quote:

Originally posted by Kismet7 SO I can go to Barnes and pick up a Hip Hop album in the Electronic Music section? Rock music uses a kick drum so does Electronic music, zomg its all Electonic musics? NM useless argument.

Hip hop has its own section because it's so huge. If they put hip hop in the electronic section it would drown out all the house, trance, techno, etc. because it's so popular. Not to mention the fact that many listeners of four to the floor dance music despise hip hop, and vice versa -- a good marketing incentive to keep them separate.

How many regular trance nights are there in LA, by the way (not just DJs passing through)? If there even are any, I bet you $100 that there are at least twice as many house nights and four times as many hip hop nights. Want to take me up on that?

How many clubs do you see that bill themselves as playing trance, outside of a few European countries? I see plenty advertising house and hip hop, but none advertising trance except when the occasional big Euro DJ wanders into town.

The fact that some random person has the occasional poppy trance track on MySpace means nothing. People have poppy house on their MySpaces, too. It doesn't mean that those people are regular listeners of trance or house.

Last edited by MrJiveBoJingles on May-12-2009 at 05:16

quote:

Originally posted by SGL Making electronic music involves technology & multicore provides ease and less headache for the ones taking advantage of it. Why don't you go back to the stone age and rediscover the wheel & use that to go around...instead of your car or taking the public transit? Your comment about ableton will be laughed at by all those who use it. Let me on the other hand laugh at you for complaining why Reason doesn't have vsts. You claim you knew bout sound engineering. Do you realise that reason's instruments are designed like hardware and allow routing via cables. If you were to include a 3rd party vst, like Albino3, how would you route for example a 'matrix' to the 'cv' inputs of Albino3 (there aren't any)..or better yet, how would you even get Albino3 to route to the mixer. Do you really think Rob Papen, Native Instruments, Arturia, etc.. are going to come out with a Reason compatible version? Cubase has an inbuilt audio editor, where you can mangle the wave sounds, does FL have it? I like both software. They each have something to offer the users. So, let's not start the 'this is better than that' argument. Also, if i can remember clearly, you said you make make better music than someone else on this thread. Which is why I'm still waiting for your 'better than someone else's' track? Then we can all decide if it's groundbreaking. Fair enough?

Because mutlicores are useful doesn't mean that they are the majority of the market for audio PCs. Stop blowing shit out of your ass, your comment has absolutely no connection to my statement about multicores.

People won't make reason compatible vsti because the "routing" you do in reason is just a gimmick. Has no basis what so ever for how real DAWs work. And the synths them selves are mediocre at best. Also, FLStudio has better routing options than reason.

FLStudio has 2 inbuilt audio editors.

As for my music, a lot of good it will do for people who think Tiesto is the bomb. You want to argue about your opinion on what sounds better? Fine: http://tindeck.com/users/cronodevir

___________________
i'm the alchemist without the cyst without a doubt out of the mist
dig out the grout expose the pest to take it out without the rest

they will attest my patients restorations from the best

i'm from the west i'm not an acmeist only the alchemist

quote:

Originally posted by SGL If you look at my comment again, you'll notice I didn't make a statement about mediocrity. So learn to F***ing read. First of all, I don't make trance. So I don't exist in that deparment you're referring to. Also, stop putting words in my mouth. My whole argument was to raise the bar and challenge yourself. You're just putting what i said in differnt words. The way your 'trance' will prosper is not by breeding a new generation of djs/producers. Oh please! We already have too many of those nowdays. What matters is talent and for labels to pick out those talents and sign them instead of the mediocre stuff. I don't look upto Tiesto. And even if i did, what's wrong with Tiesto? Are you jealous of him? And about your last paragraph about how we have alot of outplayed, overused stuff.....well, that's why the term 'underground' exists, NO? You're just another tard like that other guy. Maybe you guys should become best friends. Or maybe you already are...haha.

By new generation I mean a new thought process towards the music that is made and put through their mixers. Right now it's driven by self promotion (in order to climb the djmag poll) and to make money (stupid for this genre). I agree with your statement about labels picking out the good stuff. Everything starts and ends there. If theres less crap put out, more people will like the genre and songs wont come and go every 2 weeks as they do currently.

As far as Tiesto, it is well documented he is a sell out, doesn't produce his own music, is an atrocious dj, and he even has gone as far as to press play on pre recorded sets for his gigs. People see him as the epitome of trance when he is the epitome of what is wrong with trance. I dislike AvB's style of trance, I think its fluffy, but I really admire and look up to the guy. You can tell he truly loves his music and what he does, and he is very humble and true to himself. He has been a pioneer. This is a guy I really can't stand listening to as my version of trance is very different than his, but there is a level of respect and admiration about how he got to where he is and the fact its obvious he is doing everything for the right reasons. People like Tiesto, Oakenfold, etc, are tainting this industry and the thing is because they are the most mainstream names, the genre is grouped around how they go about business. To someone like myself that could care less about releases, money and fame from my music; this kills me. Do what you do get your paper, I respect them as businessmen, but not as artists. And certainly not as performers. I grew up on "Just Be" and "Bunkka", they were good stuff and I still enjoy them because of the nostalgia that none of this would be possible for me if I hadn't heard them. But the deeper you get into this game the more corrupt you realize it is. There are so many sell outs, fakes, and assholes...it sickens me. But that is my motivation for this. Get to the top and give the people heartfelt music directly from my pen so to speak. I know everyone wont like my music, it's impossible to make them all happy, but I know everyone should see it for what it is. That's all I can ask for really.

Trance is not dead, it just could be far bigger than it is.

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Hip hop has its own section because it's so huge. If they put hip hop in the electronic section it would drown out all the house, trance, techno, etc. because it's so popular. Not to mention the fact that many listeners of four to the floor dance music despise hip hop, and vice versa -- a good marketing incentive to keep them separate. How many regular trance nights are there in LA, by the way (not just DJs passing through)? If there even are any, I bet you $100 that there are at least twice as many house nights and four times as many hip hop nights. Want to take me up on that? How many clubs do you see that bill themselves as playing trance, outside of a few European countries? I see plenty advertising house and hip hop, but none advertising trance except when the occasional big Euro DJ wanders into town. The fact that some random person has the occasional poppy trance track on MySpace means nothing. People have poppy house on their MySpaces, too. It doesn't mean that those people are regular listeners of trance or house.

But what does any of this have to do with the points that were being made when you brought hip hop? I said Trance is the biggest genre in popularity (obviously in regard to electronic music), it has a huge following and sells out clubs worldwide, therefore it does not need to change for a vocal and misguided minority on TA. And then you came in...buh buhbubhbuh HIP HOP is popular too. Really? The topic is electronic music though. And what does improving Trance have to do with the popularity of hip hop? So like I said, useless argument, because even thought hip hop might be as popular or apparently more popular if we are going by MTV, it was really pointless point to make towards the discussion.

That said, electronic music is much larger than you think it is, your television set doesnt tell the story about what is going on around the world.

If Hip Hop is far more popular than Electronic Music, than people in EU would wear it on their sleeves through websites like Myspace. Do this Test...go to myspace, Browse foreign countries profiles for the age group 20-29, you will find an equal if not more people with an electronic piece of music on their myspace over hip hop.

My own test netted 5 people with Electronic music on their profile 0 hip hop.

This after quickly going to about 10 myspaces. So where are all these hip hop listeners in the EU.

My browse was Bulgaria 20-26 Female.

Bulgarian women

___________________
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commercial and underground electronic music (house/techno/trance/other) will surpass today's hip hop/pop/rock/country in worldwide interest...if it has'nt already.

quote:

Originally posted by cronodevir As for my music, a lot of good it will do for people who think Tiesto is the bomb. You want to argue about your opinion on what sounds better? Fine: http://tindeck.com/users/cronodevir

i just think you shouldn't knock ppl for presets when you use cheesey old orchestral soundfonts and stock FL drums. and don't say how the technical side is soooo easy when you're where you are on the technical side.

as for the trance sound.. i don't like where it's at at the moment, i do like deadmau5's prog sound, i prefer his older electro stuff, but i don't like when people try to merge that sound with trance. I liked when trance was fast, heavy, driving yet melodic.

i love watching the overall evolution of EDM though and introduction of new sounds and styles. I love all of it from Benny Benassi to Trentemoller to Deadmau5, all people who have introduced new sounds and ideas. I like the new melodic minimal like Stephan Bodzin, to the new dark minimal like Gaiser. From the new fidget house sound like Kyle Watson, to the new chopped sound from Justice. Their heavy electro style is interesting, but what i really love .is their melodic daft punk funky old school sound

its all good really. it will all evolve.

___________________


https://soundcloud.com/ghostea stuff

Last edited by mysticalninja on May-12-2009 at 06:54

quote:

Originally posted by Kismet7 ::sigh:: If trance sucks, no one would show up to the clubs, arenas and festivals. Only the smalllll very smallll misguided vocal minority like yourself sees Trance as sucking. You guys are specks in a sea of sand, nothing, meaningless, borderline nonexistent. The fact that anyone tries to coerce others to believe a genre of music sucks shows how little you know about music, about culture, the world outside of your walls. Your argument is full of error. Take Trance music to new heights? Where do you want to take the most popular and most listened to Electronic Genre? Techno and House right now could'nt hope to go further back in history to bring out the past. Progrsesive House was actually an era where the music was going somewhere, and then people scrapped that and said we want to go back to Minimal, Detroit Techno, Dub Techno, Cosmic Disco. Is anyone complaining? Whenever people stop listening to trance, that is when it will suck, until then, outside your walls, millions of people listen to trance everday and enjoy it. I wont and have'nt heard a consecutive hour of trance in years, but i'm not going to diss the music consistently as some do here on TRANCEADDICT.com of all places. Only lame people sit there consistently bashing a genre of music. MUSIC, seriously? Its music, an inanimate object, a non threatening object, yet it gets bashed as if it is fucking the people who bash it in the ass. Why so mad? Why so sad? I think PsyTrance is the most mindless piece of garbage out there, the worste form of Trance, yet where is the bashing? Might as well listen to Gabba. But I wouldnt spend more than 3 minutes of my life to tell people I think it is garbage (they should already know it is LOL), because all it is music. MUSIC, something that doesn't hurt you or anyone physically, culturally perhaps if the lyrics motivate people to do certain things, but if you don't listen to it, its not doing anything to you. So why are you fighting shadows? People have their subjective tastes. If you guys want to be Sadists, go bash society ruining, Pop, ROck, and Hip Hop music. There pieces of music that are literally fucking up minds and making your little sisters want to slut around or sip some drank or buy some shitty piece of clothes that was made for pennies on the dollar in China, so why waste time bashing Trance? Go make your voice heard where it can impact society positively. I can go on, if you want quality music that is well made, why not listen to some House or Techno then? Does the music you listen to have to have SuperSaws and 136-140 BPMs with epic breakdowns? Why try to change a genre that millions are enjoying, when what you could be using your energy to find music you actually like. If you think she is a hoe, why you turning her into a housewife? Move on to something better, its out there.

I never said the genre sucks. I stated it is far worse then it could be. Where would I like to see trance? As a GLOBALLY accepted artform that is at a minimum appreciated by the greater population. Currently it is the ugly red headed step child of music. People don't respect it, because the face of it in the people at the top is not a good representation of the genre itself. People are going to enjoy the music based on whatever the people at the top put out. They need to realize that once you make it it is imperative that you become even more cautious with what you release and play as it is put under a microscope and drives the industry as a whole. The fans of trance will be fans of trance regardless. It's just the content could be better. They're getting a skewed view of the genre. I mean it doesn't make sense that all of these dj's at the top play nothing but unreleased tracks. Isn't the goal to get the good music to the fans? Then why play things the fans have no access to? Yes you will hold on to your spot at the top longer because you're playing so called "hits" before they become available to the public, but you're only hurting the industry by doing so.

If you haven't listened to much trance lately then why the fuck are you commenting here? You have no clue what you're speaking about. I go through id say 80% of all trance released on beatport. Out of that, I find about 40 songs a month that are of the caliber that SHOULD be being released. The digital era has made things even worse. The label explosion has really made things tough to make good stuff get to the top. It will still get there, but it takes much longer now than 10 years ago.

And as far as you stated about other genres. Same thing as it is with trance. Hip/hop and rap were my two biggest influences growing up. The lyrical content is all gone now. There are so few good artists now it really sucks. I rarely find good albums anymore. It's all about the next catchy club hit and bling bling instead of knowledge, pain, humor, and slick rhymes. The internet era has been a huge hit to all forms of music just based on it being so easy to get your music out there now. I refuse to go to nightclubs in my city because this is all that is predominant. A bunch of clowns being told what to play and whats hot. Diversity and individuality is being discouraged. All of the real acts are being put at a supreme disadvantage because of the media hyping the charts.

I want to change a genre millions are enjoying because the bar has to constantly be raised. It is stagnant right now. I can say progressive trance is the single good thing that has happened to the trance scene as of late. It is pushing the envelope and combining several different genres into its epicenter. I appreciate this much greatly. I LOVE house and techno as well, it doesn't mean I have to settle for whats being given to me by the people at the top in trance. It is being shorted pf its potential at the moment, and there are very few acts that are being true to themselves and their fans. Music is a powerful weapon, that is being consistently taken advantage of these days.

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles They use the same sequencers and same sort of equipment we do. How is that not electronic? Nope. There is this illusion because you have a few trance DJs that are really, really big and able to pull a massive crowd, so they make the scene look more popular than it actually is. But in reality more people are listening to house. The "superstar DJ" thing in trance is just a leftover from the late '90s when trance temporarily blew up really big.

Finally someone with a logical statement. Correct you are. Trance is not flourishing. Just ask the professional producers here making jack off royalties.

So, Kismet7, how many regular trance nights are there in LA? If you wanted to find a trance club and a house club, which one would be easier to find there? How about a trance club versus a hip hop club? And if you were in Germany, would it be easier to find a techno party or a trance one? If you were in France, would it be easier to find a house party or a trance one? The only countries where you might have an easier time finding trance nights would be the Netherlands and UK -- and maybe not even there.

Does that tell you anything, or are you still going to harp on the fact that Tiesto and Ferry can still draw a big crowd because they never stopped running on momentum from the dot com bubble days?

quote:

Originally posted by Kismet7 SO I can go to Barnes and pick up a Hip Hop album in the Electronic Music section? Rock music uses a kick drum so does Electronic music, zomg its all Electonic musics? NM useless argument. And the thousands of people I see playing a Trance song and not a House song on their myspaces? Im talking about randoms, why are they playing Trance instead of House tracks? Surely if House was more popular, it would have reached these randoms that have a Trance song in their playlist next to their pop and hip hop. Why don't House Acts sell out huge arenas if more people listen to House, dont people have the same passion for music to go out and listen to the music they enjoy live? Where is your proof?

Because generally speaking house djs are more true to themselves and their music. They don't need to sell out or demand ridiculous amounts of things from clubs to play there. I believe house producers/djs are far truer to their music than trance. The fact Tiesto can pull 50k from an event sickens me. The people who need to hear the music most just aren't able to ship the 60 bucks to pay for a ticket. Only the fortunate are.

However, the unfortunate are the ones that need music most. People can go to an intimate club setting, pay 20 bucks to see a great show and go up and meet the dj and have a word with them. It's just much more personal and you can tell the vast majority love what they do.

quote:

Originally posted by mysticalninja i just think you shouldn't knock ppl for presets when you use cheesey old orchestral soundfonts and stock FL drums. and don't say how the technical side is soooo easy when you're where you are on the technical side.

Ive never used a sound font before. All the Orchestra stuff Ive used is Garritan Personal Orchestra... I have also never used stock FL drum samples, I have however used drum samples ripped from very common loops, such as aligator bugalo, amen break, and funky drummer.

___________________
i'm the alchemist without the cyst without a doubt out of the mist
dig out the grout expose the pest to take it out without the rest

they will attest my patients restorations from the best

i'm from the west i'm not an acmeist only the alchemist

^ And that is the difference between the house scene and the trance scene. House is about more intimate venues, not giant arenas that cater to a DJ's ego. People think trance is "big" because a tiny percentage of its DJs can draw a nice crowd, but they never stop to think about the fact that maybe house fans don't want to be crowded into an arena with 50,000 other people. Trance has a cult of the DJ that fools people into thinking it's far more popular than it actually is.

quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles So, Kismet7, how many regular trance nights are there in LA? If you wanted to find a trance club and a house club, which one would be easier to find there? How about a trance club versus a hip hop club? And if you were in Germany, would it be easier to find a techno party or a trance one? If you were in France, would it be easier to find a house party or a trance one? The only countries where you might have an easier time finding trance nights would be the Netherlands and UK -- and maybe not even there. Does that tell you anything, or are you still going to harp on the fact that Tiesto and Ferry can still draw a big crowd because they never stopped running on momentum from the dot com bubble days?

I remember Armin saying during his ASOT 400 broadcast in an interview with the club owner in Birmingham, UK that he was very happy with how the night turned out so special as the club there (and most of the clubs there) are house clubs. Trance nights seem to be thrown in monthly-ish as special events, they are not very consistent anywhere.

In almost any major party city in the us, house rules supreme, and it's not even close. Even trance meccas like Miami and NYC are more house friendly than to trance.