DigiNut - Sep 9 '05 "What many people in this thread are referring to as "trance" is just bastardized trance - saccharine, syrupy, mind-numbing uber-hyper-ultra-mega-super-saw schlock trance, slathered in commercial mayonnaise and ketchup"

That's funny!

An early post asked about using stereo track for the kick/bass. There is no need to do this as the low frequencies in a track are omni-directional. A freq of 50Hz has a wavelength of about 5meters. To split these freq over a stereo field would be pointless, because for one it would require the sound system to work harder for the same result i.e. it would require more power. The base, kick and vocal are the main staple of a mix and should be in the centre of the stereo field (in most instances) and this is another reason to use a mono track.

As for tuning, if there was no need to do it, why have a tuning knob on the 909? It's there because you have the ability to alter the pitch of the kick. it may be a basic sine wave, but it is tunable.

Now for a question.
I have read a little here about cutting below 20Hz. Human hearing range is from 20Hz-20kHz (although most people can only hear up to about 16kHz-17kHz (run a tone at different freq and try it) so why cut below 20Hz?
The only reason I can understand for this would be to conserve power used to drive the subs, but having said this most club systems would have their own cross-over's to cut below a certain freq.
Please explain...

quote:

Originally posted by skot_e Now for a question. I have read a little here about cutting below 20Hz. Human hearing range is from 20Hz-20kHz (although most people can only hear up to about 16kHz-17kHz (run a tone at different freq and try it) so why cut below 20Hz? The only reason I can understand for this would be to conserve power used to drive the subs, but having said this most club systems would have their own cross-over's to cut below a certain freq. Please explain...

I think this is to gain extra headroom, so your track can be louder.

Not sure though

I've heard frequencies below 20Hz can destroy some speakers.

not sure on this, definately high frequency can blow a speaker if it is over driven (just ask one of my tweaters), but not sure on the lows. the reason for this is that the hi's move so quicky in and out, if you put too much signal into them they are forced to work really hard and this can burn the coils out (something like that).
That is why you use a cross over in the signal flow before the amp (generally out of the xover into the amp). If using a 3-way system, the x-over allow you to set what levels go to the sub/mid/hi. Eg you might cut the low at 40Hz and allow signal up to 250/500 Hz and set the figure for the mid to cut at same250 or 500 up towhatever.
this is to protect the speaker being over driven (ie pushed past its range).
it's just the below 20Hz I don't get.

quote:

Originally posted by dj_palm u cant destroy a bass speaker with hi freqs man thats just stupid.

No shit

i was not saying that would happen, when I said 'not sure on the lows' i was refering to the previous posts about below 20Hz, and more so how it is cut from the mix... go back a page or two.

As for the tweater, my house mate was mixing and had far too much gain running through the mixer, and I told him not to do that coz it would blow the speaker. (staight out the mixer into the amp i.e. no filters - it is the DJ monitor). Needless to say I came home form work to be told he blew the speaker...

"My opinion is that no tune should have information below 30 Hz caus u cant hear it anyways and it will only destroy the speakers on clubs(maybe)."

this is what I was asking about back a bit. Earlier in the thread there was some discussion about cutting below 20Hz, now what I want to know is the reason for the cut. 1 - you can't hear it anyway so cutting has no audible benefit, and 2 - most PA's have a built in cut anyway, so the question i have is what is the reason for cutting i.e. what is the benefit??

Cheers

quote:

Originally posted by dj_palm * Low freqs will often overrun midrange and make it "change" if playd loud. I dont mean like drown the midrange, but the low freq will be a carrier and make the sound out of the midrange change a bit.

i guess this sort of makes sense - If the frequencies are in phase at some point, they will 'sum' together and it will be louder... is this what you mean? ie there would be more harmonics...

quote:

Low freqs destroys bass speakers easely.

Is this more likely on small bass speakers ie not 18" subs for example.

quote:

It uses "energy/dynamics" in the mix, uhm how to explain that, most uses copmuters for mixdowns, or atleast digital mixers which have a level peak right? if u got alot of info in low freqs u need to turn down the level so it wont distort. if u cut out the low freqs u can turn up the volum in the mix abit and get better dynamic level out of this.

That makes sense. You definately clip the signal easier with bass freq.

quote:

continuasly sub freqs makes you sleepy:, in a military tank(even when its driving in the woods and its 20 minus degrees)

Can't say i have ever fallen asleep in a tank, or been in -20 degrees.

Tomorrow 32, Sun 33, Mon 36, Tues-Fri 35 Deg (Celsius)
Summer is here!!! Crazy.

I see what your saying, and I can understand how that would occur - especially on a 2 way system with real low freq's. it would cause the air to pump so to speak

I posted elsewhere about pressing vinyl and one of the responses included a link to a vinyl cutter. This is a relative quote from that page:


Very deep base is prohibited because frequencies lower than 20 Hz would activate the resonances of your playback arm!

Just found this now, so that would be another point. At what freq is it good to cut bass? You wouldn't want to totaly eliminate the feel so my guess about 50Hz???

So in a war situation, those tanks would be rather useless? But then again the 'stress' situation would change things a little.

Now I know the reason why tanks make that much innocent victims

30 huh? OK
I think the resonance thing they misused the word, they are talking about groove depth. If your interested:here

I just want to say thank you to Dave West for this Tutorial and Digi Nut for makin this a sticky, 6 months ago when i first looked at this tut i was so lost, but now that i learned a lot, i comeback and finally make use of it, now my kicks never sounded better.

Shit! was it really six months ago? I do remember that I was a tiny, little bit drunk when I wrote the piece. Subsequently some individuals of questionable mental condition sought to give it to me right the arse - without lube, for getting it so wrong.

I'm therefore very happy to learn that someone has used the tutorial as it was intended to be - a starting point, and moved on to a greater level of whatever...

Me