I've always liked producing and have done it for fun for years. However, I feel like I'm held back because I'm not trained on the piano or any instrument for that matter. I know about keeping the song in key, but I'm no good at recognizing chords (or even notes) when I hear them. You know, to say "that's in A minor, or that's a so and so chord".
Are most producers trained musically? I know some aren't. But it sure must helkp if you are. Is it worth learning the keyboard to get really good? I've always just messed around with it until something I like comes out. I can obviously tell when it's off-key or sounds like shit.
What's the deal? Do you know the piano? How did you learn chords? I just found a website with all the chords but it's not like I'm gonna memorize them.
What are your thoughts?

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I spent some years in my (extreme) youth learning the piano. All that means now is I am still able (just) to play stuff into my sequencer with both hands together

A bit of music theory will teach you what chords naturally work with what other chords, and how to conventionally deviate from the chord. But if you can do all that by ear (and it sounds like you can) then you're not missing out. I don't think it's of any value to be able to tell a chord sequence just by listening to it.

i think basic knowledge of chord progression is important...

I would suggest you take several fundamental Rudiments courses, and also Harmony Courses.

Rudiments just teaches you the basics of music. Harmony is a bit more in-depth and teaches you about different chords and how they go together...

Counterpoint is more advanced music theory and it teaches you about how to write simple songs and have chord progressions that go well together...


I can't give you much advice on how to write good chord progressions but here's a tip:

A good chord progression consists of a good variety of major and minor chords strategically placed together.

This might sound crazy but most of the time things just POP up in my head, maybe its from listening to music for so many years

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Ive been a producer scince i was 14, and im 17 now and just got myself a contract! I've taught myself over the years, and me and my co-producer are always learning new tricks and stuff. So, the best way is just to teach ur self!

George | Aspiration

quote:

Originally posted by revelx Ive been a producer scince i was 14, and im 17 now and just got myself a contract! I've taught myself over the years, and me and my co-producer are always learning new tricks and stuff. So, the best way is just to teach ur self! George | Aspiration

yea same here
except i started producing when i was 17, im now just about to turn 19.

have no contract yet, but iv not sent away any demos yet, and im not looking for any contract just yet
but like george says, teach yourself.
cause thats what i did

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quote:

Originally posted by TranceMasterUk yea same here except i started producing when i was 17, im now just about to turn 19. have no contract yet, but iv not sent away any demos yet, and im not looking for any contract just yet but like george says, teach yourself. cause thats what i did

and you make fooking awesome songs too :P...btw, when will we be graced with a new song from you?? (under TM, not elementals..ie: a solo effort). I can't stop humming the ultimate dream :P

back on topic, i haven't been producing for more than 5 months or so, but basically i have used tutorials, or just taught myself, i do have some knowledge of music theory, and chords etc, but so far it hasn't really been THAT important.

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Currently Whoring:

• Space Tribe Vs Electric Universe - Rabbit Hole
  
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• Too Short & Mistah FAB - The Sideshow
  

by learning music theory you will be able to make melodies that are technically accurate, by experimenting randomly youll come up with melodies that actually sound good, thats my thoughts on this

By learning music theory you learn what you are doing when you experiment. When you experiment and find out that when you play C, E, and G together, it sounds pretty good, you would know (if you had taken music theory) that you were playing a C major chord. If you play C, F, and G, and then end with C, E, and G, you'll know "what" you did, in terms that other people can understand.

After many years of producing music, you are going to learn music theory whether you want to or not. Unless you are dumb as dirt. You are going to find that a particular note sounds one way with some notes, and another way with other notes. You will find that different notes played together produce different effects (e.g. if you play F# and G together, it sounds quite different than if you play C and G together).

Even in the 4 - 5 months I spent fooling around without knowing any music theory, I learned stuff that I now realize I learned (I have begun to teach myself music theory, as best I can).

So pushing away music theory because it isn't any use is really silly, in my opinion. You are going to learn it anyway, by experimenting, and it is going to take you much longer than if you had just sat down and read a book to begin with. Learning music theory doesn't prohibit you from experimenting, it just helps you know what you are doing, and to think of it in terms that other musicians will understand.

At least, that is my take on it. I don't know much theory yet, though.

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-brash

ok brash I agree, knowing some music theory can only help with melody writing, I wasnt really specific, the way you describe producers picking up theory as they experiment is the way it should be imo, learning music theory and then going into production can lure you into the wrong frame of mind where you create melodies based solely on what youve learned from the theory, but just dont have audio appeal suitable for trance, with experimentation on the other hand you tend to just listen for note progressions that sound catchy. I know a fair bit of theory, but when Im making melodies I dont think to myself 'ah now im going from a b minor to a d major', of course sometimes it comes in useful and can make the process quicker, but by just listening out for what sounds good, eventually you will come up with a superior tune.
btw this doesnt include musical geniuses like Barber with adagio for strings or any composer really, just ur average musician, my mate is grade 8 music theory but he cant write as good a trance melody as me because he doesnt know what has trance audio appeal

i totally agree with eLe_vAtE because i relatively know fuck all about music apart from which notes are which when i see them on piano roll but to be trained to grade 8 pianist doesn't mean that you suddenly know how to create the best of best melodies, for example me + chris in elude correct each others stuff to either make it sound more interesting or to actually make it technically sound, there is a balancing act, and that's why some stuff sounds plain shit and some sounds f00kin excellent.

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w: www.luketerry.com

I know a bit of music theory, but haven't played many instruments in my past. One bit of knowledge that I learned from computermusicuk's website that is very useful is chord inversions. They are very useful when you want your chord progressions for pads to flow more smoothly into one another. Other than that, I think it is mainly what sounds good to you.