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| quote: | Originally posted by biznology
it gets old listening to polarizing opinion/heresay on very limited subjects when this forum could be used to truly discuss everything related to politics, et al| |
Yes we need more threads that deal with abstract political debate rather than relating everything to what is happening today. Some of the best threads I've read have been offtopic subjects such as absolute truth, astronomy, physics, the mentality of ordinary people in the nazi regime, etc (ironically all in threads about Iraq/US). It's a shame that these forums are being pumelled with current events that all but drown out every other issue that we can be discussing.
I agree with Biz and mental in that peace is an idealistic objective that cannot be achieved at this point in human evolution. No matter how amicable, rational, and open-minded you are, situations will always arise that demand conflict. On the micro-level and in the macro/global sense. It is within human nature to strive for self-preservation. In order to achieve self-preservation we adapt to become competitive, aggressive, and controlling. In doing so we establish dominance and assurance of self-preservation. If any philosophers are out there, I think that Thomas Hobbes said it best in the leviathan:
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if any two men desire the same thing, which nevertheless they cannot both enjoy, they become enemies, and in the way to their End, . . . endeavor to destroy, or subdue one another . . . If one plant, sow, build, or possess a convenient Seat, others may probably be expected to come prepared with forces united, to dispossess, and deprive him, not only of the fruit of his labor, but also of his life, or liberty . . .
So that in the nature of man, we find three principal causes of quarrel. First, Competition; Secondly, Diffidence; Thirdly, Glory.
The first maketh men invade for Gain; the second, for Safety; and the third, Reputation. The first use Violence to make themselves Masters of other men's persons, wives, children, and cattle; the second, to defend them; the third, for trifles, as a word, a smile, a different opinion, and any other sign of undervalue, either direct in their Persons, or by reflexion in their Kindred, their Friends, their Nation, their Profession, or their Name.
Hereby it is manifest, that during the time men live without a common Power to keep them all in awe, they are in that condition which is called War; and such a war, as is of every man, against every man . . . state of nature will return.
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The famous saying that everybody attributes to hobbes is that the life of man is solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short. I agree that the current state of mankind is accurately described by that statement. I don't think that we are destined for oblivion and violence however. I think that only through GLOBAL education, can we can rid the world of many intolerances, hatred, misconceptions, and ignorance. That won't happen in my lifetime though. Probably not for another 10 lifetimes follow at least.
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Definition Time: Peace
... any other ideas???
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