quote:

Originally posted by brucelee6783 The point is, what you speak of is not the future of DJ'ing. It's the future of Jukeboxing. We can't seem to make this any more clear to you.

A hell of a lot of people already think DJs are just glorified jukeboxes.

Beatmatching is a mechanical process - there's no art in it*. DJing was around for decades before beatmatching, so I think this belief that it's such a central part of DJing is fairly misguided. Although I totally understand that as it's often the starting point of the learning curve it can seem that way.

Removing manual beatmatching shouldn't turn a DJ into a jukebox: there are SO many other facets to DJing... if removing manual beatmatching makes the DJ equivalent to a jukebox, then he or she is a lacking these other facets and is probably a shit DJ in the first place.


* Well actually you can do clever things by putting a beat ever so slightly in front or behind the beat and a lot of people like the sound of slightly rough beatmatching, but these things can be achieved with automated beatmatching as well

___________________
Stu Cox |

quote:

Originally posted by Stu Cox A hell of a lot of people already think DJs are just glorified jukeboxes. Beatmatching is a mechanical process - there's no art in it*. DJing was around for decades before beatmatching, so I think this belief that it's such a central part of DJing is fairly misguided. Although I totally understand that as it's often the starting point of the learning curve it can seem that way. Removing manual beatmatching shouldn't turn a DJ into a jukebox: there are SO many other facets to DJing... if removing manual beatmatching makes the DJ equivalent to a jukebox, then he or she is a lacking these other facets and is probably a shit DJ in the first place. * Well actually you can do clever things by putting a beat ever so slightly in front or behind the beat and a lot of people like the sound of slightly rough beatmatching, but these things can be achieved with automated beatmatching as well

Manual beatmatching is not what this is about. What this IS about is the operations of the DJ are slowly being removed until ultimately the DJ is left standing there doing nothing except twiddling his thumbs.

quote:

Originally posted by brucelee6783 Manual beatmatching is not what this is about. What this IS about is the operations of the DJ are slowly being removed until ultimately the DJ is left standing there doing nothing except twiddling his thumbs.

That was where it started and was something you voiced your objections to, but yeah the thread's taken a tangent after the suggestion of all-inclusive DJ software which does everything for you.

If it happens it happens... although I seriously doubt it will. Some DJs will take advantage and just leave it to do its thing, but others will find new ways to be creative which can't be done as well by a computer and those who care about the quality of the output (i.e. us) will vote with their feet.


Is there any other industry where technology has meant people end up standing there twiddling their thumbs? I can't think of any off the top of my head: in every case it just shifts the responsibilities of the worker to areas which can't be replaced by technology and the net result is usually that more gets done.

___________________
Stu Cox |

How much automation is too much?

quote:

Originally posted by brucelee6783 How much automation is too much?

I think it naturally becomes a case-by-case basis...

For example pre-recorded sets were universally rejected because 'DJing' like that is flawed in so many ways: you can't react to the crowd dynamics, plus you either have to leave the booth empty or you're near enough lying to the crowd.

So I think you can automate whatever you like until it detracts from either your or the crowd's enjoyment.

___________________
Stu Cox |

That makes sense.

quote:

Originally posted by djkatmaus Hope you have fun on that unemployment line. Time to trade in those 1200's and get a an allibi job. Oh, and tell these so called club owners they might as well close it up too, cause no one is gonna pay a $20 door charge, $10 for watered down drinks, and whatever for parking just to watch a machine DJ. What a Noob.

I do not DJ for a living, but the 'have fun on the unemployment line' comment does apply to every job that currently exists... even mine.

Eventually club owners will be out of jobs too, as virtual reality technology makes greater and greater advances. The concept introduced in The Matrix about people plugging into a virtual world (not the idiotic premise that humans are used as batteries) likely is the future of humanity. Think of how many people would love to escape into a virtual world where their greatest fantasies can come true. People would be tempted to never leave.

Many people already are addicted to technology. I know many friends who are uneasy being away from their iPhones for any significant people of time. What is the longest period of time you have been away from the internet?

Change is incremental... society and technology won't reach this future I have outlined in this thread for a while, but it is inevitable at the pace we are going.

___________________
I am the opiate of the masses.

My mixes:
****Favorite Trance Songs of Early 2012 Mix(July 2012)****
****Love & Loneliness Vocal Trance Classics Mix (July 2012)****

Last edited by Apeattack on Nov-22-2010 at 05:30

quote:

Originally posted by n3lly Can't say i haven't been tempted. But i'm hoping it'll die it's own death now over the next few days..

n3lly, if you close this thread, that is fine. We have deviated completely from the main topic, but I still think this thread has value (not 'intrinsic' value though ).

I find the topic that has dominated this thread (the long-term future of DJing) interesting, even though many do not share my views.

___________________
I am the opiate of the masses.

My mixes:
****Favorite Trance Songs of Early 2012 Mix(July 2012)****
****Love & Loneliness Vocal Trance Classics Mix (July 2012)****

Last edited by Apeattack on Nov-22-2010 at 05:28

quote:

Originally posted by brucelee6783 Too true. I'm laughing so hard my side hurts. Many people who pay to see DJ's are the same as people that pay to see bands perform live. Can you imagine paying to get into a concert and when you make it down to the front near the stage, you look up at the stage and see no real people, only automated instruments playing? YEAH BABY, MOSH TIME!!! What a joke.

This generation is used to seeing live bands performing. If live bands are slowly phased out due to less demand, eventually there will be a generation that is not seeing live bands performing.

Same concept with live DJs.

___________________
I am the opiate of the masses.

My mixes:
****Favorite Trance Songs of Early 2012 Mix(July 2012)****
****Love & Loneliness Vocal Trance Classics Mix (July 2012)****

I said:
"My belief is that the future of playing music at a club or house party will become more and more automated until one day programmers will develop software that will replace people entirely."

quote:

Originally posted by orTofønChiLd you've lost it there mate

Find a person who does computer programming for a living and has a sense for the history of technology. Ask him/her if one day computers could be developed that would make music on the fly.

The computer program would learn what you like through an iterative process. Think a much more sophisticated version of Pandora.

___________________
I am the opiate of the masses.

My mixes:
****Favorite Trance Songs of Early 2012 Mix(July 2012)****
****Love & Loneliness Vocal Trance Classics Mix (July 2012)****

quote:

Originally posted by Rodri Santos automation is not progress of future, automation = leting the computer with a playlist = crap ever, if the best club of the world starts doing this solely because of this won't be in the top 100 of clubs next year

Greater and greater automation HAS BEEN the history of humanity since the onset of the industrial revolution in the mid 1850s. Automation is happening in DJing already... why not take the concept of DJ automation to its natural conclusion?

I'm not saying that the complete automation of DJing (or 'Jukeboxing') will happen overnight. Once the necessary software has been developed, a few smaller clubs likely will try it first and the software will be refined. It could be many years before the software is good enough for larger clubs or before larger clubs are comfortable with it. Perhaps the software will make house parties more appealing since high quality mixing would now be available to everyone, driving down club business. Perhaps the automatic music production software will be developed before the automatic DJing software is good enough for larger clubs.

There are too many variables to know exactly how or when DJs will become obsolete, but I genuinely believe it will happen eventually. I may not even be alive by the time DJs are obsolete.


However, before the day DJs become obsolete, I agree with Stu Cox that DJs will utilize certain technologies as they become available in novel and unforeseen ways. DJing as we know it today may be very different in 10-20 years.

Brucelee, you asked how much automation is too much? I think Stu Cox is right when he says that "you can automate whatever you like until it detracts from either your or the crowd's enjoyment." But I would emphasize that profitability is the main reason behind the implementation of automation in any industry. Automation sometimes makes a lot of people uncomfortable and angry, but it still gets implemented because the owner feels there is a greater potential for profit. The profit is a direct function of the crowd's willingness to go back to the club.

___________________
I am the opiate of the masses.

My mixes:
****Favorite Trance Songs of Early 2012 Mix(July 2012)****
****Love & Loneliness Vocal Trance Classics Mix (July 2012)****

quote:

Originally posted by n3lly But i'm hoping it'll die it's own death now over the next few days..

Yeah, that'll happen.

___________________
Latest releases:
Endless Cycles [Capital Heaven]
The Charlatan [Morphosis]