[blayzinyo] that's not right
[melIy] i read it through, and im starting to believe file sharing is damaging
* bakemono talks his balls off
[bakemono] file sharing is tight
[melIy] its not fatal, but definitely potentially damaging
[bakemono] why waste ur money on this stuff
[bakemono] when its free
[bakemono] right here
[melIy] heehee
[melIy] thats really what it comes down to
[melIy] but now that ive heard stories about people dropping set rips and shit into sets
[melIy] that just isnt right




I think this kind of typifies the kind of thinking that is damaging to record labels through mp3 file sharing. Though I dont have all the money in the world, i still do buy many things i download (if by many you mean three or four a month) but I would never spin a set rip or anything like that just so i could be first....that is just cheesy to me

quote:

Originally posted by gaz@influential On your second point, I think we've got to be very careful when assesing the impact of mp3s one way or another. As there are a number of other factors also contributing to the falling vinyl sales (for example, and bear in mind I'm only referring to the UK here: declining DJ culture, declining popularity of trance, lack of trance records getting on the radio), it's very difficult to know which factors are having the most effect.

Very true. This is something that I've wondered about as well as read on a number of other boards: the decline in popularity of trance overseas. I feel this has had a direct impact on the lack of popularity of trance here in the States. At least it seems to influence it's ability to catch on over here in some ways. Do you agree? Oh sure, you'll always have your DJ Micro, George Acosta, and so forth who will continue to stay true to their tastes in trance here in the U.S., but the popularity of House, Tribal, Prog., and even some D&B has continued to rise here without the ability of Trance to do the same.

[/QUOTE] However what I will say is that other genres that don't have massive mp3 swapping communities, ie: techno, drum & bass, house, are still just about getting by. Trance labels are being hit harder than any other and trance is by far the most commonly traded dance music genre on the net. I draw no conclusion from that fact, but will leave that to you [/QUOTE]

Last question for you and then I'll leave you alone: Why do you think Trance has been hardest hit with MP3 file swapping? Is it because of its commercialization? Ironically, perhaps this is one of the reasons why the popularity of Trance in the UK has decreased somewhat (i.e. overkill). Thoughts?

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

quote:

Originally posted by MisterOpus1 Last question for you and then I'll leave you alone: Why do you think Trance has been hardest hit with MP3 file swapping? Is it because of its commercialization? Ironically, perhaps this is one of the reasons why the popularity of Trance in the UK has decreased somewhat (i.e. overkill). Thoughts?

I'd say it's because most tracks are released as vinyl only and only a fraction of us (okay, maybe more here on TA but generally) actually have decks.

I would buy a lot more CD's if I could have full versions of tracks on a disc... these radio edit collections just don't cut it.

___________________
Latest releases:
Endless Cycles [Capital Heaven]
The Charlatan [Morphosis]

quote:

Originally posted by MisterOpus1 Last question for you and then I'll leave you alone: Why do you think Trance has been hardest hit with MP3 file swapping? Is it because of its commercialization? Ironically, perhaps this is one of the reasons why the popularity of Trance in the UK has decreased somewhat (i.e. overkill). Thoughts?

Hard one, but my best suggestion is that trance, as one of the most futuristic music genres, seems to attract (or at least has in the last few years) tech-savvy mp3 using fans. It's nothing to do with commericalisation IMO - obviously, yes, a totally underground genre won't have a massive mp3 scene, but house is just as commerical as trance in the UK and that doesn't suffer the same problems.

I think it comes down to this. Back in 1998/99 people heard new trance in a club, that was the place to hear new music. Then they went to record stores, listened to, and bought the music they liked. But the key point was, the primary listening was done out clubbing on nights out - AS IT SHOULD BE. Music sounds a lot better in a club than on some desktop speakers. In house, d&b, breaks etc, people still hear most new tunes out.

Yet somewhere down the line, trance became *the* dance genre for the internet community. This now means that most people don't hear new trance in clubs - they hear it on mp3s, on live rips, on Armin's ID&T show, on net broadcasts, etc.

This for me has had two main reprocussions (going slightly OT here, but interesting none the less):

a) People are much more critical about trance than before. Fact is most half decent dance music sounds great in a club, but it has to be AMAZING to sound great on your home PC. For example, the big tunes a few years ago, ie: Binary Finary - 1998 were loved by pretty much everyone, without exception. But these days you never seem to get such universal love for tunes, because the internet community is so incredibley critical, even about things you wouldn't notice in a club: "Hmmm the hi-hat programming isn't quite perfect".

b) Clubs are less fun because of increased amounts of people knowing the music that's getting played. Gone are the days of whole rooms of people going properly mental, oh no, there's also a few geeks around the edge going "No way man, I've had this tune on mp3 for like three months, how behind is he?!". Big club tunes stop being big clubs tunes sooner than before and DJs often end up playing crap tunes, just because people don't know them.

So yes, in a way, trance is a victim of its own popularity. People becoming so obsessive about trance, and trance tunes, has in effect taken a lot of the fun out of the genre.

(all completley IMVHO and a bit deep)

Thoughts??

its slowly disappearing up its own arse in other words

Trance Will Eat Itself

quote:

Originally posted by gaz@influential Hard one, but my best suggestion is that trance, as one of the most futuristic music genres, seems to attract (or at least has in the last few years) tech-savvy mp3 using fans. It's nothing to do with commericalisation IMO - obviously, yes, a totally underground genre won't have a massive mp3 scene, but house is just as commerical as trance in the UK and that doesn't suffer the same problems. I think it comes down to this. Back in 1998/99 people heard new trance in a club, that was the place to hear new music. Then they went to record stores, listened to, and bought the music they liked. But the key point was, the primary listening was done out clubbing on nights out - AS IT SHOULD BE. Music sounds a lot better in a club than on some desktop speakers. In house, d&b, breaks etc, people still hear most new tunes out. Yet somewhere down the line, trance became *the* dance genre for the internet community. This now means that most people don't hear new trance in clubs - they hear it on mp3s, on live rips, on Armin's ID&T show, on net broadcasts, etc. This for me has had two main reprocussions (going slightly OT here, but interesting none the less): a) People are much more critical about trance than before. Fact is most half decent dance music sounds great in a club, but it has to be AMAZING to sound great on your home PC. For example, the big tunes a few years ago, ie: Binary Finary - 1998 were loved by pretty much everyone, without exception. But these days you never seem to get such universal love for tunes, because the internet community is so incredibley critical, even about things you wouldn't notice in a club: "Hmmm the hi-hat programming isn't quite perfect". b) Clubs are less fun because of increased amounts of people knowing the music that's getting played. Gone are the days of whole rooms of people going properly mental, oh no, there's also a few geeks around the edge going "No way man, I've had this tune on mp3 for like three months, how behind is he?!". Big club tunes stop being big clubs tunes sooner than before and DJs often end up playing crap tunes, just because people don't know them. So yes, in a way, trance is a victim of its own popularity. People becoming so obsessive about trance, and trance tunes, has in effect taken a lot of the fun out of the genre. (all completley IMVHO and a bit deep) Thoughts??

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

quote:

Originally posted by gaz@influential Hard one, but my best suggestion is that trance, as one of the most futuristic music genres, seems to attract (or at least has in the last few years) tech-savvy mp3 using fans. It's nothing to do with commericalisation IMO - obviously, yes, a totally underground genre won't have a massive mp3 scene, but house is just as commerical as trance in the UK and that doesn't suffer the same problems. I think it comes down to this. Back in 1998/99 people heard new trance in a club, that was the place to hear new music. Then they went to record stores, listened to, and bought the music they liked. But the key point was, the primary listening was done out clubbing on nights out - AS IT SHOULD BE. Music sounds a lot better in a club than on some desktop speakers. In house, d&b, breaks etc, people still hear most new tunes out. Yet somewhere down the line, trance became *the* dance genre for the internet community. This now means that most people don't hear new trance in clubs - they hear it on mp3s, on live rips, on Armin's ID&T show, on net broadcasts, etc. This for me has had two main reprocussions (going slightly OT here, but interesting none the less): a) People are much more critical about trance than before. Fact is most half decent dance music sounds great in a club, but it has to be AMAZING to sound great on your home PC. For example, the big tunes a few years ago, ie: Binary Finary - 1998 were loved by pretty much everyone, without exception. But these days you never seem to get such universal love for tunes, because the internet community is so incredibley critical, even about things you wouldn't notice in a club: "Hmmm the hi-hat programming isn't quite perfect". b) Clubs are less fun because of increased amounts of people knowing the music that's getting played. Gone are the days of whole rooms of people going properly mental, oh no, there's also a few geeks around the edge going "No way man, I've had this tune on mp3 for like three months, how behind is he?!". Big club tunes stop being big clubs tunes sooner than before and DJs often end up playing crap tunes, just because people don't know them. So yes, in a way, trance is a victim of its own popularity. People becoming so obsessive about trance, and trance tunes, has in effect taken a lot of the fun out of the genre. (all completley IMVHO and a bit deep) Thoughts??

Damnit, I'll get these postings right sooner or later!

You're right, that is deep, but extremely interesting nonetheless. Not everyday I get to pick the brain of a touted trance dj/producer.
Although I understand everything stated, I can't completely relate to it all, primarily because I think geographical location plays a little bit of a role somewhat here in the States, at least for me in the Midwest (i.e. Bible-Belt). Places like NY, LA, Miami, D.C., and all over Europe may have incredible big-name resident DJs, and the criticisms of their music may run more freely. But those resident DJs merely tour through where I live (Kansas City) 1-2x/month, so I don't necessarily hear the critics as loud. Even though we have a number of good resident DJs who do a great job keeping up with current chunes, it's hard to critize that which is not as readily available. Beggers can't be choosers I guess. Even if I've already heard the chune on the internet before they drop the needle on it for the first time, I'm still not one to criticize (unless they play old overplayed stuff like Operation Blade or DJ Jean's - The Launch, then it's open season on flaming!).

I agree with you completely about the popularity of Trance due to the internet. But I wonder if other genres that are popular here in the States will share the same fate - i.e House, Prog., Tribal, etc. My split personality loves all sides of electronica dance music, and I've diversified myself a great deal over the past couple of years. But my heart in many ways still belongs to Trance, considering it really threw me into the scene a few years ago. I would hate to see my other loves (Prog./House/Tribal/D&B/Breaks) take the same beating that Trance is currently going through with MP3 file swappers. Do you forsee this happening?

One other thought I've had for some time now: the future of Trance. I had a notion a while back that Trance would evolve into a completely different beast, one that will combine a number of elements of House/Prog. and mutate into a combination of different genres. Lately, this seems to not only be true in a number of songs coming out, but also in the mixture of music that big-name DJs are starting to play. Tiesto's sets lately have taken on a Progressive tone as well as PVD's mixes (his 3 HR set at ClubNight 3/1/03 is an absolute gem of a mixture of music!). Do you see this as well? And if so, is this mixture of Trance/House/Prog. a result of the problems true Trance music has been experiencing lately? Lastly, hey, where do you see yourself taking Trance?

Alright, now I'm really done with the questions! Seriously, a great pleasure to have this conversation with you.

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...