i can't be arsed to read the whole thread, lotsa opinions on this one but check it from this point of view: mp3 is just a new factor that all music business industry must deal with (even if it may not be a very fair factor). lightning didn't deal with it correctly and went down. simple as that. i do believe many labels may become bankrupt due to this "new factor" but what shocks me is that bonzai was first. how in hell can smaller labels be out there still, putting out vinyls nobody knows cuz armin/pvd/ferry/tijs/whoever does not play, and still survive, while bonzai who had regularly dozens of tunes played by all the big folks doesn't survive

i feel something's wrong in this story, it's a conspiracy i tell ya!

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Originally posted by PaRaNoIk0 but what shocks me is that bonzai was first

wrong, what about Global Underground? plenty of other labels have gone bust or had their major label backing withdrawn, in the UK labels like AM:PM (released Armin - Communication here) have gone, same with Manifesto.

The other thing is plenty of small labels stop operating all the time but nobody knows if they haven't heard of them, surely.

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Originally posted by gaz@influential Well I do (know the figures) and plenty of tracks make more for the label via compilation licensing than vinyl sales.

i did not know that. i didn't seem very logical to me either, as i've always thought these labels mainly target the club scene (dj's), and not the one or two trance fans there are among the rest of the population.. i guess the repercussions mp3 has on the trance industry are bigger than i thought..

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Originally posted by gaz@influential wrong, what about Global Underground? plenty of other labels have gone bust or had their major label backing withdrawn, in the UK labels like AM:PM (released Armin - Communication here) have gone, same with Manifesto. The other thing is plenty of small labels stop operating all the time but nobody knows if they haven't heard of them, surely.

hey mate, firstly nice interview @ ivibes & Looking forward to ur set on tranceairwaves this week

I own lots of cd's on labels from past years, and have like Manifesto ones, AM:PM and the like, and it is sad to see that only really positiva about atm, and they've probably only managed so long because of the commercial side of their music. With these labels gone, it's increasingly hard to buy singles on cd like I used to Lightning maybe have a lot of publicity cos of who they are, but labels are shutting a lot more than just them, the only thing I'm unsure on, how much of an impact do mp3s really have, i've not seen anything to show me conclusive proof, and not just blaming bad management on mp3s, and finally, BT's latest ad if you seen it, the one with the woman saying she has broadband to download music and has more on her hdd than on cd's, surely these companies could do more, it seems ok for them to sell their products for downloading music, but the moment sum1 downloads the song, they're in the wrong

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Originally posted by ferrycorstenfan hey mate, firstly nice interview @ ivibes & Looking forward to ur set on tranceairwaves this week I own lots of cd's on labels from past years, and have like Manifesto ones, AM:PM and the like, and it is sad to see that only really positiva about atm, and they've probably only managed so long because of the commercial side of their music. With these labels gone, it's increasingly hard to buy singles on cd like I used to Lightning maybe have a lot of publicity cos of who they are, but labels are shutting a lot more than just them, the only thing I'm unsure on, how much of an impact do mp3s really have, i've not seen anything to show me conclusive proof, and not just blaming bad management on mp3s, and finally, BT's latest ad if you seen it, the one with the woman saying she has broadband to download music and has more on her hdd than on cd's, surely these companies could do more, it seems ok for them to sell their products for downloading music, but the moment sum1 downloads the song, they're in the wrong

Glad you liked the interview mate

About that BT ad, I completely agree. The music industry definitely needs to do something about advertisements like that rather than attacking the users.

The add basically condones freely breaking copyright law to try and sell their broadband product, not right surely??

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Originally posted by tor8024 i did not know that. i didn't seem very logical to me either, as i've always thought these labels mainly target the club scene (dj's), and not the one or two trance fans there are among the rest of the population.. i guess the repercussions mp3 has on the trance industry are bigger than i thought..

Probably 95-97% of all vinyl goes to DJ's to play at clubs. The rest go to enthusiasts who really like the music and want to hear it outside the clubs. The same goes to CD's. It used to be (for me anyway, before I started DJ'ing) that I'd go clubbing/raving on the weekends, and buying CD's would give me something to listen to during the week. This is the market that's being afected, as it's a big source of income for labels from licensing fees. MP3 downloading takes away the need for many enthusiasts to go out and buy those CD compilations and mixes, thus gravely affecting their bottom line.

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bought global cd.dvd today.....very nice compilation.

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Originally posted by gaz@influential Well I do (know the figures) and plenty of tracks make more for the label via compilation licensing than vinyl sales. If labels are only selling 2000 copies of a track (which is a good figure) when you take into account pressing, publishing, remix fees etc, there isn't much left..

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Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

quote:

Originally posted by gaz@influential Well I do (know the figures) and plenty of tracks make more for the label via compilation licensing than vinyl sales. If labels are only selling 2000 copies of a track (which is a good figure) when you take into account pressing, publishing, remix fees etc, there isn't much left..

Also enjoyed your interview Gareth, and anticipate your set on tranceairwaves. So it seems that you say here that CD compilations make more for the labels (and ultimately the producers?). So overall, do you believe that CD compilations are the ones that are most affected by MP3 downloads? Is there really much damage done, therefore, to vinyl sales from MP3 singles?

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Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

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Originally posted by gaz@influential Glad you liked the interview mate About that BT ad, I completely agree. The music industry definitely needs to do something about advertisements like that rather than attacking the users. The add basically condones freely breaking copyright law to try and sell their broadband product, not right surely??

Yeah, it seems ok that BT can use it in their marketing ploy 'u can download lots of music' but the moment someone does the blame goes to that person, it's like offering a person on a diet an icecream then telling their instructor at fat camp they had it, so I think they have a more responsible attitude to take before ppl who dl them are solely blamed

Ian

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Originally posted by MisterOpus1 Also enjoyed your interview Gareth, and anticipate your set on tranceairwaves. So it seems that you say here that CD compilations make more for the labels (and ultimately the producers?). So overall, do you believe that CD compilations are the ones that are most affected by MP3 downloads? Is there really much damage done, therefore, to vinyl sales from MP3 singles?

Just to take your first point, I wouldn't say it's *always* the case that compilation licensing makes more money for labels, but it definitely can happen - getting tracks on big compilations (in the UK these are typically by Euphoria, Ministry of Sound, Gatecrasher, Godskitchen) certainly is a lucractive earner, which people need to bear in mind before saying "dance music is safe from mp3s because of vinyl".

On your second point, I think we've got to be very careful when assesing the impact of mp3s one way or another. As there are a number of other factors also contributing to the falling vinyl sales (for example, and bear in mind I'm only referring to the UK here: declining DJ culture, declining popularity of trance, lack of trance records getting on the radio), it's very difficult to know which factors are having the most effect.

However what I will say is that other genres that don't have massive mp3 swapping communities, ie: techno, drum & bass, house, are still just about getting by. Trance labels are being hit harder than any other and trance is by far the most commonly traded dance music genre on the net. I draw no conclusion from that fact, but will leave that to you

Glad you liked the interview