. Otherwise its attacking his personal liberties, his cultural identity and rights.
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Sep-01-2007 02:00
Zharen
Put down the plate
Registered: Mar 2003
Location: On a spit of sand we call Earth
They've probably banned reincarnation there as well. LOL
Sep-04-2007 11:20
Lira
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Registered: Nov 2001
Location: Brasilia, Brazil
I doubt there are any linguists involved in this bizarre incident, that's outrageous.
Politicians (and some grammarians) should stop thinking that languages belong to them, and that there's an inherent link between countries and languages. So what if the nominative case requires a "s" in Latvian? I'm sure this doesn't prevent Latvians from declining Pakratov's name whenever they find it necessary and, even if it happens to be indeclinable, I'm sure Latvians can find a way of "tackling" this so-called problem by changing the word order or something...
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Sep-04-2007 23:57
Tarpex
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Registered: Aug 2005
Location: Kamnik, Slovenia
It's also completely stupid, as most of the second names in Russian especially express affiliation; Pankratov -> Of Pankrat (family)... Magnetonium correct me if that is not specifically the case, Slovenians and Russians have a lot of linguistic similarities
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Sep-05-2007 15:16
biznology
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Registered: Dec 2000
Location:
a russian calling a former republic stupid...great!
this isnt fit for this forum, but if you want to get into the nitty gritty of it, its not surprising that the repubs are making new laws to limit russian-ness, even if they are stupid laws.
does it really affect anyone if one guy doesnt like his name? why does he live in latvia? in most cases he can leave off the letter, unless its offical. or move, then again latvia with an 's' is likely better than wherever he moved from|
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Sep-05-2007 17:02
jonSun
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Registered: Dec 2003
Location: Chicago CTA #77
No "S" ??? The Greeks must be outraged.
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Sep-05-2007 17:53
Tarpex
Senior tranceaddict
Registered: Aug 2005
Location: Kamnik, Slovenia
quote:
Originally posted by biznology
a russian calling a former republic stupid...great!
Reffering to me?
Hope not, else you'll complete my image of the stupid American who doesn't know the world map further of where Canada and Mexico lie.
So, let's say your name is John Walker, and if you moved to Latvia for any reason, you'd have to change it to Jan Valkers or smth... You'd care then huh
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Sep-05-2007 20:25
Sunsnail
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This reminds me of the late 1800's/early 1900's when immigrants in the US had to americanize their names
Sep-05-2007 20:28
Lira
Ancient BassAddict
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: Brasilia, Brazil
Tarpex reminded me of something: His name shouldn't be "Pankratov", because "Pankratov" is in the genitive case. If they really wanted to Latvianise his name, it should be something llike "Pankratu". Right?
quote:
Originally posted by jonSun
No "S" ??? The Greeks must be outraged.
It's quite the opposite, actually: Latvians want his name to end with "s"
No Greek names would be affected
quote:
Originally posted by Sunsnail
This reminds me of the late 1800's/early 1900's when immigrants in the US had to americanize their names
I didn't know about that, have you got a link about it?
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Sep-05-2007 22:01
jonSun
Supreme tranceaddict
Registered: Dec 2003
Location: Chicago CTA #77
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
I didn't know about that, have you got a link about it?
They tried to pull that with my family when they came here from Italy around WWI. Since our last name was Napolitano they said it was too hard to pronouce, lol stupid americans. But my family didnt change it & by that time they were able to get away with it. My dad told me the rules of name changes were relaxed compared to 20-30 years earlier. Little did they know, the officials who made those rules would be working for Italians not too long after. Funny thing is that my family changed our name in the 30's for a number of other reasons.
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Sep-06-2007 02:47
Fir3start3r
Armin Acolyte
Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
I didn't know about that, have you got a link about it?
It was actually not that uncommon Lira.
Makes genealogy a bitch sometimes...
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Sep-06-2007 04:15
Lira
Ancient BassAddict
Registered: Nov 2001
Location: Brasilia, Brazil
quote:
Originally posted by jonSun
They tried to pull that with my family when they came here from Italy around WWI. Since our last name was Napolitano they said it was too hard to pronouce, lol stupid americans. But my family didnt change it & by that time they were able to get away with it. My dad told me the rules of name changes were relaxed compared to 20-30 years earlier. Little did they know, the officials who made those rules would be working for Italians not too long after. Funny thing is that my family changed our name in the 30's for a number of other reasons.
hmm... I do know that happened here, but I don't think it was mandatory (I think my great grandmother changed her Italian surname because she though her surname resembled that of "mafiosi" (?), for example).
quote:
Originally posted by Fir3start3r
It was actually not that uncommon Lira.
Makes genealogy a bitch sometimes...
Did it happen in your family? I wonder how much the names have changed... I know "Kimmel", as in Jimmy Kimmel, was supposed to be "Kümmel", but I wonder whether this Americanisation was really this subtle.
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