quote:

Originally posted by DrUg_Tit0 So the elections for the parlament are being held there today and it seems like the situation is pretty bad. Two last liberal newspapers in the country were forcefully shut down, reformist candidates are either banned from or are boycotting the elections, and the general opinion of the leaders is that starting widespread protests after the election is too risky. Sadly, the liberal voters have lost their zeal and it seems that they have fallen into a dangerous state of ambivalence. Well, I guess that's it as far as the peaceful reform goes, for which I guess we all hoped will take place.

You know its bad when the people have given up hope of hoping for change, a truly sad episode in Iran.

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i think its a matter of time before the "guardians of the revolution" get their ass kicked out of office by a real revolution which has its roots from the streets!

Maybe it will give hope to other countries in the middle east!

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My relatives tell me that there is a stir of hate that grows bigger everyday.

People see the west and lust for its freedom of expression. Iranians are mostly secular.. they dont give a shit about islam or similar bullshit. They want to live in s society that should resemble 2004, not 1454.

Its come to the point that people reject religion al together. They mullahs forcefully fed them Islam, and they are sick of the same shit they have to obey.

Its backfired beyond their control.

What i hope to see is the mullahs hung in public like they did to others.

DIE ******S!!!!!!!!!!!

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i know a couple of iranians, and they are most secular, just like most of us here. yes, they are "moslim", but they dont care about praying 5 times a day, ramadon, mecca. they just live normal lives. everytime they talk about the government, its always, "those fucking bitches" "that f***er ayatollah" "the government hate america, but many people love america, they like music and american movies."

quote:

People see the west and lust for its freedom of expression. Iranians are mostly secular.. they dont give a shit about islam or similar bullshit. They want to live in s society that should resemble 2004, not 1454.

thats true. if a country is run by an islamic theocratic government, expect to be living the 15th century for a while. under islam, there are so many pointless rules to follow, that social, and technological progression is severely hindered. example...afghanistan-taliban....iran-ayatollah

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Well, I'm glad that the posters here who come from the muslim coutnries despise the regime as much as we all do, but it seems that the voter turnout was a bit higher than expected because not all liberal parties decided to boycott the elections.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mi...ast/3508735.stm

Well, I guess we'll have to wait a while more for the revolution to happen

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1+1=10

I think the USA should actively support the protesters who want a fair and free liberal democracy in Iran with whatever means necessary

If not I fear it will just prolong the conflict. The USA helped rebels of eastern block countries after the fall of the USSR and it sped the reformation of those nations into democractic nations - Poland and Ukraine for example.

Then too the world was against Regan's active support for the protesters, but he supported them anyway. I believe it is time to do the same in the muslim world.

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quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus I think the USA should actively support the protesters who want a fair and free liberal democracy in Iran with whatever means necessary If not I fear it will just prolong the conflict. The USA helped rebels of eastern block countries after the fall of the USSR and it sped the reformation of those nations into democractic nations - Poland and Ukraine for example. Then too the world was against Regan's active support for the protesters, but he supported them anyway. I believe it is time to do the same in the muslim world.

Well, Ukraine is not really the most free country. Remember those stories about anti-regime journalists being killed? Not to mention the state of liberty in the rest of the Soviet Union.

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1+1=10

quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus I think the USA should actively support the protesters who want a fair and free liberal democracy in Iran with whatever means necessary If not I fear it will just prolong the conflict. The USA helped rebels of eastern block countries after the fall of the USSR and it sped the reformation of those nations into democractic nations - Poland and Ukraine for example. Then too the world was against Regan's active support for the protesters, but he supported them anyway. I believe it is time to do the same in the muslim world.

I'd rather some other country or coalition of nations tried to help the people of Iran. The Iranians themselves need to play as big a role as possible in bringing about a new regime, to ensure that the new government will have the support of the people. If it was the U.S. that was involved, I think many people would assume the U.S. had an alterior motive, and the chances of the new government having popular support would be dramatically reduced.

quote:

Originally posted by Arbiter I'd rather some other country or coalition of nations tried to help the people of Iran. The Iranians themselves need to play as big a role as possible in bringing about a new regime, to ensure that the new government will have the support of the people. If it was the U.S. that was involved, I think many people would assume the U.S. had an alterior motive, and the chances of the new government having popular support would be dramatically reduced.

I agree that any overt U.S. involvement in the ouster of ANY regime in the middle east right now, especially Iran is a big mistake. All it would do is strengthen the fundamentalist ideologues elsewhere such as Pakistan, Turkey, or Indonesia.

I do believe that the proverbial hand is writing on the wall as far as the theocracy lock on power in Iran goes. In a country which well over 50% of the population (I believe it is closer to 70%) is under 30 years old and has no memory nor any direct connection with the root of the revolution that overthrew the Shah, there is bound to be the seeds of discontent. Most of the people who were the revolutionaries in the 1970s were under 30 as well and were angered by the abuse of their rights by the Shah's government.

The Reform movement in Iran has pretty much lost their bid to remove theocratic control through the system and it is likely that within the next couple of years we will see them resort to a more direct and, sadly, more violent means of tweaking the system.

I think that the roots of democracy are already there in Iran and that a forceful removal of the supreme authority of the mullahs with their palaces and pampered lifestyles will bring about a system that is much more moderate and stable than any other country in the region.

As long as external pressures are not used to prop up a regime i believe the system can be one in which the people are free and accountable for their own actions be they good or bad.

US meddling will only create blowback. Cold War containment of the communist expansion is the cause of the situation as it is today in much of the middle east and south america. Blowback is hell.

MrS

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-"Reality" is the only word in the language that should always be used in quotes.

I have a strange feeling that these Iranian elections will be VERY simular to the "Iraqi elections" that occured about a year ago.

I believe Saddam had about 96% of the vote

I just hope the educated, young people of Iran will have the guts and intelligence to stand up for themselves and reinstitute a secular government like was done with the Shah. It's too bad all of those European-influenced Iranians of "long ago" aren't still in the country.

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It has to start sometime,
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