to be clear...I'm angry at the strike mentality in those sectors...I don't think anyone is overpaid.

People make the jobs in both sectors seem a bit more "simple" than they really are...but I also don't think anyone in either sector (except new teachers) has reason to complain about their earnings.

anyway, what I was talking about has nothing to do with evaluating the income of employees...it's that public trasportation and non-post secondary eduation should be deemed essential services. Witholding your labour from an employer, causing that employer greif...that's one thing. witholding labour that affects not only your employer, but directly, negatively and immediately impacts the number of people it does when school boards and TTC or Go stike...that's not acceptable, IMHO.

I get our ATU Union newsletter every month & in it they post all the ongoing contract negotiations from various other transit systems from all over North America...Some transit systems and from smaller cities.The hourly pay for drivers & mechanics would be lower because those cities are cheaper to live in....Boston pays MORE then here per hour & in U.S. funds but apparently its expensive to live in that city & its a big city...Just a trend that I notice whenever I read that newsletter...


Now instead of bashing a TTC driver who makes $24 an hour...How about lawyers making $200 to $300 an hour...now THAT is obscene ...Politicians working half a year and then get a FULL pension for working a term or 2 ( I forget which) on office....Why is it that no one bashes the overly rich yet when someone (like a bus driver) tries to make a descent living & trying to keep their head above water then he's OVERLY paid???

___________________
"Kiss them for me...for I may be delayed."

nah, I don't buy that comparison

1. Most lawyers (today) have 3-4 years undergrad, 3 years of law school, bar exam...minimum. That's assuming no other related training, grad school, etc. Education/training requirements of a TTC driver PALE in comparison. Not that education and training necessarily justifies higher pay...but those requirements for a lawyer automatically shrink the available labour pool of lawyers vs. who can be trained to be a TTC driver.

2. The liability a lawyer faces, and the duty of care owed to a client, can be substantial too. Even if their clerks slave away and "do most of the work", it's the lawywer who is on the hook and constantly in need of being careful of what they do and do not do. TTC drivers, by way of vicarious liability, have little to worry about in comparison...even if a driver is overtly negligent, isn't it the TTC who would sued? The driver might lose their job, but they're not in danger of being personally sued, disbarred, etc. as a lawyer might be.

I'm probably going to hell for defending the legal profession, lol...but I think lawyers get a bad rap all too often.

Politicians need to be paid well. Think about it...why would someone, eg. as a lawyer, professor, etc., become an MP or enter the public service sector at all, when they can make far more in the private sector? We need to have a pay scale substantial enough to entice the right people into those positions...corruption...well, that's another issue.

quote:

Mar. 30, 2005. 01:00 AM TTC strike called unlikely Union, board still negotiating Friday morning legal strike date KEVIN MCGRAN TRANSPORTATION REPORTER TTC chairman Howard Moscoe says he's confident the transit service and its unionized workers will reach an agreement, but probably not in time for Friday's legal strike/lockout date. "There won't be a strike, there'll be a settlement," Moscoe said. "But not necessarily by the deadline, because we're working our way through 160 some-odd clauses. Each one takes hours." The Toronto Transit Commission's contract with its 8,000 employees expires at midnight Thursday, meaning at 12:01 Friday morning the members of Amalgamated Transit Union Local 113 will be in a legal strike position. The union said it won't strike as long as negotiations are productive. GO Transit said yesterday in a news release that it would try to accommodate more passengers if there is a strike. Earlier this month, the TTC workers voted 99 per cent against a five-year offer that included a 2 per cent wage hike in each of the next three years, and included benefit improvements for eye care, dental work and life insurance coverage. The union wants the TTC to beef up its pension contributions and to be more lenient on schedules. A TTC bus driver earns from $18 to $24 an hour. The union also represents administrative clerks, who at the low end start at about $16 an hour, and maintenance crew like mechanics, machinists and technicians, who at the high end earn about $28 to $30 an hour. Union president Bob Kinnear could not be reached for comment while the two sides carried on with negotiations last night.

source:
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Co...ol=968705899037

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Palm Trees > Pine Trees , Sand > Snow

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT nah, I don't buy that comparison 1. Most lawyers (today) have 3-4 years undergrad, 3 years of law school, bar exam...minimum. That's assuming no other related training, grad school, etc. Education/training requirements of a TTC driver PALE in comparison. Not that education and training necessarily justifies higher pay...but those requirements for a lawyer automatically shrink the available labour pool of lawyers vs. who can be trained to be a TTC driver. 2. The liability a lawyer faces, and the duty of care owed to a client, can be substantial too. Even if their clerks slave away and "do most of the work", it's the lawywer who is on the hook and constantly in need of being careful of what they do and do not do. TTC drivers, by way of vicarious liability, have little to worry about in comparison...even if a driver is overtly negligent, isn't it the TTC who would sued? The driver might lose their job, but they're not in danger of being personally sued, disbarred, etc. as a lawyer might be. I'm probably going to hell for defending the legal profession, lol...but I think lawyers get a bad rap all too often. Politicians need to be paid well. Think about it...why would someone, eg. as a lawyer, professor, etc., become an MP or enter the public service sector at all, when they can make far more in the private sector? We need to have a pay scale substantial enough to entice the right people into those positions...corruption...well, that's another issue.

i would agree with you on this. thats just the way it is.

___________________
TECHNO IS THE BEST NOISE ON EARTH.
Save Techno - Stop Minimal / Tech-House

quote:

Originally posted by MarkT nah, I don't buy that comparison 1. Most lawyers (today) have 3-4 years undergrad, 3 years of law school, bar exam...minimum. That's assuming no other related training, grad school, etc. Education/training requirements of a TTC driver PALE in comparison. Not that education and training necessarily justifies higher pay...but those requirements for a lawyer automatically shrink the available labour pool of lawyers vs. who can be trained to be a TTC driver.

Hmmmm....lets see....I apprenticed for 5 years & then wrote my exam for my Technicians license ST (both Truck/Coach & Car) ...I invested like $10,000 on tools & have to upgrade each year AND take courses/training for the latest technology that comes around such as electrical/multyplex systems,fuel systems, transmission, Natural gas training, drive train alignment,Braking systems, A/C systems & diagnosing ALL that shit when it craps out.Now I will have to take more courses with the new Hybrid buses that the TTC is getting soon.On top of that I have to get a physical every 3 years for my CZ drivers license & rewrite my CZ every 3 years as well...PAY for all my licenses when I have to renew them...AND be surrounded my various cancer causing agents & injuries (I hurt my back BADLY 3 years ago)...PLEASE....a lawyer's salary should be around MINE & I should make 100 to 200 bucks an hour....

___________________
"Kiss them for me...for I may be delayed."

Insider info here:



The staff at my location we're issued strike passes so they can pass the picket lines so it doesn't look good even though the media says differently




We'll see

___________________
"Kiss them for me...for I may be delayed."

awww, you know I was refering to drivers and ticket agents, not the mechanics and electricians

It would be silly to consider trade work any less "educated" or valuable than a profession...particularly licensed tradespeople who by the nature of their work have to continuously upgrade their skills (it would be nice if more workforces had the same requirements).


hopefully those passes are just a precaution

TTC upper managment...believe me....I'm not that far off

___________________
"Kiss them for me...for I may be delayed."