quote:

Originally posted by josh4 He has fumbled the english language at every turn.... ... ... ... The collimation of systematic failures across the board leads me to my opinions.

Wait...I'll respond later, I'm trying to watch college football so I haven't had a chance to read anything yet, but this caught my eye. The what?? You bastardize the English language worse than Bush, Mr. Kettle. Now I'll get to the actual meat of your thread later. Carry on.


p.s. I assume you meant "culmination."

Don't forget rewriting the rules of engagement and making PRE-EMPTIVE WAR a standard around which other countries can now rally.

We have no right to complain of China launches a pre-emptive strike on Taiwan...North Korea against South Korea...Russia against it's neighbors, etc. We started the ball rolling down this slope..and we'd be hypocritical of we condemned others for doing it..

And let's not forget about the debt doubling under Bush to well over $10 trillion...and NON-defense government spending that grew 3X faster than it did during the Clinton years. That will also be his enduring legacy.

quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt Don't forget rewriting the rules of engagement and making PRE-EMPTIVE WAR a standard around which other countries can now rally.

Preemption was already standard international policy. Preventive war was the new revised version.

Now we no longer need a direct threat, we just need circumstances in which a direct threat could theoretically be viable in a hypothetical future.

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quote:

Originally posted by Capitalizt Don't forget rewriting the rules of engagement and making PRE-EMPTIVE WAR a standard around which other countries can now rally. We have no right to complain of China launches a pre-emptive strike on Taiwan...North Korea against South Korea...Russia against it's neighbors, etc. We started the ball rolling down this slope..and we'd be hypocritical of we condemned others for doing it.. And let's not forget about the debt doubling under Bush to well over $10 trillion...and NON-defense government spending that grew 3X faster than it did during the Clinton years. That will also be his enduring legacy.

Yeah that's not even an exhaustive list, there is plenty more. If anybody wants to contribute, feel free to add to Bush's record of fail. Since some in here unbelievably need it laid out in front of them.

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Wait...I'll respond later, I'm trying to watch college football so I haven't had a chance to read anything yet, but this caught my eye. The what?? You bastardize the English language worse than Bush, Mr. Kettle. Now I'll get to the actual meat of your thread later. Carry on. p.s. I assume you meant "culmination."

Ah, spelling mistakes, the last resort for anyone in PDD, next to personal attacks. Both things you've been resorting to lately. That's pretty fucking weak even for you. I await your formal rebuttal, but hold no doubt it will be equally as lame.

quote:

Originally posted by josh4 Ah, spelling mistakes, the last resort for anyone in PDD, next to personal attacks. Both things you've been resorting to lately. That's pretty fucking weak even for you. I await your formal rebuttal, but hold no doubt it will be equally as lame.

oh FFS Josh, stop it already with your BS moral high-ground. You're equally as guilty of throwing out personal attacks lately--don't act all high and mighty.

You started this thread because of the question I asked you in the other thread. I asked you specifically how your life had been so negatively impacted by Bush's presidency that you should throw out hyperbolic phrases like, "Can't possibly be any worse than the past 8 years."

To quote you exactly, you said:

quote:

Originally posted by josh4 Can't possibly be any worse than the past 8 years. (That was a cherry just for you.)

Clearly you were baiting me here with your little cherry comment, so when I asked you to please elaborate on how horrible your life has been for the past 8 years because of Bush you said:

quote:

Originally posted by josh4 That's an obvious bait to get into a drawn out point by point confrontation with you that I have no interest in doing.

So you bait me, I take the bait and ask you a question that you refuse to respond to because you say I'm baiting you....yeah, I see how it works in your fucked up little world. No doubt fucked up because George Bush is president.

I never claimed that Bush is a good president or that he leaves a great legacy. To the contrary, I said:

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka he certainly does leave a pretty unfortunate legacy. He came into office at the start of a recession and he's leaving with the financial system in shambles (Neither of which I believe he is directly responsible for, but both of which occurred while he was in office). He fought an extremely unpopular war, though many are hopeful that some good will ultimately come from it. I happen to admire that he was often willing to do what was unpopular--that shows leadership (even if those decisions sometimes turned out to be poorly executed or not quite correct in hindsight). I simply don't need someone else's opinion to tell me what I believe. Positively, he appointed Ben Bernanke, one of the smarter minds in this country to be able to come up with new, innovative ways to deal with the crisis we are seeing now. Bernanke has the unfortunate challenge of dealing with Greenspan's legacy (amazing how Greenspan got high approval marks, but helped sow the seeds for the crisis we're going through now, eh? Another reason I don't believe in opinion polls or approval ratings). I think that Paulson was behind the curve early in '07, but he has come to understand the crisis as well and is throwing everything he's got behind it. Those will probably be two of Bush's most important positive attributes. Also, as far as Volcker, Buffet and the like go--I have nothing but the utmost respect for them, they are very smart and capable people. I would gladly remind you that they are also very supportive of the actions being taken by Fed and Treasury right now, so I'm not sure it's really a point to debate. I've generally taken your Bush criticisms to be more foreign policy related, but perhaps I'm mistaken. Quick--without looking it up on the Internet, tell me what you really know about Volcker.

I merely pointed out that you made a hyperbolic generalization without specifically saying why your life in particular sucks so bad because of Bush. You think history isn't littered with bad presidents who have had the same derision cast on them?

So clearly you have now chosen to bait me with this thread, to which my response means little if anything as I've already conceded that the man will leave a negative legacy. Yay for you Josh.

I could think of many ways that the last 8 years could've been a lot worse. I'm sure you could to if you really put your mind to it.

Yeah, Shakka, Bush was such a GREAT president! Like seriously ... intelligent, witty, great deicision maker and very articulate. Here are some of my favourite things he has said over the course of his presidency (I doubt you'll find any other president as AMAZING as Bush when it comes to this). On a serious point - a president just cant get any worse than this:

quote:

"One of the interesting initiatives we've taken in Washington, D.C., is we've got these vampire-busting devices. A vampire is a—a cell deal you can plug in the wall to charge your cell phone."—Denver, CO. Aug. 14, 2001 "Well, it's an unimaginable honor to be the president during the Fourth of July of this country. It means what these words say, for starters. The great inalienable rights of our country. We're blessed with such values in America. And I--it's--I'm a proud man to be the nation based upon such wonderful values."--Visiting the Jefferson Memorial, Washington, D.C., July 2, 2001 "The California crunch really is the result of not enough power-generating plants and then not enough power to power the power of generating plants."—Interview with the New York Times, Jan. 14, 2001 "The great thing about America is everybody should vote."-Austin, Texas, Dec. 8, 2000 "It's clearly a budget. It's got a lot of numbers in it."--Reuters, May 5, 2000 "I think if you know what you believe, it makes it a lot easier to answer questions. I can't answer your question."— Reynoldsburg, Ohio, Oct. 4, 2000 "Natural gas is hemispheric. I like to call it hemispheric in nature because it is a product that we can find in our neighborhoods."—Austin, Texas, Dec. 20, 2000 "I'm a uniter not a divider. That means when it comes time to sew up your chest cavity, we use stitches as opposed to opening it up." -- Bush, on David Letterman, March 2, 2000. (the audience booed) "I didn't -- I swear I didn't -- get into politics to feather my nest or feather my friends' nests." -- Bush Jr., in the Houston Chronicle " Free societies are hopeful societies. And free societies will be allies against these hateful few who have no conscience, who kill at the whim of a hat. " -- Washington, D.C.; September 17, 2004. " In other words, I don't think people ought to be compelled to make the decision which they think is best for their family. " -- Washington, D.C.; December 11, 2002. " They want the federal government controlling Social Security like it's some kind of federal program. " -- St. Charles, Missouri; November 2, 2000. " If you're a young person, you ought to be asking members of Congress and the United States Senate and the president what you intend to do about it. If you see a train wreck coming, you ought to be saying, 'What are you going to do about it, Mr. Congressman, or Madam Congressman?' " -- Detroit, Michigan; February 8, 2005. " It's evolutionary, going from governor to president, and this is a significant step, to be able to vote for yourself on the ballot, and I'll be able to do so next fall, I hope. " -- Interview with The Associated Press; March 8, 2000. " It's very important for folks to understand that when there's more trade, there's more commerce. " -- Quebec City, Canada; April 21, 2001. " But if you've been laid off work, you're 100 percent unemployed, and I worry about it. " -- Green Bay, Wisconsin; September 3, 2001. " Oftentimes, we live in a processed world -- you know, people focus on the process and not the results. " -- Washington, D.C.; May 29, 2003. " Dick Cheney and I do not want this nation to be in a recession. We want anybody who can find work to be able to find work. " -- on CBS's 60 Minutes II; December 5, 2000. " We are still being challenged in Iraq and the reason why is a free Iraq will be a major defeat in the cause of freedom. " -- Charlotte, North Carolina; April 5, 2004. " I am the master of low expectations. " -- Aboard Air Force One; June 4, 2003. " We though we were protected forever from trade policy or terrorist attacks because oceans protected us. " -- Speech to business leaders at APEC Summit; Santiago, Chile; November 20, 2004. " I am mindful not only of preserving executive powers for myself, but for predecessors as well. " -- Washington, D.C.; January 29, 2001. " We cannot let terrorists and rogue nations hold this nation hostile or hold our allies hostile. " -- Des Moines, Iowa; August 21, 2000. " Listen, whoever thought about modernizing this room deserves a lot of credit. Like, there's very little oxygen in here anymore. " -- On the confines of the White House's Brady Press Briefing Room; Washington, D.C.; March 16, 2005. MY TOP 70 #70. " We don't want to discourage the innovators and those who take risks because they're afraid of getting sued by a lawsuit. " -- Washington, D.C.; June 24, 2004. #69. " We need an energy bill that encourages consumption. " -- Trenton, New Jersey; September 23, 2002. #68. " Neither in French nor in English nor in Mexican. " -- Declining to answer reporters' questions at the summit of the Americas; Quebec City, Canada; April 21, 2001. #67. The Bob Jones policy on interracial dating, I mean I spoke out on interracial dating, I spoke against that. I spoke out against interracial dating. I support the policy of interracial dating. " -- CBS Evening News; February 25, 2000. #66. " The important question is, how many hands have I shaked. " -- Answering a question about why he hasn't spent more time in Hew Hampshire; as quoted in New York Times; October 23, 1999. #65. " See, we--love freedom. That's what they didn't understand. They hate things, we love things. They act out of hatred, we don't seek revenge, we see justice out of love. " -- Oklahoma City, Oklahoma; August 29, 2002. #64. " We spent a lot of time talking about Africa, as we should. Africa is a nation that suffers from incredible disease. " -- Gothenburg, Sweden; June 14, 2001. #63. Redefining the role of United States from enablers to keep the peace to enablers to keep the peace from peacekeepers is going to be an assignment. " -- Interview with New York Times; January 14, 2001. #62. " We've had leaks out of the Administrative Branch, had leaks out of Legislative Branch, and out of the Executive Branch and the Legislative Branch, and I've spoken out consistently against them, and I want to know who the leakers are. " -- Chicago, Illinois; September 30, 2003. #61. " If you found somebody that had information about an attack on America, you'd want to know as best as we can to find out what the facts are. " -- Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, December 12, 2005. #60. " These people don't have tanks. They don't have ships. The hide in caves. They send suiciders out. " -- Speaking about terrorists; Portsmouth, New Hampshire; November 1, 2002. #59. " I like the idea of people running for office. There's a positive effect when you run for office. Maybe some will run for office and say, vote for me, I look forward to blowing up America. I don't know, I don't know if that will be their platform or not. But it's--I don't think so. I think people who generally run for office say, vote for me, I'm looking forward to fixing your potholes, or making sure you got bread on the table. " -- Washington, D.C.; March 16, 2005. #58. " I'm looking forward to a good night's sleep on the soil of a friend. " -- On the prospect of vising Denmark; Washington, D.C.; June 29, 2005. #57. " Governor, thank you very much. I am here to make an announcement that this thursday, ticket counters and airplanes will fly out of Ronald Reagan Airport. " -- Arlington, Virginia; October 2, 2001. #56. " The reason I believe in a large tax cut is because it's what I believe." -- Washington, D.C.; December 18, 2000. #55. " I think we were welcomed. But it was not a peaceful welcome. " -- On the reception of American forces in Iraq; Philadelphia, Pennsylvania; December 12, 2005. #54. If affirmative action means what I just described, what I am for, then I'm for it. " -- St. Louis, Missouri; October 18, 2000. #53. " First we would not accept a treaty that would not have been ratified, nor a treaty that I thought made sense for the country. " -- Interview with Washington Post; April 24, 2001. #52. " I want you to know that farmers are not going to be secondary thoughts to a Bush administration. They will be in the forethought of our thinking. " -- Salinas, California; August 10, 2000. #51. " I am thrilled to be here in the breadbasket of America because it gives me a chance to remind our fellow citizens that we have an advantage here in America - we can feed ourselves. " -- Stockton, California; August 23, 2002. 50 - 31 #50. " I have a different vision of leadership. A leadership is someone who brings people together. " -- Bartlett, Tennessee; August 18, 2000. #49. " Will the highways on the Internet become more few? " -- Concord, New Hampshire; January 29, 2000. #48. " Listen, I want to thank leaders of the--in the faith--faith-based and community-based community for being here. " -- Washington, D.C.; September 6, 2005. #47. " I think we ought to raise the age at which the juveniles can have a gun. " -- St. Louis, Missouri; October 18, 2000. #46. " I was a prisoner, too, but for bad reasons. " -- To Argentine president Nestor Kirchner, on being told that all but one of the Argentine delegates to a summit meeting were imprisoned during a dictatorship; Monterrey, Mexico; January, 13, 2004. #45. " I repeat, personal accounts do not permanently fix the solution. " -- Washington, D.C.; March 16, 2005. #44. " The fundamental question is, 'Will I be a successful president when it comes to foreign policy?' I will be, but until I am the president, it's going to be hard for me to verify that I think I'll be more effective. " -- Wayne, Michigan; June 28, 2000. #43. " My administration has been calling upon all the leaders in the--in the Middle East to do everything they can to stop the violence, to tell the different parties involved that peace will never happen. " -- Crawford, Texas; August 13, 2001. #42. " I like my buddies from West Texas. I liked them when I was young, I liked them when I was middle-age, I liked them before I was president, and I like them during president, and I like them after president. " -- Nashville, Tennessee; February 1, 2006. #41. " The best way to find these terrorists who hide in holes is to get people coming forth to describe the location of the hole, is to give clues and data. " -- Washington, D.C.; December 15, 2003. #40. " Presidents, whether things are good or bad, get the blame, I understand that. " -- Washington, D.C.; May 11, 2001. #39. " We expect the states to show us whether or not we're achieving simple objectives - like literacy, literacy in math, the ability to read and white. " -- On federal education requirements; Washington, D.C.; April 28, 2005. #38. " The administration I'll bring is a group of men and women who are focused on what's best for America, honest men and women, descent men and women, women who will see service to our country as a great privilege and who will not stain the house." -- Des Moines, Iowa; January 15, 2000. #37. " One of the hardest parts of my job is to console the family members who have lost their life. " -- Washington, D.C.; April 13, 2004. #36. "As you can possibly see, I have an injury myself--not here at the hospital, but in combat with cedar. I eventually won. The cedar gave me a little scratch. " -- After visiting with wounded veterans from the Amputee Care Center of Brooke Army Medical Center; San Antonio, Texas; January 1, 2006. #35. " Now, we talked to Joan Hanover. She and her husband, George, were visiting with us. They are near retirement--retiring--in the process of retiring, meaning they're very smart, active, capable people who are retirement age and are retiring. " -- Alexandria, Virginia; February 12, 2003. #34. " Too many good docs are getting out of business. To many OB/GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across the country. " -- Poplar Bluff, Missouri; September 6, 2004. #33. " Families is where our nation finds hope, where wings take dream. " -- La Crosse, Wisconsin; October 18, 2000. #32. " It is clear that our nation is reliant upon big foreign oil. More and more of our imports come from abroad." -- Beaverton, Oregon; September 25, 2000. #31. " It's a time of sorrow and sadness when we lose a loss of life. " -- Washington, D.C.; December 21, 2004. 30 - 11 #30. " See, free nations are peaceful nations. Free nations don't attack each other. Free nations don't develop the weapons of mass destruction. " -- Milwaukee, Wisconsin; October 3, 2003. #29. " I know what I believe. I will continue to articulate what I believe, and what I believe -- I believe what I believe is right. " -- Rome, Italy; July 22, 2001. #28. " I mean, there was a serious international effort to say to Saddam Hussein, you're a threat. And the 9/11 attacks extenuated that thread, as far as I--concerned. " -- Philadelphia, Pennsylvania; December 12, 2005. #27. " I think anybody who doesn't think I am smart enough to handle the job is underestimating. " -- As quoted in U.S. News & World Report; April 3, 2000. #26. "Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning? " -- Florence, South Carolina; January 11, 2000. #25. It's important for us to explain to our nation that life is important. It's not only life of babies, but it's life of children living in, you know, the dark dungeons of the Internet. " -- Arlington Heights, Illinois; October 24, 2000. #24. " We're concerned about AIDS inside our White House -- make no mistake about it. " -- Washington, D.C.; February 7, 2001. #23. " For every fatal shooting, there were roughly three nonfatal shootings. And, folks, that is unacceptable in America. It's just unacceptable. And we're going to do something about it. " -- Philadelphia, Pennsylvania; May 14, 2001. #22. " I want to thank you for taking time out of your day to come and witness my hanging. " -- At the dedication of his portrait; Austin, Texas; January 4, 2002. #21. " The ambassador and the general were briefing me on the -- the vast majority of Iraqis want to live in a peaceful, free world. And we will find these people and we will bring them to justice. " -- Washington, D.C.; October 28, 2003. #20. " The CIA laid out several scenarios and said life could be lousy, life could be okay, life could be better, and they were just guessing as to what the conditions might be like. " -- New York, New York; September 21, 2004. #19. " It would be a mistake for the United States Senate to allow any kind of human cloning to come out of that chamber. " -- Washington, D.C.; April 10, 2002. #18. " He was a state sponsor of terror. In other words, the government had declared, you are a state sponsor of terror. " -- On Saddam Hussein; Manhattan, Kansas; January 23, 2006. #17. " That's why I went to Congress last September and proposed fundamental-supplemental funding, which is money for armor and body parts and ammunition and fuel. " -- Erie, Pennsylvania; September 4, 2004. #16. " I didn't join the International Criminal Court because I don't want to put our troops in the hands of prosecutors from other nations. Look, if somebody has done some wrong in our military, we'll take care of it. We got plenty of capability of dealing with justice. " -- Niceville, Florida; August 10, 2004. #15. " I know how hard it is for you to put food on your family. " -- Nashua, New Hampshire; January 27, 2000. #14. " I want to thank my friend, Senator Bill Frist, for joining us today ... He married a Texas girl, I want you to know. Karyn is with us. A West Texas girl, just like me. " -- Nashville, Tennessee; May 27, 2004. #13. " By the way, we rank tenth amongst the industrialized world in broadband technology and its availability. That's not good enough for America. Tenth is ten spots too low as far as I'm concerned. " -- Minneapolis, Minnesota; April 26, 2004. #12. " It's in our country's interests to find those who would do harm to us and get them out of harm's way. " -- Washington, D.C.; April 28, 2005. #11. " I want everybody to hear loud and clear that I'm going to be the president of everybody. " -- Washington, D.C.; January 18, 2001. 10 - 1 #10. " This notion that United States is getting ready to attack Iran is simply ridiculous. And having said that, all options are on the table. " -- Brussels, Belgium; February 22, 2005. #9. " I'm honoured to shake the hand of a brave Iraqi citizen who had his hand cut off by Saddam Hussein. " -- Washington, D.C.; May 25, 2004. #8. " Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we. " -- Washington, D.C.; August 5, 2004. #7. "If this were a dictatorship, it would be a heck of a lot easier, just as long as I'm the dictator. " -- Washington, D.C.; December 18, 2002. #6. " Well, we've made the decision to defeat the terrorists abroad so we don't have to face them here at home. And when you engage the terrorists abroad, it causes activity and action. " -- Washington, D.C.; April 28, 2005. #5. " The war on terror involves Saddam Hussein because of the nature of Saddam Hussein, the history of Saddam Hussein, and his willingness to terrorize himself. " -- Grand Rapids, Michigan; January 29, 2002. #4. " I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully. " -- Saginaw, Michigan; September 29, 2000. #3. " And so, in my State of the -- my State of the Union -- or state -- my speech to the nation, whatever you want to call it, speech to the nation -- I asked Americans to give four thousand years -- four thousand hours over the next -- the rest of your life -- of service to America. That's what I asked -- four thousand hours. " -- Bridgeport, Connecticut; April 9, 2002. #2. " Those who enter the country illegally violate the law. " -- Tucson, Arizona; November 28, 2005. #1. "It's your money. You paid for it. " -- La Crosse, Wisconsin; October 18, 2000.

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Whenever you go and buy something, you are affecting someone somewhere, be it environment, a person, or a community - you're making a statement with what you buy. So make it a smart choice ... Its a big picture

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium Yeah, Shakka, Bush was such a GREAT president! Like seriously ... intelligent, witty, great deicision maker and very articulate. Here are some of my favourite things he has said over the course of his presidency (I doubt you'll find any other president as AMAZING as Bush when it comes to this). On a serious point - a president just cant get any worse than this:

Where did I say he was great? Why don't you think it can't get worse? Setting the bar pretty low aren't you?

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Where did I say he was great? Why don't you think it can't get worse? Setting the bar pretty low aren't you?

Well, of course the US of A can turn into a dictatorship and whatever the other form of authoritarian regime, the clauses are there set in place, and Bush actually accelerated the process by proving that he can put Constitution-contradicting legislature and get away with it. So in a way he was one of the worst presidents in American history. Now the next generation of presidents can continue the process! So yes, it makes Bush a very very bad president! Instead of furthermore protecting American Constitution, he did pretty much quite the opposite. At a critical time for USA, too.

___________________
Whenever you go and buy something, you are affecting someone somewhere, be it environment, a person, or a community - you're making a statement with what you buy. So make it a smart choice ... Its a big picture

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium Well, of course the US of A can turn into a dictatorship and whatever the other form of authoritarian regime, the clauses are there set in place, and Bush actually accelerated the process by proving that he can put Constitution-contradicting legislature and get away with it. So in a way he was one of the worst presidents in American history. Now the next generation of presidents can continue the process! So yes, it makes Bush a very very bad president! Instead of furthermore protecting American Constitution, he did pretty much quite the opposite. At a critical time for USA, too.

Yes exactly. That's my whole problem with no one getting punished. That sets up precedents for future Presidents to follow. This one only choose to go as far as he did these past 8 years but what's to stop the next ones of going further? Nothing by these standards.

Bush's legacy? LOL Bush is a fucking puppet.

Let's talk about Prescott's legacy.

Does anyone even know who George Herbert Walker was??

___________________
Wave is to particle as zero is to one as bagpipes are to modem noises.

quote:

Originally posted by {b.s.e.} Bush's legacy? LOL Bush is a fucking puppet. Let's talk about Prescott's legacy. Does anyone even know who George Herbert Walker was??

lets keep the Tin Foil out for now.....