Even the smallest, most minimalistic instrument that's placed into a mix should be "tweaked" the fuck out. I swear, I must have spent the last three days getting my kick & percusion right. Eq'ing even the slightest fault I could find with it. But it took three days coz I'm shit like that.

OK Damie,
I see the confusion, and I would suggest that you read different articles on how to mix. But here are a few pointers:
1. When making your sounds, be that kick or a bass or pads make sure that they're sounding the way you really want it. Don't wait for the mixing stage to 'better' your sounds. It's extremely hard to fix sounds in the mix.
2. Trance and dance as a genre are different than other types of music. Effects such as reverb, delay, chorus, phaser and so on are part of your sounds. Therefore, incorporate the effects when producing the sounds for your song.
3. Then use the sound to produce groove, melodies, atmospheric pads and so on. Basically, work on the feel and arrangement of the song.
4. After you're finished with the song and all sounds good, you rest your ears for couple of days. After that you start mixing. That incorporates:
-adjusting the levels of individual instruments
-panning the instruments
-adding more space to specific instruments by applying additional reverb
-compressing
-equalizing
-automating the mix
5. When done mixing rest your ears for couple of days
6. Then master
There you go, hope it helps a little bit.
Cheers
Deep Blue (128kbps stream)

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Yeah, thats kinda what I thought.

Music recorded by and for bands needs a different approach, Im sure most dance/trance music is mixed by its artists.
Thats just a whole part of what this genre is about

Having been hired as a recording engineer in a couple of studios, I can give you a "professional opinion" I guess...

A couple of artists who do their own mixes, off the top of my head:

Lange
BT (kicks everyone else out of the studio then does his thing)
Prince (he bitches about the way he mixed 1999 )

Their mixes are what went to vinyl.

Your tutor might be being a little old-fashioned. You're not a singer or a guitarist in a rock group, you're a sound designer and that's your art.

That being said, having assistant engineers there as extra sets of ears (each with their own perspective) makes a huge difference. Or take your individual tracks to someone who's got a zillion dollar studio and knows it backwards and forwards; you'd be surprised what you get.

I have no problem with using an engineer. It like cinema: it's the directors vision but the cameramen are for getting the shots to look right. Mixing Engineers allow the artist to complete his vision without him /her having to spend 12 hours trying to figure out why the low end is still muddy. Plus 90% of artists (at least with this kind of music) work with the engineers... its not like they "send it off to get a facelift" from the mixing engineers (that IS what they do with mastering engineers though).

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quote:

Originally posted by Naeon I have no problem with using an engineer. It like cinema: it's the directors vision but the cameramen are for getting the shots to look right. Mixing Engineers allow the artist to complete his vision without him /her having to spend 12 hours trying to figure out why the low end is still muddy. Plus 90% of artists (at least with this kind of music) work with the engineers... its not like they "send it off to get a facelift" from the mixing engineers (that IS what they do with mastering engineers though).

i think this explains it the best...

its why its so hard to produce a track (being a finished prodouct) by yourself, on a budget, much less a WHOLE album...

i wish i had the $$ to pay for a recording/mixdown session...

its like $100/hour around here for a good studio.

ah well, i suck anyway

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quote:

Originally posted by Naeon Mixing Engineers allow the artist to complete his vision without him /her having to spend 12 hours trying to figure out why the low end is still muddy.

It's still muddy because the bassline sucks, you bozo!

j/k

It's tough. I think with experience you start to figure out which instrument is 'safe' to put into a mix, that won't effect everything else. For instance, too many low frequencies, can muddy things out, and too many highs, can clutter up your song, and hurt your ears. Of course that's common sense, but I know from my countless hours of experience, that I have made that mistake, and wondered why my mixes sounded like crap.

Of course, I still need, TONS of improvement, and would like to get better 'mixing' plugins, and programs. That will come in time.

Great thread by the way! Great read!

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I used to dream about doing it all myself. But I've found that most really successful artists know how to surround themselves with a team of talented professionals. That would include mixing engineers.

I would find the sounds that are as close to what you want as possible. Even do some EQing, etc... Then let a talented pro mixing engineer take it to the next level.

BTW I love Prince's 1999. It's real rough and organic. The Oberheim polysynth and the Linn LM-1 machine. What a combo!

markus schulz does it all himself... and most artist that do infact do it all themself pride themself in the fact that they do all aspects of the track. and personally i think the more people you involed the more opions your gonna end up with and the more un-orginal the track will sound as its now not just your track but someone else opion on how its usppose tos ound however this is not allways a bad thing just is when you dont want other people fucking up your shit.... then again maybe thats why i cant produce.... or maybe its kus i dont know what anyhting means i just tweak it till i like how it sounds...... ohh welll honestly tho why pay more people to do something you can do so quit being LAZY and just figure it out its all rather logical on how to make it sound good as far as mastering i mean the only thing i was ever told was do not go over 0db.... but to answer the q. mixing would be your job if you want it to be along with being a sound engineer and everything else... anyhow just get high and fuck with it till it sounds right i guess *shrugs

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You make a good point. I'm sure this style of music is much more hands-on. Plus, the equipment available to us is now of such pro quality that many times we can forgo the SSL room and still get really good mixes.

Maybe if I was producing I'd acquire enough experience to mix it myself, and at the same time have another professional set of ears standing by while I did it - as someone to bounce ideas off and to get a second opinion.