quote:

Originally posted by Marc Summers Trancer-X... Do me a BIG favor, and stop posting links and videos... Why don't you research yourself?

I don't owe you any favors and I currently don't have time to write a thesis. Sorry

If you don't like the videos then stop reading my posts, stop complaining, get off your ass and do some research yourself! Have you ever thought of that?


And Shakka, maybe you folks could try to refute what I'm saying here with something other than selective character assassinations when they conveniently support your cause.

You make a MAJOR GENERAL out to be some kind of whacko because he believed in something (as did a whole cadre of scientists at Stanford, where the research initially began) which is obviously too hard for you to comprehend while a President who says that God told him to invade Iraq gets a free pass? Hmmmm.

Anyway, there are a lot of things that we as humans cannot fathom. We just THINK that we know everything while in fact we all clueless in terms of the big picture - just some of us a lot more than others.

Here's a LINK to Stubblebine's Stargate project since you brought it up. I don't know what to think about it other than that it's quite interesting. I can't prove or disprove the plausibility/feasibility of it and neither can you.

Last edited by Trancer-X on Jun-28-2007 at 00:46

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Originally posted by Trancer-X LOL - okay, but it's okay for the government to destroy most of the evidence at the crime scenes, block any independent investigation and then when the victims families become too outspoken as a result, they have a whitewash committee (the Kean/Zelikow Commission - with Zelikow being a Bush Administration insider) which does a hack job of creating a 500+ page joke of a report after barely even doing any real investigating into the attrocities of 9/11. They didn't even include any of the testimony from the first responders who witnessed explosions - pretty damning if you ask me.

im not defending the government's position here, i am merely asking for articulate and plausible explanations that are essential to making the "no plane pentagon" theory hold water. i notice you STILL haven't provided me with as much as a guesstimate

ahhh, "explosions". what exactly do you think a building that has been hit mby a big fucking plane to do? take it like a man? of course there would be subsidiary explosions! there are so many items in a building that can cause explosions that id be surprised if people didnt hear them. this does not, on any level, equate with evidence of demolition explosives. indeed, there are a number of reasons why explosives of any kind could not have been used. the nature of explosives precludes them from being used in the way you and other theorists presume.

ask our friend "colonelcrisp" to give you a nice little lecture on how explosives are used to bring down buildings. i would also like you to note that a building has never been demolished in the way the WTCs came down. demolitions occur from the bottom up, NOT the top down.

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Originally posted by Trancer-X Ummm, amazingly, it was even on the news that the FBI went to every business, hotel, service station, etc., immediately after (only minutes after) the incident and collected all of their surveillance tapes. What rock have YOU been hiding under? I understand that Attorney Scott Hodes has been our biggest asset in trying to obtain those tapes through the Freedom of Information Act. His website is here

mate, you didn't answer my question. i asked you to provide evidence that the FBI had FOOTAGE. not that they had tapes that could really show anything. this assumption that they have all of these tapes that clearly recorded the blast is just that, an ASSUMPTION not supported by any evidence. this is just another red herring from the truthers.

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Originally posted by Trancer-X Actually, if you take a moment to watch the news feed I posted a few posts ago you'll get to see and hear one of those witnesses for yourself. No disingenuity at all! Also, whoever said it was a Tomahawk? I don't remember anyone saying that. From what I gather from eyewitness testimony which has described it as a small passenger plane at best, it was probably something more like a Global Hawk or perhaps some other prototypical unmanned aerial vehicle and not a Tomahawk. Even if it was, they're really not too hard to spot especially given the high pitched whine of their engines. There have been plenty of witnesses in the past who have seen Tomahawks fly by after we've sent them to wreak havoc their countries.

the general consensus on truther websites ive seen make comments of tomahawk missiles. i didnt mean to put words in your mouth. again, i would like to know why you find a level of ambiguity in an eye witnesses' accounts, when they clearly experienced a jet flying over their head and crashing into the pentagon? there is a much greater reason to believe an average person could recognise that occurence without ambiguity than there is to people that reckon they saw a missile. there are HUNDREDS of people that say they saw that plane. i need to know why you dismiss them out of hand?

quote:

Originally posted by Trancer-X I think you're missing the whole point. There was no real investigation just like there was no real debris (other than the subterfuge which was scattered after the coverup crew arrived on the scene), no bodies, no engines, etc. Nothing remained, not even a magical/indestructible terrorist passports like the one that allegedly survived the WTC's jet-fuel fireball.

ahhh, there are no coincidences in CT land! there was indeed a real investigation. and there are indeed parts of the plane's engines in there. im surprised i need to post these photos for you.

link





here's a site with a whole bunch of other photos of obvious plane debris

pentagon crash debris

no bodies or personal effects? hmmmmm.

quote:

"During an interview earlier this week, Koch delicately handled eerie mementos of the crash found during cleanup: Whittington's battered driver's license... a burnt luggage tag and a wedding ring lie on a book dedicated to those lost in the events of Sept. 11, 2001. The wedding ring belonged to Ruth's daughter and the luggage tag belonged to one her granddaughters."

quote:

“Suzanne Calley died aboard American Airlines Flight 77 when terrorists hijacked the plane and sent it crashing into the Pentagon... Rescue crews were able to pull Calley’s body from Flight 77’s wreckage. link Jensen [Calley’s husband] spent last year’s anniversary of the national tragedy in Washington, D.C. There, a Pentagon official - assigned to Calley’s family as a liaison - gave Jensen his wife’s wedding ring, which had been recovered from the plane.” link

quote:

Originally posted by Trancer-X A 60 ton plane - vaporized. I'm sure that David Copperfield is quite envious.

um, to be honest trancer, im unaware of what you would expect a plane that hit a reinforced concrete building to do? we havent seen similar occurences happen, so im wondering where you get the assumption that there should be more wreckage available? by what reasons do you make such an assumption?

and im still waiting to find out what REALLY happened to the plane, crew & passengers.

edit: i particularly like the part where you say the engine wasnt from a 757 so the government went to all that trouble yet couldn't even plant proper evidence? come on these arguments are getting ridiculous.

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Yet still nobody wants to even attempt to answer any of my questions. Just repeat the story and continue to throw more bullshit on the fire. But so-and-so said it in an official, spiffy looking youtube video. And he said it in an angry voice no less! By jove it must be true!

exactly my problem. none of these crazy theories (or their followers) can provide simple and concise answers to questions they should already be able to answer if they're going to buy these ridiculous lies. not having an answer to where the plane REALLY went isnt good enough. its bordering on the pathetic.

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Last edited by pkcRAISTLIN on Jun-27-2007 at 23:40

quote:

Originally posted by Trancer-X And Shakka, maybe you folks could try to refute what I'm saying here with something other than selective character assassinations when they conveniently support your cause. You make a MAJOR GENERAL out to be some kind of whacko because he believed in something (as did a whole cadre of scientists and at the CIA Stanford, where the research initially began) which is obviously too hard for your little mind to comprehend while a President who says that God told him to invade Iraq gets a free pass? Hmmmm.

Don't fucking lecture me on a MAJOR GENERAL. You piss in the face of far more 2 and 3 stars when you essentially call them liars by believing selective information provided by one guy who has been refuted by many as a kook when there are far more that believe and support the official argument. For your information, I come from a military family. The relative I refer to is a fucking retired MAJOR GENERAL who was in a meeting in the E-Ring on 9/11 no more than 150 yards from the impact zone for fuck sakes. Gimme a break. Spare me your pompous bullshit.

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Don't fucking lecture me on a MAJOR GENERAL. You piss in the face of far more 2 and 3 stars when you essentially call them liars by believing selective information provided by one guy who has been refuted by many as a kook when there are far more that believe and support the official argument. For your information, I come from a military family. The relative I refer to is a fucking retired MAJOR GENERAL who was in a meeting in the E-Ring on 9/11 no more than 150 yards from the impact zone for fuck sakes. Gimme a break. Spare me your pompous bullshit.

lol

I love it when you get angry. Anywhow, I'm a blood relative of FIVE STAR General and fmr President Eisenhower, so whatever. Like that really even makes any difference.

Sir, yes sir - at least I know that you come from a strong military family. It's definitely reflected in your illiberal bias here.

I'd like to know why one of the biggest crime scenes in tyhe history of crime scenes was cleared so quickly. Oh yeah, and what did they have to hide under the tarp?

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka Don't fucking lecture me on a MAJOR GENERAL. You piss in the face of far more 2 and 3 stars when you essentially call them liars by believing selective information provided by one guy who has been refuted by many as a kook when there are far more that believe and support the official argument. For your information, I come from a military family. The relative I refer to is a fucking retired MAJOR GENERAL who was in a meeting in the E-Ring on 9/11 no more than 150 yards from the impact zone for fuck sakes. Gimme a break. Spare me your pompous bullshit.

here, here!

Here's a former Colonel speaking out for you, Shakka

quote:

Originally posted by Trancer-X I'd like to know why one of the biggest crime scenes in tyhe history of crime scenes was cleared so quickly. Oh yeah, and what did they have to hide under the tarp?

so, all these men and women are also in on it? sheesh, this must be the biggest conspiracy (in terms of number of actors) in the history of the world. coz we all know the larger the conspiracy, the easier it is to keep quiet!!

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quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN so, all these men and women are also in on it? sheesh, this must be the biggest conspiracy (in terms of number of actors) in the history of the world. coz we all know the larger the conspiracy, the easier it is to keep quiet!!

Gee, I wonder how they've been keeping all of the thousands of scientists, military personnel and military contractors quiet about what goes on in Area 51 all of these years. LOL. Just like Area 51, probably just about everything about it is classified and sealed under the guise of National Security.

I wonder how they kept the CIA's MK Ultra program quiet for all of these years?

http://www.frankolsonproject.org/So...st,%201975.html

It's amazing how efficient the mainstream media is at filtering the news. Only a few select items ever really get by them and when they do, they're quickly swept under the rug.

Last edited by Trancer-X on Jun-28-2007 at 00:48

You know TX, I am related to a former chief justice and secretary of war. My bloodline is better then you!!

Edit: And I am also a little bit related to the King of Spain. So HAHAHAHA

theres a fundamental difference in motivation between classifying supposed sensitive information and covering up the murder of thousands of fellow americans. these scientists and investigators are just regular people after all.

and we're all still waiting to find out where the plane really went mate! also, nobody has ever explained to me the reasons for firing a missile at the pentagon if planes had already crashed into the WTCs??? what advantage did the administration get by bombing its own building? these theories make NO sense.

edit: it would certainly be impossible to claim a plane hit the pentagon if there were dozens of investigators going over the crash site. you just cant lie about stuff like that.

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Ignorance is bliss, eh? There's just a never-ending wave of personal attacks here on people who speak out to find the truth. Complete disregard to the Pilots movement, an independent movement which CONFIRMED using the black box data that it didnt come from the object that hit the Pentagon. Also, instead of accepting the truth, some people here are offering poor arguments and telling to stop linking videos, and instead ask to do their own research ... thats is just blatantly lame excuse to ignore the information at hand. Some people actually think that we can just drop everything, families, jobs, every-day routines and waste our time writing some research on this thats already done? Christ. To achieve what, Summers? Come on, thats just so silly of you. Isnt finding the videos, information, articles, interviews, photos, etc. is not doing research? Gimme a break.

The evidence against the government story of the Boeing 747 got a final hit in the arse by this clear Pilots for Truth movement, using evidence that doesnt lie. Black box that came from the alleged 747 plane itself.

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