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Originally posted by brainfried I find people who identify with the right wing funny..... (Of course unless youre a wealthy powerful person) How can one support the forces opression and exploitation?

damn dude, I find ppl who're liberals hilarious. I'm not rich and I don't fall for the liberal bullshit, much less care bout the stupid shit they want to do.

I'm center right or more Republican than Conservative jus cuz there's a couple issues I don't agree with but they just say it to get the votes so don't really care.


Both parties have bundled the country up into a big sack, tossed it into the trunk of their car, and are heading for a big-ass ole cliff, just like in that movie "Thelma and Louise". The difference is that when a Democrat drives, the gas pedal is flat to the floor. When a Republican drives, he sticks to the speed limit.

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Originally posted by Cracka-X damn dude, I find ppl who're liberals hilarious. I'm not rich and I don't fall for the liberal bullshit, much less care bout the stupid shit they want to do.

Dude, you're hilarious. Not rich you say? Probably because the republicans in office don't think enough of you to give you a tax break along the lines of Bill Gates.

that's bout the dumbest thing I've ever heard and always hear from lefties. I don't make a lot from my paycheck but ever since Clinton's bitch ass got out of office, I got a tax refund and get $50 more back on my paycheck that doesn't goto the fucking government. IDK bout you but I could do a lot with $50.

The rich deserve their fucking money back, CUZ THEY MAKE MORE and the ones who've worked their asses off to get where they are don't need the fucking government taking their hard earned money. You n your "Tax Breaks for the Rich" bullshit. Bush cut taxes amd I got a fucking raise and don't have to worry bout 40something % of my paycheck to go towards govt programs.

But you'll never change, I could talk endless shit bout how bad the left presidents have been and you'd still vote for them. WHY? B/C you're too damn naive.

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Originally posted by Cracka-X that's bout the dumbest thing I've ever heard and always hear from lefties. I don't make a lot from my paycheck but ever since Clinton's bitch ass got out of office, I got a tax refund and get $50 more back on my paycheck that doesn't goto the fucking government. IDK bout you but I could do a lot with $50. The rich deserve their fucking money back, CUZ THEY MAKE MORE and the ones who've worked their asses off to get where they are don't need the fucking government taking their hard earned money. You n your "Tax Breaks for the Rich" bullshit. Bush cut taxes amd I got a fucking raise and don't have to worry bout 40something % of my paycheck to go towards govt programs. But you'll never change, I could talk endless shit bout how bad the left presidents have been and you'd still vote for them. WHY? B/C you're too damn naive.

Hmm, its a known fact that as a person's education increases, their views shift to the left. I am a very educated person. You have a chance to be too.

So you got a $50 tax break, eh? If you got a similar tax break as a wealthy person, you'd probably have $100. I don't know about you, but there's a lot that I can do with $100.

Anyway, you're probably already working as hard as the richest of the rich. If you don't think so, what do you think about 6th generation millionaires/billionaires who were born into their riches? Do you think they're scrubbing toilets or lounging on a tropical island? I personally think you are working harder than any Carnegie, Vanderbilt, or Rockafeller in this modern day and age.

Tell me, what do you think about that person who works their ass off 12 hours a day/ 7 days a week and receives a tax refund of $15? You know, that same person who can't afford housing and still believes in the American dream. I'll bet they wish they were a Rockafeller. As far as I'm concerned, its not these rich bastards "who made it" running the country, its these poor men and women who are doing the dirty work. Don't give me that shit about social darwinism to explain their situation either.

Social Darwinism is a lie. This logic doesn't account for an adequately priveledged greedy person who is dumb as fuck and can't earn a cent (oh and there are a lot of them) all of a sudden winning the lottery and becoming rich and attaining elite status. Are we supposed to believe these people are better than us because their social status has sky rocketed? Huh?

Should you respond with any misguided conservative ideas, I will refute them.

I'm referring to those who work their ass off through life(doctors in particular), go through 4 yrs of college, 4 yrs of med school, 2 yrs of residency, 4-8yrs of training in a particular field IE:Plastic Surgery. I'll agree with you bout the ppl who born into their riches.

A rich person would get far more than $100. Can you rationalize why taxes needed to be so high during the Clinton Administration?

I've yet to know of a guy who works their ass off 12 hours a day/ 7 days a week and receives a tax refund of $15? I'd like it for some ppl on this board who live in the US to post their tax refund along with how long they've been working that job.

Social Darwinism isn't a lie, well in your sense it is, but the more knowledge you have the farther you'll go. Hence, only the strong shall survive.

center left

The views on the two extreme side of the spectrum tends to be out of touch with reality and are almost closer to each other than anything else.

Im curious as to where these rich people who worked so hard for their money are? the rich became rich either from inheriting their money or from expliting the masses! capitilism is a system where by nature one person(or more) must be poor so another can be rich. and the conservatives/republicans and even the democrats support this system

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Originally posted by D'Paul The left don't necessarily oppose getting rid of tyranny abroad, but they do oppose war as a means of doing it. If I recall correctly, it was Cheney who said the US army shouldn't play peacemaker but rather protect the citizens of the United States. This is in line with the conservative ideology. I, on the other hand, as a leftist, believe the army should play both roles (although peacemaker should be only in extreme cases where all possibilities for peace have been accounted for).

Although I certainly can't claim to know what the majority of the left advocates, my personal experience both on this board and elsewhere indicates a high frequency of attitudes along the lines of "the U.S. should just mind its own business." This was formerly largely a conservative ideal, but I hear it so frequently from the left that I can't help but associate the two. In these cases, I believe the left tolerates (and hence assents to) tyranny.

There are a fair number of leftists, apparently yourself included, with a more reasonable stance, which I respect, although I frequently do not agree with its application, such as in the case of the war in Iraq. Far too often, the desire for peace results in a sort of procrastination, where the idealistic but naive peacemaker is led on by the tyrant who makes small, irrelevant concessions to give the appearence that he is interested in diplomacy when in fact he is not.

Meanwhile the tyrant murders and tortures, and deprives millions of their rights, for how long? Until, all theoretical possibilities for peace have been accounted for? Judging by the attitudes of many leftists, it seems to approach an eternity...

I do admit I was generalizing, there are plenty of conservatives who don't support the Patriot Act and other usurpations of our civil liberties as well. But my impressions from both sides show a distinct lack of respect for the value of freedom.

Cheers,

Arbiter

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Originally posted by Arbiter Although I certainly can't claim to know what the majority of the left advocates, my personal experience both on this board and elsewhere indicates a high frequency of attitudes along the lines of "the U.S. should just mind its own business." This was formerly largely a conservative ideal, but I hear it so frequently from the left that I can't help but associate the two. In these cases, I believe the left tolerates (and hence assents to) tyranny. Cheers, Arbiter

Democrats aren't the left in my book. If they are in yours, I can see where you're coming from.

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Originally posted by Cracka-X I'm referring to those who work their ass off through life(doctors in particular), go through 4 yrs of college, 4 yrs of med school, 2 yrs of residency, 4-8yrs of training in a particular field IE:Plastic Surgery. I'll agree with you bout the ppl who born into their riches.

Funny. Most people that go through a decent med school are paying roughly 30 grand per year. You find me any smart lower middle class - poor student that can afford this. The majority of people receiving an education in this country are those that can afford it. I know plenty of smart and talented kids personally that can't afford a decent college experience so they take community college courses while maintaining a full time job. With so much of their money being taken by the regressive tax breaks, I doubt they'll even manage to pay off their community college bills.

As for those who made it... Find me a person whose worked all their lives to get where they're at, having worked through being poor and filthy to becoming moderately wealthy, and can't empathize with other people trying to work their way up. I would think that this person would experience the inequality of these tax breaks and see how much easier it is for him or her to become richer after already having attained a sizeable amount of assets. Think this is you and you've worked so incredibly hard to get where you're at. Wouldn't you want to make that climb a little less strenuous for your little brother or sister?

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A rich person would get far more than $100. Can you rationalize why taxes needed to be so high during the Clinton Administration?

I guarantee you a large lot of our taxes went toward defense spending. Imagine not building 3 or 4 napalm bombs and being able to feed an extra 300 - 400 hungry people. Anyway, the only time the government has ever had fewer government employees than the previous executive regime was during the Clinton regime. So don't blame it on beaurocracy when our federal government was far more streamlined. Anyway, a lot of those taxes helped aid in the economic boom of the late 90's. BTW, every republican president over the last 50 years has raised taxes, why don't you ask them why they raised taxes exorbitant amounts?

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I've yet to know of a guy who works their ass off 12 hours a day/ 7 days a week and receives a tax refund of $15? I'd like it for some ppl on this board who live in the US to post their tax refund along with how long they've been working that job.

I point you to Barbara Ehrenreich's book, Nickel and Dimed. She uncovers countless situations where wages are insufficient to afford even the most minimal of expenses. The fact that you don't know anyone working the hours I mentioned above just proves you don't hang out with janitors, maids, factory assembly workers, the rest of the working class and homeless.

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Social Darwinism isn't a lie, well in your sense it is, but the more knowledge you have the farther you'll go. Hence, only the strong shall survive.

Knowledge is a commodity. It can be bought and sold. So are those born into middle class families who can easily afford an education more worthy of it? Its not the strong that survive, its the priveledged.

I think it's kind of funny how everybody who's young (and poor) typically starts off being left wing/democratic yet as people get older (and wealthier) the population starts shifting towards being right wing/republican. Granted left wing doesn't necessarily equate with being democratic but it's usually the case that you're democratic if you're left wing.

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Originally posted by Cracka-X that's bout the dumbest thing I've ever heard and always hear from lefties. I don't make a lot from my paycheck but ever since Clinton's bitch ass got out of office, I got a tax refund and get $50 more back on my paycheck that doesn't goto the fucking government. IDK bout you but I could do a lot with $50. The rich deserve their fucking money back, CUZ THEY MAKE MORE and the ones who've worked their asses off to get where they are don't need the fucking government taking their hard earned money. You n your "Tax Breaks for the Rich" bullshit. Bush cut taxes amd I got a fucking raise and don't have to worry bout 40something % of my paycheck to go towards govt programs. But you'll never change, I could talk endless shit bout how bad the left presidents have been and you'd still vote for them. WHY? B/C you're too damn naive.

Take a look around and see your tax dollars at work. Perhaps I should say take a look at Iraq and see your tax dollars at work.

People who make more money have to depend upon more of the infrastructure of the country to support their endeaviours. Maybe we should abolish taxes altogether and make every single government service a user-pay system. Just don't get sick, or have a child that gets sick, requires special educational requirements, don't live where it's unprofitable to deliver mail, etc.

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