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Originally posted by venomX Well if we are going to keep dealing with hypothetical here, a one that is quite probable is this one: What if you are all wrong? I am quite sure that statistically it is more probable that all the alternative knowledge people that claim aliens have visited us and/or impregnated our women and/or built all the marvels in the world and/or advanced are ancient civilizations are wrong. The chances of all the ifs that Lebezniatnikov posted are satisfied are quite slimmer than the chances of all this being wrong. And since you guys seem to only one deal with probabilities and chances, I would think it is quite compelling to think that all this is hypotheses are wrong.

We could very well be wrong on all accounts, as there is no verifiable evidence of the existence of alien organisms even at the microbial scale. But out there in space is such an unknown, there is no evidence that aliens don't exist because we havn't explored past our own Kiuper Belt.

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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov And who's to say that an intelligent lifeform elsewhere is MORE intelligent than we are? Odds are they aren't.

Come on, knowing people, how can you say that?

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Originally posted by venomX And since you guys seem to only one deal with probabilities and chances, I would think it is quite compelling to think that all this is hypotheses are wrong.

All it takes is for one hypothetical "if" to be wrong for the whole theory to fall apart. It simply isn't logically sound.

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Originally posted by noikeee Come on, knowing people, how can you say that?

I wasn't thinking of other people, I was just thinking of myself.

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Wouldn't some of these alien civilizations be advanced enough and seed other worlds, to make other worlds more favourable to life? I'd think they would be doing more than just travelling around and checking us out. Just a thought.

Also, I doubt that these advanced beings would be as selfish as we are. They would have evolved enough to forego primitive qualities like that. These beings live much longer than we do, thus they're smarter. They have a very very long history, and better knowledge ... I think.

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Originally posted by Magnetonium Wouldn't some of these alien civilizations be advanced enough and seed other worlds, to make other worlds more favourable to life? I'd think they would be doing more than just travelling around and checking us out. Just a thought. Also, I doubt that these advanced beings would be as selfish as we are. They would have evolved enough to forego primitive qualities like that. These beings live much longer than we do, thus they're smarter. They have a very very long history, and better knowledge ... I think.

See, the problem I have with this whole thread is that it is entirely speculation based on no fact whatsoever. The fact of the matter is that nothing can be proved, and until it can be, I will forever remain skeptical, because the odds of all of those hypotheticals being true is about the same as the odds of monkeys flying out of my butt.

IF I have a really large posterior and IF there exists a mutation of monkeys that are of a smaller size than normal and IF they have evolved to survive without light or air and IF I was kidnapped by the Russian mafia and IF the Russian mafia is in the practice of implanting living creatures in innocent people's intestinal tracts and IF that operation doesn't break my plumbing and IF I am able to push with a strength required to achieve a certain momentum, then yes, maybe monkeys will fly out of my butt.

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Lebezniatnikov how do you explain all these testimonies
by people who have witnessed these crafts and took videos and pictures from them?How do you explain all the millitary generals,scientists coming forward with what they have seens and experienced?

Iam not trying to force you to believe something that you dont want to believe,but at the same at least you can acknowlwdge that all these people did see something and what they saw wasnt caused by nature.

I think one of the reason why we are not seeing any big disclosure by all these people who are willing to come forward and testify on extraterrestrilas and the technology that comes with them is because it would be too much to handle by most and I doubt the multi billion dollar corporations would want that to happen either,since many of these technologies would benifit for the environment and alot cheaper to produce and would be the end of our hunger for oil.

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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov Sure, maybe they can travel quickly, but the point is, how would they even know we are here when we don't have the capability to contact them? And who's to say that an intelligent lifeform elsewhere is MORE intelligent than we are? Odds are they aren't.

The galaxy is so old, that there could have been solar systems with intelligent life (similar to our current level of intelligence) hunreds of millions of years ago.

If those civilizations managed to survive without destroying themselves, there is no telling what type of technology that have discovered over the past few million years. That level of advancement would be far beyond our imagination, so I would never say never when it comes to being able to bend space and control things like wormholes. The power requirements would be galactic...but a type IV civilization might be capable of doing such things.

We aren't even at a type 1 civilization yet, and won't reach a type 2 civilization for at least 3000 more years. That is the point where we have the technology to harness 100% of the energy of the sun with a Dyson sphere...an artificial structure built around it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyson_Sphere

A type III civilization goes beyond that...harvesting the power from multiple suns in multiple solar systems...It will be the point when the human race spreads to the edges of the galaxy. Any race that has surpassed this stage of evolution will be called a type IV civilization. There is a lot of speculation on what would happen when a species reaches this point, but at that time, it is very likely they will have unraveled most of the mysteries of the universe, and will be capable of controlling the fundamental forces of nature. They would be able manipulate space itself...and travel to distant galaxies in the blink of an eye.

We have a long way to go.

see more here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale

Last edited by Capitalizt on Nov-15-2007 at 15:10

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer Lebezniatnikov how do you explain all these testimonies by people who have witnessed these crafts and took videos and pictures from them?How do you explain all the millitary generals,scientists coming forward with what they have seens and experienced?

I admit those things are unexplainable by logic, which is both why I don't buy theories about aliens and why I think the label UFO is quite accurate. After all, they are unidentified. Coming up with colorful theories about what they might be only masks the truth when it eventually does emerge.

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This pretty sums up all the problems:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_paradox

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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov I admit those things are unexplainable by logic, which is both why I don't buy theories about aliens and why I think the label UFO is quite accurate. After all, they are unidentified. Coming up with colorful theories about what they might be only masks the truth when it eventually does emerge.

The whole problem with the discussions on extraterrestrial life is that its clear that the governments are hiding something, one way or another, the famous Roswell incident was covered up. I thought about it millions of times as to what in the world happened there. One thing for sure it was no weather balloon - the initial story released before it was retracted and changed to a weather balloon doesnt make ANY sense. This confirmed by some former high-ranking officials like Philip Corso who wrote a book on ramifications of Roswell. Why couldn't the miitary say they were testing some military equipment or that their craft has crashed?

Its possible that there are no UFO saucers in possession of the world government. Then why would the Roswell be covered up? And if flying saucers were the creation of the secret military branch, how come these were witnessed long before World War II? A lot of things dont add up. Its obvious that US government is hiding something, something thats so important to it that it had to be covered up. Its not just the communist boogeymen anymore.

If they had come clean, there would be none of this UFO crap. But they havent. So until they dont reveal these things, I will remain sceptical of their claims that extraterrestrial life hasnt visited this planet.

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Originally posted by Capitalizt If those civilizations managed to survive without destroying themselves, there is no telling what type of technology that have discovered over the past few million years. That level of advancement would be far beyond our imagination, so I would never say never when it comes to being able to bend space and control things like wormholes. The power requirements would be galactic...but a type IV civilization might be capable of doing such things.

yeah, so what they make all this wonderful technology to traverse the universe, get to earth and crash at roswell? im not buying it.

whilst our understanding of the sciences is imperfect at best, i am sceptical and think the laws of physics are a serious impediment to intergalactic travel. we don't even have any evidence that wormholes can exist in nature.

you're right though, never say never! i believe there is probably life somewhere else in the universe, but their chances of getting here are pretty slim.

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I don't believe ET has visited this planet. I believe the government has the ability to create advanced space....air crafts capable of travelling fast speeds but not fast enough to travel into outer space. What crashed in Roswell was one of these experimental aircraft. And the thing about most experimental aircraft is that they can have their funds withdrawn. So whatever was that crashed in Roswell was probably decided by top officials that it wasn't worth the money they were spending to expose themselves like that.