quote:

Originally posted by nefardec i never called it 'noise' lol.

well if it isn't music then what is it?

I see where you're coming from, but I do like System J's take on the matter more. Dance music was never made to be a work of art, a masterpiece. That doesn't take away from the fact that many producers out there work countless hours on that one track only for it to be forgotten weeks later. Dance music is made to have it's moment on the dance floor and aid to night out to whoever is there enjoying it. I don't think it's even fair to compare Daft Punk to Beethoven, yet the former is much more dear to me. Why? I don't know, I might be delusional.

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quote:

Originally posted by wotyzoid well if it isn't music then what is it? I see where you're coming from, but I do like System J's take on the matter more. Dance music was never made to be a work of art, a masterpiece. That doesn't take away from the fact that many producers out there work countless hours on that one track only for it to be forgotten weeks later. Dance music is made to have it's moment on the dance floor and aid to night out to whoever is there enjoying it. I don't think it's even fair to compare Daft Punk to Beethoven, yet the former is much more dear to me. Why? I don't know, I might be delusional.

?

that's precisely what I said...

you're misunderstanding me here. there's absolutely nothing wrong with liking daft punk over beethoven, it's just important to realize one is not like the other

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec ? that's precisely what I said... you're misunderstanding me here. there's absolutely nothing wrong with liking daft punk over beethoven, it's just important to realize one is not like the other

Oh, sorry. I though you meant that Music was somehow superior to music even though they are two completely different concepts.

I'm tired.

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Dance music is disposable mostly because it's dance music. Gebrauchsmusik, music made for some external purpose -- dancing -- rather than solely for its own sake. When people's dancing days are over, they largely forget about it.

Rock used to be like this, too, until it started having artistic pretensions in the '60s. Same thing with hip-hop and the '80s. In their beginning phases, they were both just throwaway soundtracks to dance parties for the kids, not self-conscious "art forms" pontificated about by aging critics with beards and glasses. Maybe dance music will one day enter the Bearded, Bespectacled Critic Phase one day. Maybe it already has...

The Ramones

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now back to how epic trentemoller's productions are

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quote:

Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Dance music is disposable mostly because it's dance music. Gebrauchsmusik, music made for some external purpose -- dancing -- rather than solely for its own sake. When people's dancing days are over, they largely forget about it. Rock used to be like this, too, until it started having artistic pretensions in the '60s. Same thing with hip-hop and the '80s. In their beginning phases, they were both just throwaway soundtracks to dance parties for the kids, not self-conscious "art forms" pontificated about by aging critics with beards and glasses. Maybe dance music will one day enter the Bearded, Bespectacled Critic Phase one day. Maybe it already has...

I completely understand what you and nefardec say about the disposability of dance music but, but what i think is that not all dance music is equally disposable. I simply can't equate those modern minimal-influenced stuff with Northern Exposure 1 and 2, Orbital's Brown Album, Underworld's "Second Toughest..." or even trancier tracks like some of LSG's tunes. These kind of EDM sub-genres could be the "missing link" between the "raw EDM" and a more sophisticated kind of EDM which has yet to come. Those kind of sub-genres maybe have "snippets-of-music" (as nefardec said) and this is why they are more remembered maybe (we all know the "raving" for some of older prog, techno and trance tracks in Youtube. Will there be "raving" for some of Radio Slave's or tha majority of Kompakt tarcks etc. in 10-15 years time?)


As you cleverly said, many forms of music started as dance music. In a matter of fact, every form of art seems to proceed in a similar fashion, starting as something raw and chaotic and progressively evolving into more lawful and elaborate forms-prime example the greek ancient drama which evolved from the wild ecstatic, hedonistic dances dedicated to god dionysus. It seems that EDM started to follow a similar pattern, starting with the wild, let-loose, raw hedonism of Chicago House, adopting a more sophisticated futuristic jazzy ID with Detroit Techno, becoming spacey with German Trance and gradually going even more and more progressive, adding more complex elements, effects, layers and melodies in the process (90s progressive). All this is excellent, and instead of going into the more sophisticated and musical, you suddenly get a kind of mindless back-to-the-most-simple-and-most-stupid-disposable-form-possible with that abomination which is the post-00s so-called "minimal" and minimalistic influences in EDM in general (and IMO this is not just "raw" like Chicago House, its just plain stupid to the point that it becomes disturbing).


I don't know why this backwards jump was made, maybe the post-00s society as a whole has become stupid and this is reflected to what is hot at the moment (maybe the overall stale technocratic prosperity of post-00s western society who knows), but thing is that EDM doesn't develop this way. What is even worst, is,(like System-J said) that EDM is inherently short-lived and strongly depends on the DJ-format. AS a result, artistic development and evolution can be even more slower (even non-existent?)and consensus-dependent. Why damn people are ready to jump though in whatever is served to them? Is it because DJing is always about the new records and hence a DJ always somehow has to adapth to whatever is "hot" at the moment? (even if we are talking about "hot shit") Maybe one ends-up liking the stuff because he/she is involved with it?

quote:

Originally posted by elFreak The Ramones

Punk is good, but i prefer post-punk e.g. Joy Division, The Sound, first albums by The Cure, The Chameleons etc. i like my punk darker and more atmospheric In a matter of fact i was thinking recently to make a post-punk/new-wave DJ set lol.

Last edited by PETRAN on Nov-11-2008 at 16:51

interesting, as there are no complex melodies, lyrics, funk, more than 3 chords yet the music is still remembered and idolized by young punks today.

awaits the book you will write.

ps rock and roll hall of fame.

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Le Freak - A.D.D & Chimichurri [Techno/Tech House/Music to put on burritos.]*click bitches*

Yeah guess what, there are 3 chords in there!!!



p.s. i hope you don't try to make an analogy with the trash featured in your set (sorry!) with rock n roll or punk because i lol very hard.

Last edited by PETRAN on Nov-11-2008 at 16:58

Petran:
I don't think you're giving modern EDM much credit. Yeah, there's an annoying glut of tech-prog nonsense clogging up download sites, but there are still a number of quality albums (as in, ACTUAL PHYSICAL RELEASES!) coming out.

Plus, haven't you noticed all the love-ins for late-80s/early-90s dance music this past year? It seems there are a number of producers out there that are remembering what made the music back then so timeless and are concentrating on those sounds and ideas rather than adding yet another fart/clap/hiss track to the glut.

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Electronic Music Critic: Near-Daily Ruminations Of Music I Own, In Alphabetical Order!

the thing is PETRAN that no one cares if you laugh hard, and the sooner you realize it, you can stop living in your bubble.

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Le Freak - A.D.D & Chimichurri [Techno/Tech House/Music to put on burritos.]*click bitches*