quote:

Originally posted by culorut As for the advancements made because of this now peer reviewed paper, well it's a little obvious...to shut up the critics and let the truth about what happened on 9/11 continue to spread like wildfire.

hahahahahaahaha.

you mean it gives the poor ignorant folk a reason to clamour for a new investigation whilst the world's engineers couldn't give a shit (which is really the only reason to publish, to influence world opinion). and in this case it is a spectacular failure.

i bet i could get something published in that journal.

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quote:

Originally posted by jerZ07002 why do you care so much?

Because over 3000 innocent people died on 9/11 and thousands more are going to die because of more government lies (air quality).

The official story does not hold enough weight to convince me (and millions of others) that these people deserved to die in such a manner. It is full of thousands of holes and anyone in their right mind after looking at all the facts regarding 9/11 would be retarded for not voicing themselves.

Of course if you like having these same said government(s) which have been proven to lie and lie again to your face continue to murder your neighbours, family and friends be my guest. I will not sit back and lower my stance.

As you can tell I am the sort of person who will call out bullshit and tell anyone straight to their face. Thousands of people dying is a dam good reason to care so much, maybe you should start caring a little too.

Good enough of an answer for you? no? too bad.

quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN hahahahahaahaha. you mean it gives the poor ignorant folk a reason to clamour for a new investigation whilst the world's engineers couldn't give a shit (which is really the only reason to publish, to influence world opinion). and in this case it is a spectacular failure. i bet i could get something published in that journal.

Well then put your money where your mouth is and publish something instead of trolling.

So far I only notice ignorance in you, millions of people on a global scale continue to spread word of a truth and it continues to grow because the story fits better than the official one. Not all are poor and the majority of these millions of people are also smarter than you.

quote:

Originally posted by culorut As you can tell I am the sort of person who will call out bullshit and tell anyone straight to their face. Thousands of people dying is a dam good reason to care so much, maybe you should start caring a little too.

ok buddy, i actually live in NYC (actually jersey city, but it's much closer than canada), i take the train into the world trade center 5 days a week, and those 3000 people that died were MY neighbors. I have much more at stake in this than you, and almost everyone on this board. The thing i don't care about is stupid conspiracy theories. Since you conspiracy theorists think it's a big Bush administration plot, your concerns about these sorts of lies are increasingly becoming moot because the Bush administration has only 9 months remaining in office.

Last edited by jerZ07002 on Apr-22-2008 at 02:04

quote:

Originally posted by culorut Which is exactly what the link explains, that open source journals do usually have a publication fee. No where was anyone hiding that and this is what is called nit picking. I guess you did not bother to read the link I provided either, good one mr. engineer. As for the advancements made because of this now peer reviewed paper, well it's a little obvious...to shut up the critics and let the truth about what happened on 9/11 continue to spread like wildfire.

Open source journals are shit. Any loon can get published if they have cash and a few friends willing to "review" their article. What's the point? Can't you find a publication in a legit academic source to support such an evident theory?

REAL peer-review is anonymous - an academic will submit a paper for publication to a journal, the journal will distribute the article to a panel of editors and experts on the subject (usually more than just a few), who will then critique the article from front to back. The article will then often get published with a critique, establishing an intellectual discussion so to speak on the topic at hand.

This fails to meet any sort of academic standard for multiple reasons, not least of which it was published just because the author sought out his own reviewers and then footed the bill (where is the standard it met here?), didn't advance anything remotely new or innovative to the field, and spawned absolutely no academic discussion (probably because there was nothing new here).

Again, what's the point of digging this up? Do you really believe it advanced your cause at all? If so, please explain it to me, because I'm at a loss on this one.

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quote:

Originally posted by culorut Well then put your money where your mouth is and pvublish something instead of trolling.

yeah, like i wanna waste $600 on some shitty vanity journal.

quote:

Originally posted by culorut So far I only notice ignorance in you, millions of people on a global scale continue to spread word of a truth and it continues to grow because the story fits better than the official one. Not all are poor and the majority of these millions of people are also smarter than you.

"millions"? do you really believe that? how embarrassing.

if that's really the case, why then:

quote:

I stumbled across Quantcast this afternoon - it is a survey organisation monitoring website traffic. http://www.quantcast.com/index.jsp Now some of you may be familiar with e.g. Alexa rankings, which are somewhat opaque as to their accuracy. Quantcast is different - it is apparently both a traditional broadcast-media panel survey but also has some sites which use its software to produce web traffic figures directly. The thing I like about Quantcast is they have acknowledged the great problem with site meters and the like - cookie deletion, which can inflate the number of 'unique visitors' to a site very easily. By using traditional panel survey methods along with direct clicker-counter methods for the sites that sign up to Quantcast, their results strike me as being possibly quite accurate. So... there are a lot of websites out there. Whether or not these figures are entirely accurate cannot be said for certain. But the relative rankings I think must be accurate. And if so, they are rather intriguing. Searches conducted today, 21 April 2008. N.B. the figures relate to unique visitors from the US only, per month, for the month of March 2008. They are estimates only. Thus, think of these figures as the equivalent of the number of subscribers to a monthly magazine. I didn't just tap-tap with the Twoof, but also my primary interest, Holocaust denial and the far right, and threw in some CT sites, creationist sites and some skeptic sites of various kinds. Naturally, I included JREF as a whole and this forum does unsurprisingly very well in comparison to the overwhelming majority - heck, every single Twoof website. apologies if the formatting comes out messy. - investigate911.se less than 2000 - 911oz.com less than 2000 - 911truthcampaign.net less than 2000 - 911pressfortruth.com less than 2000 - 911mysteries.com less than 2000 - 911inplanesite.com less than 2000 - seeloosechange.com less than 2000 - loosechange911.blogspot.com less than 2000 - loosechange911.info less than 2000 - killtown.blogspot.com less than 2000 - arabesque911.blogspot.com less than 2000 - 911citizenswatch.org less than 2000 - proposition911.org less than 2000 - justicefor911.org less than 2000 - septembereleventh.org less than 2000 - philly911truth.org less than 2000 - 911eyewitness.com less than 2000 - 911revisited.com less than 2000 - 911inquiry.org less than 2000 - weekoftruth.org less than 2000 - killtown.911review.org 1,955 - 911docs.net 2,084 - forum.911movement.org 2,216 - scholarsfor911truth.org 2,348 - loose-change-911.com 2,606 - journalof911studies.com 2,606 – down from 20K in 9/07 - thepentacon.com 2,606 - stj911.org 3,000 - - 911scholars.org 3,917 - nineeleven.co.uk 4,458 - pilotsfor911truth.org 4,510 - physics911.net 4,562 – down from c 13 K in 11/07 (late spike!) - ae911truth.org 4,795 – down from c. 13K in 9/07 - Question911.com 6,256 - pentagonstrike.co.uk 6,388 - Patriotsquestion911.com 6,517 - 911blogger.com 8,591 - 911review.com 9,645 - LooseChange911.com 12,907 - 911truth.org 18,883 - 911review.org 21,674 – down from nearly 50K in 9/07 - oilempire.us 23,335 - 911research.wtc7.net 27,988 – down from 80K in 9/07 - wtc7.net 32,944 – down from c 90K in 9/07 - ufocrashbook.com 34,158 - prisonplanet.tv 53,612 - ufodigest.com 95,478 - infowars.com 178,112 - prisonplanet.com 193,527 - unexplained-mysteries.com 203,361 - paranormal.about.com 317,927 - whatreallyhappened.com 333,247 - abovetopsecret.com 580,403 - kent-hovind.com 4,953 - creationresearch.org 7,336 - trueorigin.org 11,867 - creationwiki.org 12,650 - answersincreation.org 14,659 - creationontheweb.com 15,232 - newcreation.net 24,696 - blogs.answersingenesis.org 27,175 - allaboutcreation.org 36,373 - godandscience.org 69,227 - creationmuseum.org 91,228 - answersingenesis.org 281,096 - clavius.org less than 2000 - skepticwiki.org 3,780 - skepticforum.com 5,734 - screwloosechange.blogspot.com 6,989 - publiceye.org 26,519 - skeptic.com 31,343 - bautforum.com 37,227 - atheists.org 40,086 - forums.randi.org 56,159 - talkorigins.org 110,688 - richarddawkins.net 259,187 – global = 439,489 - scienceblogs.com 840,803 – global = 1,291,229 - skepdic.com 904,646 - forum.codoh.com less than 2000 - thephora.net less than 2000 - solargeneral.com less than 2000 - germarrudolf.com less than 2000 - codoh.info less than 2000 (same for codoh.org) - theoccidentalquarterly.com less than 2000 - reportersnotebook.com less than 2000 - zampir.litek.ws less than 2000 - nazigassings.com less than 2000 - air-photo.com less than 2000 - nafcash.com less than 2000 - faem.com less than 2000 - hoffmann-info.com less than 2000 - truthinstitute.org less than 2000 - thetruthseeker.org less than 2000 - Ziopedia 2,009 down from 11,000 - normanfinkelstein.com 2,166 - kevinmacdonald.net 2,742 - overthrow.com 3,032 - globalfire.tv 3,258 - thecivicplatform.org 3,393 - historiography-project.org 3,518 - cwporter.com 3,522 - jewishracism.blogspot.com 4,273 - codoh.com 4,562 - iamthewitness.com 5,085 - radioislam.org 5,866 - zundelsite.org 6,310 2-9,000/month - jewishtribalreview.org 6,389 - vanguardnewsnetwork.com 7,428 - majorityrights.org 10.097 - vho.org 13,960 - onethirdoftheholocaust.com 14,341 shot up from 2000/month - tbrnews.org 14,418 - revisionisthistory.org 14,537 - geniebusters.org 14,577 - natall.org 14,934 - thebirdman.org 15,640 - texemarrs.com 15,700 - libertyforum.org 15,975 - aryan-nations.org 18,279 - erichufschmid.net 19,070 - thetruthseeker.co.uk. 20,978 - nsm88.org 21,857 - fpp.co.uk 22,052 – has reached 60K - heretical.com 22,554 - vnnforum.com 24,349 - jewwatch.com 26,460 - wakeupfromyourslumber.com 29,703 - amren.com 30,351 - davidduke.org 30,554 15-30,000/month - ihr.org 32,729 20-40,000/month - adelaideinstitute.org 34,677 – normally under 10,000 - americanfreepress.net 41,263 - biblebelievers.org.au 66,981 - judicial-inc.biz 76,150 - stormfront.org 101,787 - lewrockwell.com 137,083 - rense.com 387,545 The upshot: da Twoof is indeed dying. The drop off in traffic is very marked in the cases I looked at. September 2007, six months ago, would have been a natural peak anyhow, but still the fall is dramatic. Many sites have gone virtually dead, which means anything below 2000 unique visitors a month, which Quantcast can hardly measure accurately. Yes, there are still about 30,000 US residents who click on Truther websites every month - out of maybe 200,000 Alex Jones readers (casual and committed). Quantcast runs numbers for 'passersby', regulars and addicts - about 1% of prisonplanet.com's audience check in daily. That works out at 2000 hardcore Alex Jones fans. I would estimate, on the basis of these site-traffic figures, that a year ago, the audience for the Twoof, passive and active, was about 100,000. If there were ever more than that many, it would be surprising. Bear in mind that the 'passerby' traffic for many of the sites listed can be upwards of 95%. And the traffic for the 'highbrow' end of the Truth movement is simply disastrous. It doesn't seem like a lot, especially when compared to the major control group, the neo-Nazi world. There are probably about 100,000 far-right-sympathising types in the US, judging by the above web traffic, of whom a third might be passive Holocaust deniers and maybe 20,000 'committed' antisemites. Finally, just to compare with what mainstream sites look like salon.com - 2,619,395 popularmechanics.com - 2,614,195 amazon.com - 47,469,260

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=111956

are these "millions" of people not interested in following the truth online?

from 911truth.org

quote:

April '08: THANKS TO THOSE OF YOU RESPONDING! We've cut to bare bones, but are still far short of our basic budget needs--Please help all you can so we can continue to provide needed services to the Truth Movement Please take a moment right now to support the organization supporting your movement. Click Here Now to donate online, by mail, or to become a regular monthly supporter. Thank you!!

Obviously the millions and millions of people that think 911 was a conspiracy don't feel strongly enough to donate their money

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quote:

Originally posted by culorut So far I only notice ignorance in you, millions of people on a global scale continue to spread word of a truth and it continues to grow because the story fits better than the official one. Not all are poor and the majority of these millions of people are also smarter than you.

An argumentum ad populum (Latin: "appeal to the people"), in logic, is a fallacious argument that concludes a proposition to be true because many or all people believe it; it alleges that "If many believe so, it is so." In ethics this argument is stated, "If many find it acceptable, it is acceptable."

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quote:

Originally posted by culorut Which is exactly what the link explains, that open source journals do usually have a publication fee. No where was anyone hiding that and this is what is called nit picking. I guess you did not bother to read the link I provided either, good one mr. engineer. As for the advancements made because of this now peer reviewed paper, well it's a little obvious...to shut up the critics and let the truth about what happened on 9/11 continue to spread like wildfire.

the truth? your camp cant even agree on ONE COMPLETE THEORY of what you think happened.... at any give point in time since 9/11 there has been some form of controlled demolition theory coupled with thermite/thermate, coupled with low frequency energy weaponry, coupled with focused nuclear demolition, with CIA dummy planes, or rockets and chuck norris..... plus the odd flavor of the month idea..

if your idea of the truth is this jumbled and colluded i can only imagine what happens when you get 3 troofers in a room during jeopardy....

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quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN I have 3 hobbies: gaming, DJing & correcting maladjusted fools on the internet.

quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN Yeah, I’d like to know what horrible, scarring incident in your childhood turned you into such an ignorant, intellectual-hating philistine?

Another four/five posts which still cannot refute the claims made in the peer reviewed paper.

Good job gentlemen.

quote:

Originally posted by culorut Another four/five posts which still cannot refute the claims made in the peer reviewed paper. Good job gentlemen.

Why refute something I basically agree with?

The real question is why would a conspiracy theorist write something that I agree with and then pay to have it published in a vanity journal?

oh yeah, and its not a fucking "paper" you uneducated whelp. its a letter.

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quote:

ok buddy, i actually live in NYC (actually jersey city, but it's much closer than canada), i take the train into the world trade center 5 days a week, and those 3000 people that died were MY neighbors. I have much more at stake in this than you, and almost everyone on this board. The thing i don't care about is stupid conspiracy theories. Since you conspiracy theorists think it's a big Bush administration plot, your concerns about these sorts of lies are increasingly becoming moot because the Bush administration has only 9 months remaining in office.

You are mad at people for looking into why thousands of innocent people died for no reason?

Why not show your anger at your government that was warned from multiple countries that there was an attack coming well ahead of time? (FACT)

RUSSIA

www.whatreallyhappened.com/russianwarning.html

IRAN

www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/jan/24/usa.september11

FRANCE

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Repor...e_911_0416.html

EGYPT

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpa...755C0A9649C8B63



Let me guess you guys think the rest of world is lying but the same government which told you Iraq had WMD's are being honest with you on this one?