I'm looking for information about how to construct a Trance song (any sub-genre), generally.

Are there not basic, general ideas about what a Trance anthem is made of (at least as a starting point for a newbie)? I'm looking for a description of each of the sections and what they are (like intro, first body, first drop, etc. -- what are those sections called and how long are they generally?). I know it's subjective, and subject to a great deal of license and leeway, but I need a starting point to work from.

I bought the Dance Music Production Manual, but the information he gives about how to put it all together doesn't seem to match the songs that any of the big names are putting out; neither in structure, sequence, or length. So I'm a little confused.

My background is in 17th and 18th Century European Classical Music, I have a Bachelor's in Music Theory and Composition (which means I know how to think really deep musical thoughts about being unemployed), and of course none of that is of much use in creating dance music.

I'm using FL Studio 8 Producer Edition, not that it makes a difference really.

I'm sure this is a real noob question, so if anyone would be cool enough to take a minute and either break it down for me, or point me in the direction of the info I need, I'd owe ya' big time.

Thanks

Dragon

Hahaha this topic rings a bell.

You'l just have to listen to big anthem trance songs and try to recreate your own take on the techniques they use.
The pros out there have been doing this shit for ages! Practise.

quote:

I'm looking for a description of each of the sections and what they are (like intro, first body, first drop, etc. -- what are those sections called and how long are they generally?).

Seriously man you need to listen to sum tracks. But as a general rule if you want stuff released on lables then 8.1/2mins is prolly about maximum length for a track. I think about a minute of pretty plain intro beat is good for djing before anything really gets going. DJ Friendly. Those are handy guidelines but before peeps jump on this and disagree there are of course no hard fast rules.

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ow. there are a lot of genres to trance, each of them with a lot of different approaches. I understand you want to grasp the theory of the structure for trance, but that will be hard.

There is a general idea to trance/EDM however, thats a little different to other genres. It is the idea of building up and building down, these ups and downs are making it suitable for a dance floor.

So if you want something to start with, here is a basic trance track structure. theartfulducker probably gave the best hint already, you should analyze professional tracks how they are built up, but you said you need a starting point so here goes.

You start with the basic beat, a DJ friendly start of your track. Then you add more and more elements, bass, synthlines, all one by one. When you have reached the first climax, lets say at 2-3 minutes, the track breaks down to a calm moments and you introduce your melody. The melody gets more and more intense and layered, you are building up again. The climax is where your beat starts again, joined by the main melody, lets say at 4-5 minutes. Finally, your track is building down again, you take out your elements one by one just like you built it up in the beginning.

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quote:

[i][b] You start with the basic beat, a DJ friendly start of your track. Then you add more and more elements, bass, synthlines, all one by one. When you have reached the first climax, lets say at 2-3 minutes, the track breaks down to a calm moments and you introduce your melody. The melody gets more and more intense and layered, you are building up again. The climax is where your beat starts again, joined by the main melody, lets say at 4-5 minutes. Finally, your track is building down again, you take out your elements one by one just like you built it up in the beginning.

Totally!

Add effects to your layers and test run it as many times as you need to make it sounds good to yourself

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Originally posted by Frenchie My pussy is cold, please light my fire.

well i suck too at making trance music,but mebay be i can help u out. have u try to look at some midi trance songs that u like? this site is so cool enjoy! http://www.nonstop2k.com/community/frontpage.php

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Last edited by atxbigballer1 on May-14-2008 at 03:32

i am lol

There are really NO rules here.

It all depens on what kind of trance track you are going to make, here are three Trance tracks, with main part breakdowns colored yellow, you`ll notice the timing and length of the break is different on all of them.



Be creative, do what feels natural for you.

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Last edited by Subtle on May-14-2008 at 10:00

Listen to tracks you enjoy and try and copy them. I physically wrote out when to add drops, builds, FX and what not on a piece of paper and kept it at my desk as a rough outline of what needed to happen and when.

Practice, practice and practice. Along with google and youtube.

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quote:

Originally posted by Subtle There are really NO rules here. It all depens on what kind of trance track you are going to make, here are three Trance tracks, with main part breakdowns colored yellow, you`ll notice the timing and length of the break is different on all of them. Be creative, do what feels natural for you.

Yeah, and heaps of tracks have two breakdowns too which isn't evident from this. Its really a matter of experimenting a lot, you don't want all your tracks to have the same structure, it'll be boring.

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Check this out, this should help you out.

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...light=structure

Thanks for the link to that thread! Pho-mo and the others gave me what I was looking for, thanks very much.

To the people who feel that following a structure is somehow "formulaic," I would just like to say one small thing.

ALL MUSIC IS FORMULAIC TO ONE DEGREE OR ANOTHER.

The true artistry comes not so much from innovation, but from exercising your creativity and artistry within the bounds of the form you are working in. You have to know what the rules are before you can go breaking them and innovating.

This is true of classical music, this is true of rock, country, hip-hop, even Balinese Cymbal Music has a form and a structure.

There is a very common term to describe music that is purely freeform and without any identifying structure: Jamming.

Nobody wants to hear you jam. People want songs. Discrete, organized units that are readily understandable and familiar.

The form and structure, especially in generalized form, is useful to teach a complete newcomer (like me, a classical musician) about the general style called Trance. I disagree strongly with the person who said "just listen to a bunch of tracks and try to copy that."

If I give you a list of ten classical piano sonatas, told you to listen to them and try to copy that, I haven't given you any real information. I've just shown you that I don't have a clue how to answer your question.

Would YOU be able to produce a sonata by just listening to dozens, hundreds, or even thousands of them? I have a four-year degree in Music Composition, and I wouldn't be able to do it like that! I would, at minimum, need to see a written copy of the scores to properly analyze them to a level where I could produce my own Sonata.

Someone said that classical music is so complex that it wasn't analogous to producing trance tracks. I disagree. The complexity of classical music is greatly simplified by the form. The less complex a piece of music, the more thorough the structure MUST be!

If you don't know that a Sonata is made of an Exposition section in the Tonic, Development section in the Dominant, and Recapitulation in the tonic, and this is what distinguishes the Classical Sonata form, then no amount of listening will teach you that.

So, again, I give my thanks and much respect for the *suggestions* about what a Trance track *might* consist of. At least now I have a very good place to start.

I do have to ask one question, though. And I will post a new thread with that.

Thanks again!

Dragon

quote:

If I give you a list of ten classical piano sonatas, told you to listen to them and try to copy that, I haven't given you any real information. I've just shown you that I don't have a clue how to answer your question.

C'mon dnace music is hardly writing classical piano sonatas. But persoannly i would think youd have a much better chance of writng one after listening to 10 others.
IMO and expierience dance music is more about how good you are as a producer. Your better to make a simple but wicked sounding track than a more complex one thats not well produced. As you learn more production techniques these will come across in your music. No good think your guna put a wicked break down sumwhere in a track if you cant even make a wicked breakdown. Noobs think they guna come in and get some tricks and make this awesome dance music but it takes years! Years of learning different techniques and training your ears and forming your own style of compositon etc.

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